Do the Mustang and Camaro have technical parity?

[V8 Fireworks]

Originally Posted by banksie

2023
Aero package has technical parity. All sides agreed.

The VCAT test is not sufficient to prove that 100% for all yaw angles and ride height combinations. It is still important for Supercars to send the cars for wind tunnel testing with a turntable wind tunnel, up to at least 15 degrees yaw to confirm this 100% identical performance.

Of late though, there have been suggestions again that the Mustang may be on the wrong end of an aerodynamic disparity, notwithstanding that it was seen fit after the second round of VCAT to give a small increase in front downforce to the Camaro.

On that, Rushbrook refused to confirm or deny he had any suspicions, instead reiterating his call for data transparency.

https://www.speedcafe.com/2023/06/02...percar-engine/

[V8 Fireworks]

Originally Posted by banksie

Engine parity is achieved based on the current measurements.

If regulators are making such obtuse statements like that privately it will serve only to drive Ford Performance to withdraw support of the category. If Supercars administrators have views like that, that is totally untenable.

You have to provide a red carpet treatment to your ONLY manufacturer.

Originally Posted by banksie

The problem with the 2019 VCAT was that Ford's data could never be replicated. So why would other teams have to spend money re-developing it's aero kits to match this?

Mere rumour and speculation that does not show good faith to Ford Performance and Dick Johnson Racing. Refer to the required red carpet treatment.

It is important that any political leverage of 888 Race Engineering and "Chevrolet Racing" (a proxy for 888 and not actual involvement of Chevrolet Racing?) is completely and totally dismantled.

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks

ZB engine bay vent added in 2021 was unverified. Not the same specification as 2020.

It is a ****ing air vent. Same spec as the one on the Mustang.

NOT a performance change.

Face facts, the cars were very equal post-adjustment in 2019.

Ford teams and drivers did in 2020 and then when Penske's money left, so did the organisational excellence.

The organisation now is a rabble, and doesn't deserve to win. Parity doesn't make this formerly great team run at the back.

The current CEO is fresh from destroying and AFL club, so DJR fans have only darkness to look forward to.

Meanwhile Tickford can't do anything right in race strategy and pit execution, and their 2 drivers who are capable of running up the front crash constantly.

[banksie]

Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks

You have to provide a red carpet treatment to your ONLY manufacturer.

No. That is the worst thing you could do. Everyone wants parity, don't pick favourites. Keep testing and proving/aiming for parity.

You complain that Holden/GM were given preferential treatment previously, but advocated for exactly that to Ford now. No one should be given red carpet treatment.

[V8 Fireworks]

Originally Posted by banksie

You complain that Holden/GM were given preferential treatment previously, but advocated for exactly that to Ford now. No one should be given red carpet treatment.

Chevrolet do not even compete in the series officially. The series has only one manufacturer and will lose it if they are not careful. Zero race victories is damning. Some say it is damning of the teams rather than the vehicle but the problem is this CANNOT BE PROVED as by their own admission Ford Performance have not been given the data in a transparent manner.

This lack of data transparency is unacceptable, correct?

Originally Posted by banksie

Everyone wants parity, don't pick favourites. Keep testing and proving/aiming for parity.

This does not mesh with Rushbrook's complaints for parity to be sorted before the cars debut falling on deaf ears so that he had to go to the press.

I hope they have the weighted LS flywheels ready for the AVL dyno testing with different levels of weight at the perimeter to make sure the LS engine has inertia equivalent to the Coyote.

But that is still a failure, those heavily counterweighted flywheels should have been on those LS engines already from the start of the season, no? One engine having less inertia is not technical parity.

The Blanchard Racing car doing a faster laptime with the new engine map in Practice 1 then they did for the rest of the entire weekend is also damning of the old engine map detuned by Mr. Hasted with good intentions (I agree that Craig Hasted is not biased) being way off the mark and having unforseen problems from the way ignition timing and cam angle has been reduced to reduce performance in combination with allegedly a smaller throttle restrictor than the other engine.

Originally Posted by Mixer

The current CEO is fresh from destroying and AFL club, so DJR fans have only darkness to look forward to.

Meanwhile Tickford can't do anything right in race strategy and pit execution, and their 2 drivers who are capable of running up the front crash constantly.

Such obtuse statements will just make ATCC fans turn to other forms of motorsport like Formula One, if they haven't already. At least Formula One is a competition where teams and manufactures can develop their own cars and engines to the best of their ability...

Not just tune springs, dampers, swaybars and alignment on a kit car with an expectation to "trust" the kit car is 100% equivalent in every way to the other kit car (without the manufacturer having been provided the data to prove it...).

If the Ford RBPT engine will be competitive or not it will be on them, same for the Red Bull Racing chassis.

Originally Posted by Mixer

It is a ****ing air vent. Same spec as the one on the Mustang.

NOT a performance change.

Speculation. If it was not a performance change then DO NOT implement the change.

[Ares]

Wasn't the f1 pole half a second up the road?

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks

Speculation. If it was not a performance change then DO NOT implement the change.

Not speculation, you moron.

Power steering pump failures were happening and they needed more AIR to COOL THEM

You prognosticate with such confidence but you literally don't know what you're talking about.

You quote clickbait headlines that literally go directly against Mark Rushbrook's words if you take the time to listen to the full interviews.

Mark Rushbrook's comments about "transparency" compared to other categories rely on data from TRANSIENT DYNOS that Supercars DOES NOT HAVE

That is set to include a transient dyno testing programme and torque sensor fitted to the cars.

According to Rushbrook, until that data has been collected, and shared, by Supercars, pinpointing the exact issue with the engine, or any other factors that may be affecting parity, is impossible.

“I think that comes back to the data transparency," he said when asked by Motorsport.com if the engine was the only concern.

PLEASE if you are not prepared to follow the series and know what you're talking about, shut your trap. You are repetitive, useless, and annoying.

[V8 Fireworks]

Originally Posted by Mixer

Not speculation, you moron.

You are repetitive, useless, and annoying.

Ah, the hallmarks of a coherent argument.

Originally Posted by Mixer

Mark Rushbrook's comments about "transparency" compared to other categories rely on data from TRANSIENT DYNOS that Supercars DOES NOT HAVE

Well, why ruddy not? They used them in the USA in the pre-season and Ford have some they could use. They could also have arranged to use wind tunnels with turn tables and rolling roads abroad, given the important of ensuring 100% identical performance in all situations of the aero kits and engines given technical parity instead of BoP.

[Adam43]

Thread closed.

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