Home Mobile Forum News Cookbook FaceBook Us T-Shirts etc.: Europe/Worldwide. eBay Motorsport Links Advertising  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides  
Related Sites: Classic Cars Monthly Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Historic Racing & Motorsport History > Historic Racing Today


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11 Oct 2018, 13:04 (Ref:3856108)   #1966
The Fat Clerk
Veteran
 
The Fat Clerk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
England
Mallory Park
Posts: 3,034
The Fat Clerk should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
It's like most things, people in the big cities particularly that big one 'darn sarf' think that the world begins and ends with themselves.

While in the 'real world'.......................
The Fat Clerk is offline  
__________________
Comments made are personal and dont reflect any club or Motorsport UK policy.
There are people who drive racing cars and there are Racing Drivers. Gilles Villeneuve
Quote
Old 11 Oct 2018, 13:09 (Ref:3856111)   #1967
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 31,773
Peter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
That's a very inaccurate statement. The commentators who live in the cities all think theirs is more important than others. North or South. So when talking about that article being city biased, it could be any Metropolis, the same would apply.
Peter Mallett is offline  
__________________
Nobody told me we had a communication problem!
Quote
Old 11 Oct 2018, 13:25 (Ref:3856115)   #1968
The Fat Clerk
Veteran
 
The Fat Clerk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
England
Mallory Park
Posts: 3,034
The Fat Clerk should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Mallett View Post
That's a very inaccurate statement. The commentators who live in the cities all think theirs is more important than others. North or South. So when talking about that article being city biased, it could be any Metropolis, the same would apply.
Fair enough, any city.
The Fat Clerk is offline  
__________________
Comments made are personal and dont reflect any club or Motorsport UK policy.
There are people who drive racing cars and there are Racing Drivers. Gilles Villeneuve
Quote
Old 11 Oct 2018, 13:37 (Ref:3856116)   #1969
midgetman
Veteran
 
midgetman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
England
Rural Wiltshire
Posts: 4,365
midgetman has a real shot at the championship!midgetman has a real shot at the championship!midgetman has a real shot at the championship!midgetman has a real shot at the championship!midgetman has a real shot at the championship!midgetman has a real shot at the championship!
Playing Devil's advocate.....

We haven't exactly covered ourselves in glory with the current transport system have we? Whether by train or bus or car, we actually have to go to work to cover the rising cost of going to work......madness!

(And I mean that in the widest sense - your "cheap" buses are of course subsidised by everyone's taxes so I have to work to pay for a townie's cheap buses.)

Sooooo, maybe it IS time for a complete societal change. And maybe the slow down in car sales is the start.

Motorsport as we know it is doomed. Not through regulation, but through lack of interest. We've falling grids at MSA karting but the A&D series are bulging. How long before car racing goes that way? Given that our automated Uber pods won't be able to tow a trailer we'll need someone to do it for us, and a big electric roadtrain provided by a race series organiser makes sense.

Or is sim racing our future? Race at home until you're good enough then in huge stadia watched by other afficionadoes. By all accounts, that's already happening with big money being made by "gamers".



Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk
midgetman is offline  
__________________
Midgetman - known as Max Tyler to the world. MaxAttaq!
Quote
Old 11 Oct 2018, 13:43 (Ref:3856118)   #1970
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 31,773
Peter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
As you say someone has to pay and that's really the problem with the article. It says people will be redundant so the question is; who will pay those taxes needed to subsidize the cheap transport?
Peter Mallett is offline  
__________________
Nobody told me we had a communication problem!
Quote
Old 11 Oct 2018, 14:22 (Ref:3856120)   #1971
John Elwin
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
France
Pas de Calais
Posts: 1,337
John Elwin should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Mallett View Post
As you say someone has to pay and that's really the problem with the article. It says people will be redundant so the question is; who will pay those taxes needed to subsidize the cheap transport?
I find it ironic that as the world fills up with more & more people it doesn't need, some are busy devising the means for fewer of them to actually have to do anything.

What will they do with all the spare time? Sit around chatting about 'the good old days'?
John Elwin is online now  
Quote
Old 11 Oct 2018, 15:10 (Ref:3856125)   #1972
grantp
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 4,671
grantp should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridgrantp should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Elwin View Post
I find it ironic that as the world fills up with more & more people it doesn't need, some are busy devising the means for fewer of them to actually have to do anything.

What will they do with all the spare time? Sit around chatting about 'the good old days'?
Nah, they can all become millionaire "influencers" on Youtube.

Then all of the countries involved in the WWW can claim increased GDP and the well established cycle of borrowing today to keep "the economy" going and "paying back" in the future when "inflation" has reduced the value of what is paid back can continue for a few more decades - maybe a generation or two.

What happens after that? Who knows?

Does anyone alive today (and of an age to have enough knowledge and experience to understand the issues) actually care? If so, why? They would need to be incredibly influential to document today what the "at risk" generations will only start to recognise in 30 or 40 years from now.

And, if our current experiences with that sort of social philosophy gap is any form of guidance, they will probably be wrong in the detail.

Whether they will by chance have managed to stumble upon a persuasive argument for social control that kicks the whole political management thing and economic doom a further century into the future ... will be of no interest to me by then!
grantp is offline  
Quote
Old 11 Oct 2018, 19:10 (Ref:3856148)   #1973
Colin McKay
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Colin McKay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
United Kingdom
Posts: 1,483
Colin McKay should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridColin McKay should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Two things spring to mind, neither addressed in the Beeb article (or the thinking that provoked it).



First, the tax on fuel is massive (58p per litre for petrol & diesel in the UK, plus the VAT of course) so it won't be long before a way is devised to add this to the 'cheap' electrickery, how else will we continue to fund the lifestyle of all those redundant oldskool humans?



Second, where is the electricity coming from? It takes many years to plan and build power stations/wind farms/solar farms, and decades for nuclear. Maybe Trump will open up a few more old coal mines, that will keep lots of the above mentioned retirees employed toiling underground.


Progress!
Colin McKay is offline  
__________________
Semper ubi sub ubi
Quote
Old 12 Oct 2018, 02:18 (Ref:3856180)   #1974
grantp
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 4,671
grantp should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridgrantp should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colin McKay View Post
Two things spring to mind, neither addressed in the Beeb article (or the thinking that provoked it).

First, the tax on fuel is massive (58p per litre for petrol & diesel in the UK, plus the VAT of course) so it won't be long before a way is devised to add this to the 'cheap' electrickery, how else will we continue to fund the lifestyle of all those redundant oldskool humans?

Second, where is the electricity coming from? It takes many years to plan and build power stations/wind farms/solar farms, and decades for nuclear. Maybe Trump will open up a few more old coal mines, that will keep lots of the above mentioned retirees employed toiling underground.

Progress!

For the first question I was recently told that business electricity costs (for large consumers who often contract ahead but the same sort of numbers probably apply to all consumer) currently carry an overhead of around 60% that funds costs that are not electricity actually consumed.

By 2021 it is predicted that this will become 90%.

It's paid by everyone of course. And twice over in effect since everything we buy carries an energy cost or costs in its manufacture or provision. Most of the cost is about providing the supporting infrastructure for the "green electricity generation revolution".

Once all competition or electricity generation revenue according to the economics of diverse technologies has been eliminated the government will gladly tax whatever the world will be left with with reasonable confidence that there is unlikely to be much development of new alternative options for some time to come - barring some totally unforeseen and dramatic discoveries that they could not possibly suppress.

As for question 2:

As I understand it the USA coal industry has had a recent problem of reduced domestic consumption but they have been seeking to expand exports with rapidly expanding countries like China and India presenting opportunities.

And unlike the UK, a lot of coal mines in the USA are somewhat more able to deploy better technology and, potentially, automation.

Much the same can be said for Australia.

Elsewhere in the world Nuclear facilities are being agreed, planned and built in far less time than it would take in the UK even if there was no resistance to the concept of "Nuclear".

The problem with Nuclear though is that in nearly all of the current forms it only make economic sense as base load - you have to run it all the time. In France there is some flexibility in the system - there has to be with over 70% electricity generated by nuclear - but the generation mix is very different to the UK.

If, in general, energy (all forms) becomes too expensive the economic activity we have become used to may collapse, probably globally.

At that point, when it occurs, most of the concerns that face the peoples of the world today will be of no interest at all to anyone.

I could see a huge boost for the food generation industry - which may be the only industry left and perhaps not so much an industry but an allotment of labour. Retirement will once again become a thing of the past for most people but that is little different to what is already happening today.

There are most likely some very "interesting" times ahead. Hopefully far enough ahead that I will miss being bothered by them too much.
grantp is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Oct 2018, 08:58 (Ref:3856200)   #1975
Mike Bell
Race Official
Veteran
 
Mike Bell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
England
Attleborough- 5 minutes from Snet!
Posts: 11,015
Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!
I hear that plans are in place to make the M26 a lorry park in case Brexit goes ‘terribly terribly wrong’ ....

Luckily I rarely use it, but got the impression it already was....
Mike Bell is online now  
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein)
Quote
Old 12 Oct 2018, 10:00 (Ref:3856214)   #1976
Tel 911S
Racer
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 176
Tel 911S should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridTel 911S should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colin McKay View Post
Two things spring to mind, neither addressed in the Beeb article (or the thinking that provoked it).



First, the tax on fuel is massive (58p per litre for petrol & diesel in the UK, plus the VAT of course) so it won't be long before a way is devised to add this to the 'cheap' electrickery, how else will we continue to fund the lifestyle of all those redundant oldskool humans?



Second, where is the electricity coming from? It takes many years to plan and build power stations/wind farms/solar farms, and decades for nuclear. Maybe Trump will open up a few more old coal mines, that will keep lots of the above mentioned retirees employed toiling underground.


Progress!
I believe that the total tax take on road fuels comes to about £30 billion , so they would not easily cover that with anything else .
The price of electricity has been going up a lot , it is not getting cheap , because of the cost of subsidies for wind & solar power which never produce enough to cover their own cost .
Greenpeace tried to claim that the cost of wind energy was coming down , but had to take their adverts down as it was a total lie .
https://order-order.com/2018/01/19/g...e-wind-claims/

And you are right that we cannot produce enough electricity for electric cars , let alone transport .
Max generation capacity for the country is something like 50 odd GWH , which in Winter is not enough for demand & some has to be imported via the interconnectors . Off peak demand [ 11PM to 6 AM ] has about 5 to 10 GWH spare .
To charge up just the private cars in the country , [ using lowest rate home chargers , 3.6 KWH so about 10 miles for 1 hour charge ] , would take a total generation capacity of 130 GWH . And double that if commercials went electric.

So the whole Green Loonie idea that the ICE powered vehicles will soon be finished is just pure fantasy .
Tel 911S is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Oct 2018, 11:02 (Ref:3856219)   #1977
Mike Bell
Race Official
Veteran
 
Mike Bell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
England
Attleborough- 5 minutes from Snet!
Posts: 11,015
Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!Mike Bell has a real shot at the podium!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tel 911S View Post
So the whole Green Loonie idea that the ICE powered vehicles will soon be finished is just pure fantasy .
Of course it is. Even if in 2040 only cars with alternative power incorporated somewhere in the drive train are allowed to be sold, there will be millions of Internal Combustion Engine only powered vehicles still on the road. It will take many years before they all cease to be usable....
Mike Bell is online now  
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein)
Quote
Old 12 Oct 2018, 12:05 (Ref:3856230)   #1978
bauble
Veteran
 
bauble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
England
Bedfordshire almost in Pakistan
Posts: 3,967
bauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famebauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famebauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famebauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famebauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famebauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famebauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famebauble will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Bell;38562 cease to be [B
usable..[/B]..

I would agree if I understood the word.
bauble is offline  
__________________
When asking; "Is he joking?" Best assume yes!
Quote
Old 12 Oct 2018, 12:05 (Ref:3856231)   #1979
gary396
Subscriber
Veteran
 
gary396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
United Kingdom
Northallerton
Posts: 1,937
gary396 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I'm looking forward to the day when solar panels on the roof will provide sufficient energy to power our vehicles.
gary396 is offline  
__________________
Gary Clarke
Quote
Old 12 Oct 2018, 12:16 (Ref:3856232)   #1980
VIVA GT
Subscriber
Veteran
 
VIVA GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
England
Leicestershire
Posts: 3,559
VIVA GT has a real shot at the championship!VIVA GT has a real shot at the championship!VIVA GT has a real shot at the championship!VIVA GT has a real shot at the championship!VIVA GT has a real shot at the championship!VIVA GT has a real shot at the championship!
Quote:
Originally Posted by bauble View Post
I would agree if I understood the word.
Perhaps he should have said 'use a bauble'?
VIVA GT is online now  
__________________
Incognito: An Italian phrase meaning Nice Gearchange!
Quote
Reply

Bookmarks




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Kick Those Shoes Off and Relax. It's the Delta 2017 Tea Break Peter Mallett Historic Racing Today 3917 1 Jan 2018 01:20
Iain's (Delta Racing Car) Builder's Tea Break 2015 Peter Mallett Historic Racing Today 2608 10 Jan 2016 11:28
Delta's tea-break thingy, the lighter wassname - 2013 Peter Mallett Historic Racing Today 2719 1 Jan 2014 12:38
Delta's Tea-Break Natter (The Lighter Side) 2011/12 John Turner Historic Racing Today 3787 3 Jan 2013 10:05
Delta's Tea-Break Natter (The Lighter Side) 2011 Peter Mallett Historic Racing Today 2796 21 Nov 2011 09:57


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 17:19.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2018 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.