"One of the most significant announcements in the history of the sport..."

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by david5

Because that's what I'd like to see happen, I like touring cars, not the beech buggies we have now. I don't see it happening though, I think I'm in the minority, I just like to dream.

out of all the ice creams i prefer chocolate ice cream, therfore i think all ice cream should be chocolate.

I dont need to back that statement up in anyway because i justify it by saying
I don't see it happening though, I think I'm in the minority, I just like to dream.

If you bring an opinion to the table, that fine, but surely it has some logic behind it.

I'm, sure you have some logic behind your opinion also, would you like to share it?

[Woolley]

Originally Posted by peckstar

If you bring an opinion to the table, that fine, but surely it has some logic behind it.

Nothing wrong with the logic of 'because that's what I enjoy'. A car taken off the road, made safe and reliable on the track and so having real relevence to what you can buy. Many of the non-enthusiast public believe that's what happens anyway!

[Backagain]

Originally Posted by ford71

Small correction, its a 55 Chev.

Unless there is another shoebox with a Merlin block wedged into it

Small correction, a 'shoebox' is a single spinner Ford from around 49 - 51

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by Woolley

Nothing wrong with the logic of 'because that's what I enjoy'. A car taken off the road, made safe and reliable on the track and so having real relevence to what you can buy. Many of the non-enthusiast public believe that's what happens anyway!

yes its a logical as making every one eat chocolate ice cream because thats what i prefer

[promax]

Originally Posted by Backagain

Small correction, a 'shoebox' is a single spinner Ford from around 49 - 51

50's Chevs are also known as a 'shoebox'

no doubt the nickname was borrowed from the single spinner

[ford71]

Originally Posted by Backagain

Small correction, a 'shoebox' is a single spinner Ford from around 49 - 51

More an addition than a correction, but thats OK

When I see things like this on the road I think "shoebox" as well ...

[Just Do It!]

Is today's announcement that 888 are expanding to a 4-car HRT squad to manage the Walkinshaw entity as well?

[david5]

Originally Posted by Axeman444

Careful David some opinions are not allowed apparently.

But curious, how would we get a race car that doesn't need homologation specials? isn't that sports sedans?

No I'd still have homologation cars required, but not 500 evo specials. It wouldn't have to be a big number. If we are going to have my "fantasy" series, I would have the following, car must be built from a real car shell. The arguments that it is too expensive & unsafe don't wash with me, there are many other classes worldwide that do it.

Engines must be production car based with a parity system as per 2013 regs. Control 6 speed & IRS.

Manufacturers to release, say 50 "Aero Package" homologation roadcars per model to homologate the Aero. These roadcars could run whatever mechanical package that HSV, FPR, Nismo, whoever are currently using & it gives in a real tie in to the roadcar ala GTHO, A9X etc & I would imagine they would sell pretty well too.

No doubt I'll get shot down, but as I said I can dream, enjoy your icecream.

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by david5

No I'd still have homologation cars required, but not 500 evo specials. It wouldn't have to be a big number. If we are going to have my "fantasy" series, I would have the following, car must be built from a real car shell. The arguments that it is too expensive & unsafe don't wash with me, there are many other classes worldwide that do it.

Dare I say though that the GRM Monaro fit this criteria... Its as close to a production car as many a GT3 or Grand Am car.

The safety aspect is an inescapeable fact however, you can't make a road car shell as safe as you can a dedicated racing shell.

[St00ge]

And not to mention the added costs of building using a road shell, and the added expense of repairs which take longer... The whole reason why they ditched the road shell

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by david5

No I'd still have homologation cars required, but not 500 evo specials. It wouldn't have to be a big number. If we are going to have my "fantasy" series, I would have the following, car must be built from a real car shell. The arguments that it is too expensive & unsafe don't wash with me, there are many other classes worldwide that do it.

I have to say I was in your camp before, but now having had more life experience in different areas, I think for the type of racing this is, the speeds involved and for safety, you need a proper race car chassis. It's way to costly to engineer a safe and secure race car chassis over a production car shell for the type of racing this is.

[MacrosNZ]

road shells are made for the road

[racer69]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

I think for the type of racing this is, the speeds involved and for safety, you need a proper race car chassis. It's way to costly to engineer a safe and secure race car chassis over a production car shell for the type of racing this is.

If road car shells are so unsafe, then shouldn't that apply to motorsport in general?

Production shells (and other production parts) would presumebly lead to slower speeds too, therefore safer.

[madman16]

Originally Posted by Just Do It!

Is today's announcement that 888 are expanding to a 4-car HRT squad to manage the Walkinshaw entity as well?

Not sure how you got to that conclusion

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by madman16

Not sure how you got to that conclusion

it was a guess/wish/speculation that was made after it was announced that there was going to be an announcment but before the announcment was made

[St00ge]

Originally Posted by racer69

If road car shells are so unsafe, then shouldn't that apply to motorsport in general?

Production shells (and other production parts) would presumebly lead to slower speeds too, therefore safer.

No and No...

[racer69]

Originally Posted by St00ge

No and No...

why and why...?

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by racer69

why and why...?

Because you could put an LS9 in a Lada Samara and it would still go scary fast.

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by racer69

why and why...?

when v8 supercars began we used production shells and parts, they weighed the same as the do now, and there is minimal difference in speed.

but we have made the cars safer and cheaper to fix.

thus you theory is wrong

[racer69]

Originally Posted by Mixer

Because you could put an LS9 in a Lada Samara and it would still go scary fast.

Given it would be a 'production-based' formula , you wouldn't be putting an LS9 in a Lada Samara unless enough of those cars were built and registered in Australia.

Having said that, i own a Lada Samara, if only the Russians had produced something like that....

The question still stands though, if production-based cars are so unsafe to race, why does that only apply to this series, and not all motorsport in general??

[peckstar]

racer , take a look at the top levels of motorsport throughout the world, they are not production cars

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by racer69

The question still stands though, if production-based cars are so unsafe to race, why does that only apply to this series, and not all motorsport in general??

The question is one of risk, and in a professional sport the administrators have a duty of care to mitigate risk where possible.

Both Bergmann and Watson's fatal accidents at Bathurst are an example of production based machinery being well outside its safety zone.

A production car may well be acceptable for an Improved Production car because they don't race every weekend and they don't do very long races, ergo the risk is reasonably low.

However if you're a professional series and you race week in week out and for longer events, your risk rises.

V8Supercar COTF didn't just blink into existence, its the product of continual evolution from something that DID start as production shells.

Also when we talk about "production" cars from the 70s and 80s with rose coloured glasses on... Do you think the GMP&A A9X shells were really that close to production? What about acid dipped M3s with panels so thin you could bend them with a manila folder? Or Sierras that got so silly in the end you couldn't fit the wheels on the car if you were not cheating.

As soon as someone is building a "racing" version of a production car its going to be extensively modified, and there comes a time where its going to be cheaper to produce a suitable facsimile that is faster, cheaper and safer, while being externally identical.

Compare that to any of the other V8 race series around the world: DTM, Turismo Carretera, V8 superstars and you'll see the COTF looks very production faithful by comparison, and I think it will produce better racing.

[david5]

How can the racing be any better, or worse for that matter, if the same changes are made to all the cars ? They might be more enjoyabe for the pilot but that's about it.

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by david5

How can the racing be any better, or worse for that matter, if the same changes are made to all the cars ? They might be more enjoyabe for the pilot but that's about it.

The configuration of the new car will make it more racy and more sportscar like than the current car.

[St00ge]

Originally Posted by racer69

The question still stands though, if production-based cars are so unsafe to race, why does that only apply to this series, and not all motorsport in general??

refer to above posts for text to back this up.. Mixer did a pretty good job of it..