Nick & JV to be treated equally?

Kirk · 19 Jan 2006, 14:56 (Ref:1504472)

MT says yes, Stuck says it is highly doubtful.

http://www.f1i.com/content/view/2613/32/

This begs the question: If the budget and resources are there, why not cater to both drivers needs? There is no reason not to, unless you are on a restricted budget and I'd like to believe MT is genuine in his statement.... or do we make too much of this # 1, #2 driver issue? Comments?

dcp2685 · 19 Jan 2006, 15:01 (Ref:1504477)

I don't see why not. They're probably going to be middle of the pack anyway, why not spend the effort on getting the most point possible instead of pulling for Nick.

I would think if the car was the best on the grid (very highly unlikely this year) they may pull for Nick a little more, but BMW is about racing....not politics.

The F1.06 is a beaut ain't she?

**chunterer** · 19 Jan 2006, 15:31 (Ref:1504504)

Agreed, the team will want to learn as much as possible in its first year and get as many points as possible.

However Jacques development ability has been questioned in the past, but there's no doubt that his experience and decisiveness will be an asset as they strive to move forwards.

Once they are truly competitive they might then put emphasis on one driver, but I doubt either of the current drivers will be around when those decisions are made anyway.

Kirk · 19 Jan 2006, 16:30 (Ref:1504528)

I don't think that it is JV's development abiliity that's been questioned, as much as his unique set-up requirements (stiffer than stiff)

I notice that Fry also said the same of Rubens and JB. I wonder if that is any different?( especially if Honda-BAR surprise and they turn out to be more competitive, more like 2004).

And how about Ferrari, McLaren, Toyota and Renault? They all have unique situations particularly with the contract of the drivers, and in Ferrari's case two drivers at opposite ends of their F1 careers. Will these teams favour one or the other? Likely not, I say, at least in the first half of the season.

avsfan733 · 19 Jan 2006, 16:59 (Ref:1504542)

I think they will (and rightly should) be treated differently. Now this doesn't mean one gets treated better. Two drivers with two different styles can hurt development more than they help. All the info when doing back to back comparisons can be no good if its not taken with a grain of salt. Its really about how can get the absolute best out of the car.

**Adam43** · 19 Jan 2006, 19:14 (Ref:1504635)

It depends whether you class the faster driver getting the odd advantage over a race weekend. (The first with new bits, the preferable pitstop lap, etc...). And then it will depend on whether you can remember when it happens for both of them, not just one of them. Also studying probability might help too.

It can't be exactly the same for both.

From the outset they both have a chance to do well.

Jordi · 19 Jan 2006, 19:37 (Ref:1504654)

I don't think there will be #1 and #2. I agree with what Adam said, mostly.

(And your avatar kicks ass, Adam!)

Dixie Flatline · 19 Jan 2006, 23:13 (Ref:1504801)

A couple of points here.

First, I recall reading an interview with JV where he talked about his days with Williams. Patrick Head used to tell JV and Jock Clear how the car would be set up. JV and Jock Clear would go ahead and set the car up but as soon as Head moved on to something else, they would change the car's settings back to what JV wanted. HHF obeyed Head's directives and found the car wasn't as fast. Later on, it appears that other race engineers have rated JV's developmental abilities as much as anyone else's.

Secondly, January '06 F1 Racing magazine asks Nick whether he will enjoy being no. 1 at BMW this season. Quite politely, Nick sidesteps the question, but neither does he refute the implication that there is a clear no. 1 driver and a clear no. 2 driver.

I suspect the reality will be different from the words of Dr T, unfortunately.

**Adam43** · 19 Jan 2006, 23:19 (Ref:1504811)

First. JV achieved with his set-up (WDC). Ultimately Williams were happy to see him win*. HHF wasn't as quick in a Williams - I don't think that was down to set-up specifically. JV is reknowned to this day as wanting a quirky set-up and generally most other drivers prefer something else and a many have proven to be as quick or quicker with it.

Second. Bang on. Nick is right.

Dr T. Yes he has more affinity with NH, but he isn't going to complain if JV grabs some great results. See *.

jhansen · 19 Jan 2006, 23:23 (Ref:1504815)

Ok, Adam gets my vote for best avatar ever. lol!

**Adam43** · 19 Jan 2006, 23:27 (Ref:1504821)

I can tall I haven't posted much recently. I've had that avatar for ages and few noticed!

I think the situation at BMW will be OK next year. NH isn't up for making trouble and JV knows he needs to buckle down. The only difference maybe that NH may get a secnd chance if it goes pear shaped, whereas JV as used that one up. However no one said being an F1 driver was meant to be easy. JV knows this more than anyone and will take it in his stride.

Jordi · 19 Jan 2006, 23:31 (Ref:1504824)

(Adam, I noticed eons ago, just forgot to tell you back then!)

Re: BMW... I think we can reasonably expect to see a faster car than last year's C24, and if the drivers are able to rack up points consistently there will be less trouble. When cars go well all is fine, when they are slower it's when the arguing starts.

Dixie Flatline · 19 Jan 2006, 23:31 (Ref:1504825)

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamAshmore

I can tall I haven't posted much recently. I've had that avatar for ages and few noticed!

I think the situation at BMW will be OK next year. NH isn't up for making trouble and JV knows he needs to buckle down. The only difference maybe that NH may get a secnd chance if it goes pear shaped, whereas JV as used that one up. However no one said being an F1 driver was meant to be easy. JV knows this more than anyone and will take it in his stride.

Well, then let's hope premature retirement will motivate JV to do the best job he can with the BMW (if he needs any further motivation, as a Formula One driver):

http://www.f1i.com/content/view/2614/1/

Mr V · 20 Jan 2006, 00:26 (Ref:1504853)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dixie Flatline

A couple of points here.

First, I recall reading an interview with JV where he talked about his days with Williams. Patrick Head used to tell JV and Jock Clear how the car would be set up. JV and Jock Clear would go ahead and set the car up but as soon as Head moved on to something else, they would change the car's settings back to what JV wanted. HHF obeyed Head's directives and found the car wasn't as fast. Later on, it appears that other race engineers have rated JV's developmental abilities as much as anyone else's.

JV made a meal of winning a championship in a car that should have had it wrapped up with a few race's left to go, so maybe his settings weren't so brilliant? Anyway, that's neither here nor there, BMW, now that they have decided on JV would be fools to themselves if they didn't give both drivers equal status at the beginning of the season. As the year progresses should one or the other be obviously faster then the attention will shift to the faster driver, which driver that is remain's to be seen, but i have a sneaky suspicion i know what driver that will be

hgmonaro · 20 Jan 2006, 00:28 (Ref:1504855)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhansen

Ok, Adam gets my vote for best avatar ever. lol!

too bad for those on dial-up though...

**Bononi** · 20 Jan 2006, 01:03 (Ref:1504875)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhansen

Ok, Adam gets my vote for best avatar ever. lol!

By the way, Adam, gets my move too !

topic-wise

I think it's a matter of politics, in fact, a team politic definition :
Will be BMW Sauber a one-car team or not ?

okeefe · 20 Jan 2006, 03:26 (Ref:1504922)

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcp2685

The F1.06 is a beaut ain't she?

Wow - what a nice machine-took my breath away and made me need a BMW! I thought the T-shirts were pretty nice too (and much more affordable).

MRJUCY · 20 Jan 2006, 03:35 (Ref:1504928)

I don't think either driver will be number 1 to the extent that they'd ask JV to move over so Nick can have the glory of 11th or where ever they'll be battling this year but my feeling is that Nick will get preference on the odd occasion for things like first go at new parts or strategy.

Nismo · 21 Jan 2006, 13:18 (Ref:1506016)

so who cares if JV won with a stiff setup? i ask how many poles did he get tha year with a super stiff car? it worked for him, he got the job done end of it!!

Car setups are an individual thing, what works for one driver does not work for another. Dont forget MS is another driver who likes a darty car, with more front end bite..

Lets get off JV's case and let him get on with it! there are plenty more useless over hyped drivers out there than JV

Fisichella comes to mind!

enemy-ace · 21 Jan 2006, 14:36 (Ref:1506065)

I think it incredibly naive to believe that there won't be a distinction between the drivers. While I believe that BMW will give everything they can for JV to succeed, the fact remains that Heidfeld is their chosen driver for the future. He will have the bosses ear. Racing isn't just about technology, it is also about people and relationships.
Nick's input will be regarded first and he will also get the new bits of kit first. Nothing wrong with it, just the way it is. Nick would have to do a pretty poor job of being team leader for anything to be any different. However I doubt that will happen; he is too good of a driver for that to happen.

Kirk · 21 Jan 2006, 16:29 (Ref:1506110)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nismo

so who cares if JV won with a stiff setup?
....
Lets get off JV's case and let him get on with it! there are plenty more useless over hyped drivers out there than JV

It is quite funny, isn't it. If it were found out that one day JV had one of his socks inside out, it would be scrutinized to the max. Similar to his baggy driving suit that seems to get mentioned every other day. Jacques himself, being somewhat of a computer nerd, must get a good laugh about some things that are written and discussed at length about him.

Marbot · 21 Jan 2006, 17:19 (Ref:1506128)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirk

Jacques himself, being somewhat of a computer nerd, must get a good laugh about some things that are written and discussed at length about him.

He seems to be at odds with the one they have at Hinwil.

Louis B. · 22 Jan 2006, 00:40 (Ref:1506371)

The facts speak for themselves: NH is signed until 2008 inclusive & his drive was confirmed before the end of last season. It took up to the end of November before BMW confirmed they would fulfill the last year of JV's contract (after having interviewed many others).

Since the end of the 2005 season, NH tested 9 days with the hybrid and two days with the new car while JV tested 5 days with the hybrid and one day with the new car. It's very nice from Dr. Theissen to say to the press that there is / will be equality of treatment between the two but this is not what we have so far observed.

I am not complaining (yet). The situation is fairly clear to everyone. Jacques is the underdog and must out perform NH from the beginning of the season. For so long as he is given a fair chance to compete (what has so far been the case despite what I raised above), I will be happy.

kmsport · 22 Jan 2006, 00:44 (Ref:1506375)

but JV will not even rate in comparison to Nick

Louis B. · 22 Jan 2006, 01:08 (Ref:1506392)

We'll see.

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