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13 Mar 2018, 03:56 (Ref:3807666) | #576 | |
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46 supercars in action at adelaide in 2018, just topped your 40
Last edited by peckstar; 13 Mar 2018 at 04:18. |
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13 Mar 2018, 04:01 (Ref:3807667) | #577 | |||
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The influx of drivers recently has seen debate rage about the role of GT3 as a potential replacement and discussion of the future of Bathursts favourite race. I am not suggesting the 12 Hour has/or will replace either however the increase and discussion about these topics has no doubt been enhanced with involvement with drivers, teams and names. Hypothetically if manufactures lure name teams and name drivers towards TCR (or any other category for that matter) and away from their current categories - you will have fans follow regardless of your fixation of lap time comparisons against years gone by. |
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
13 Mar 2018, 04:04 (Ref:3807668) | #578 | ||
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As we have it now, we get 26 main game cars for 2 races, and 20+ cars for 3 Super2 races. |
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13 Mar 2018, 04:27 (Ref:3807669) | #579 | ||
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there is no hypothetical because it wont happen and the fans wont follow because it wont interest them. Production cars are running in 3 weeks at bathurst, it is almost as quick as TCR, Its just a support category. I think also its important to not that the Greens just put forward a policy that new cars will all be EV by 2030, There is no 10 year window for TCR (or another category) to build up a fan base |
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13 Mar 2018, 04:47 (Ref:3807671) | #580 | |
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Why must we change?
I never hear anyone at the drags say they wish the fuelers stopped using nitro as it's not road relevant or fans at the dirt track say they wish the sprint cars had more of a sedan body like their daily... Yes Supercars may be seen as archaic but that's what we should embrace - all this "progress" will leave a niche for fans who love big and loud petrol cars, race cars that test the driver (no aids) etc What makes Supercars stand out amongst a sea of underpowered or over-aided race cars is the very thing we must strive to maintain. Make the cars cheaper to run and build as always intended, loosen the rules around manufacturer permission to use body shapes etc and come what may |
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13 Mar 2018, 04:53 (Ref:3807672) | #581 | |
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13 Mar 2018, 04:57 (Ref:3807673) | #582 | |||
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If you havent stood at the start line with two top fuellers launching side by side-well you really need to Nothing else compares. |
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Somebody asked if the McLaren F1 was going to be like the Ferrari F40, Gordon Murray replied, "I don't think so, there's no one at McLaren who can weld that badly." |
13 Mar 2018, 05:03 (Ref:3807674) | #583 | ||
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13 Mar 2018, 06:01 (Ref:3807679) | #584 | |
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You can't just bury your head in the sand, and pretend that the Holden and Ford factories haven't closed. For that reason (the factories closing in 2017), I think 2018 onwards is pivotal for Supercars...
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13 Mar 2018, 06:04 (Ref:3807680) | #585 | |||
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Motorsport can be wasteful, but that is just too much.... throwing away $1000s and the environmental impact of manufacturing the pistons for 6 seconds of mere entertainment. You don't need to be a "Green" to say, hey that's not really socially acceptable... I don't know if that is the main reason why drag racing isn't popular with a more mainstream audience, but such waste is just tooooo much even for people who like car racing... |
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13 Mar 2018, 06:09 (Ref:3807681) | #586 | ||
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You don't need a oversized 6.2L engine just to have fun! |
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13 Mar 2018, 06:33 (Ref:3807683) | #587 | |
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Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the idea of Volvo V8 Supercars and Mercedes-Benz V8 Supercars (and ideally Jaguar, BMW and all the rest that sell V8 performance sedans)...
But surely we have to accept that was trialled and sadly it failed and the Supercars series really needs to come up with a different idea instead now, else turn into a irrelevant one make series of Holden Vectra, sorry, Commodore sports sedans... |
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13 Mar 2018, 06:39 (Ref:3807685) | #588 | |||
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I am not sure how those two comments align? Are categories roles at events designated based on their lap times? |
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
13 Mar 2018, 07:16 (Ref:3807687) | #589 | ||
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Racing cars should be loud (just look at the negative impact the F1 cars created with their "quiet" engines and the efforts to make them sound like real race cars again) Racing cars should be spectacular and outrageously more powerful than what people drive to and from work, otherwise you may as well go and watch the desperate commuters dicing their way across the Harbour bridge at peak hour. It's all about the overwhelming sensation of watching and hearing these powerful "monsters" and drivers challenging the limits and each other at speeds unimaginable in ordinary commuter cars. Last edited by Backagain; 13 Mar 2018 at 07:25. |
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13 Mar 2018, 08:23 (Ref:3807706) | #590 | |
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The "lap-time" argument again, how ridiculous.
Just look at the BTCC, by far the premier series in the UK, they are slower than more than a few other tin-top categories, including one of their support acts, doesn't hurt them though. Until "Supercars", the ATCC cars were never that fastest tin-tops in Australia, far slower in fact, yet they were still the most popular show in the land. Drag racing doesn't sprout itself as the "Australian Touring Car Championship", that is why the category must be road relevant |
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13 Mar 2018, 08:24 (Ref:3807707) | #591 | ||
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Most categories however are designated based on lap times, they either have a parity/BOP system or a category system But TCR no matter what will still be just a few seconds quicker than a production car. would have 4 or 5 key tin top categories ahead of them including 50 year old TCM which are really popular with the crowd |
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13 Mar 2018, 09:57 (Ref:3807713) | #592 | |
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People need to realise that the Australian motor racing demographic is quite different to the European/British demographic in what attracts them as spectators. What works over there isn't necessarily going to work over here. Part of that is due to the manufacturer rivalries and their strong spectator followings which are more diverse over there and thus has allowed for a lot more categories to flourish as a result of those heavily supported manufacturers. In Aus it really is just Ford vs Holden and so that bit of passion which exists as a result of the brand doesn't exist when Audi, BMW, KIA etc decide to enter in a new category, and so these series need to catch audience attention with other factors such as speed and excitement. With TCR it lacks that initial "wow" factor due to their speed and platform and without any true brand support it will be an uphill battle to get people to the gates to watch.
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13 Mar 2018, 13:18 (Ref:3807742) | #593 | ||
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It's more likely to have Audis, BMWs, Jaguar and Mercedes in it. Supercars needs to tap into the yuppie market somehow. |
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13 Mar 2018, 19:18 (Ref:3807774) | #594 | |
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Yuppies show up at the GP, beyond that their engagement with motorsport is nil.
Once you free yourself from the notion that the grid must reflect the parking lot, you'll see that the "core" long term sustainable fans seem to prefer purpose built race cars with little to no road relevance And I take your point about the series failing, I used to believe that myself. But it's all relative - as mixer, peckstar etc have said above, motorsport as a whole is down. It would be erroneous and possibly fatal to see our regulations as a cause of that and spice them up to try and regain market share - it's not going to happen. Last edited by Compromised; 13 Mar 2018 at 19:32. |
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13 Mar 2018, 21:47 (Ref:3807802) | #595 | ||
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NZ's first TCR - VW Golf
http://www.drivesouth.co.nz/news/lat...-for-otago-duo How many TCRs are in Australia now? |
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13 Mar 2018, 23:04 (Ref:3807815) | #596 | |
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Just the Audi at this stage.
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13 Mar 2018, 23:41 (Ref:3807823) | #597 | ||
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13 Mar 2018, 23:51 (Ref:3807825) | #598 | |
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There's still a few non-works efforts that aren't.
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14 Mar 2018, 00:09 (Ref:3807831) | #599 | ||
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Yes it is combined, which I think would be the only way to get enough interest to replace the series that once had two cars that made up 1/3 of the total car market (roughly).
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15 Mar 2018, 05:46 (Ref:3808095) | #600 | ||
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The parity line of thinking is another reason to think that there will be no injection of interest from other manufacturers and when and if Holden reduce or remove their interest all of a sudden it will be back to a semi professional series if it survives. Less greed and self interest and more understanding of why the decline is happening would go a long way to finding an answer to a problem that was obvious from the very beginning and the reason that the series was originally started which was to create wealth for a few select people. Don't give me the line that it was to promote motor racing and make teams viable, that won't wash, the underlying reason was a wealth creation exercise. |
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