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Old 6 Apr 2004, 21:48 (Ref:932826)   #1
74fuely
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Schnitzer BMW 2002 History (Trento Bondone 1979)

A couple of years back I aquired a BMW-Schnitzer 2002 ti that is currently undergoing restoration. The cars history is unknown, although most of the modifications would indicate that it had been modified to Gruppe 5 Specifications (Schnitzer 4 valve engine, rack/pinion steering, suspension pick-up points etc.,). No FIA papers with the car. The only potential clue is that it supposedly came over from Italy (to the U.S.) in the early 1980's. It has an ID tag on the interior of the rollcage that says "Trento Bondone 1979" and on the other side the number "256". Would like to find out anything I can about this car, as well as any pic's of Gruppe 5 BMW 2002's. (This is a non-turbo car). Thanks
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Old 6 Apr 2004, 22:12 (Ref:932848)   #2
paulzinho
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Welcome to the forums!

Hopefully someone more knowledgeable than myself will be able to help out!
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Old 6 Apr 2004, 23:15 (Ref:932897)   #3
74fuely
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A couple of more clues (maybe)

It has subsequently been stripped and is getting a nut/bolt full restoration. Many pounds of paint came off of it. It had the BMW Motorsport 320 diagonal livery which is certainly not correct. Lots of blue and orange on the glass pieces under the motorsport colors and not running in diagonal patterns (as near as I can tell). I had heard when it came over that it was white with a large green scorpion painted on it (bizarre). Don't know that is credible though
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Old 6 Apr 2004, 23:24 (Ref:932902)   #4
Jeremy Jackson
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Hi,

If you go to http://isr.cudlici.com/ and go to the results section, the rsults of the 1979 Trento Bondone event are in the European Hillclimb section. No race numbers there, but it appears that at least 2002s ran, driven by Dieter Kainbach & Luigi Pellanda. Not sure if the results are complete though, 70 cars listed.

Hope this helps
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Old 6 Apr 2004, 23:39 (Ref:932911)   #5
74fuely
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If I had to bet I would put money on "Luigi Pellanda". Not many 2002's listed in those races, however he is listed again in the Bolzano Mendola race with a BMW 2002 Ti (which is how Schnitzer refer's to the car). I will see what I can unearth on him--thank you.
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Old 6 Apr 2004, 23:56 (Ref:932917)   #6
74fuely
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Makes more sense now that the car finished its career hillclimbing--the fuel cell that came out of it was tiny (maybe 7-8 gallons at most). Given the state of evolution of the car, I had thought that it might have been in the DRM series. I tried Schnitzer Motorsport (Charly Lamm-really nice but NO records and most of the people from "the day" long since gone).
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Old 7 Apr 2004, 07:23 (Ref:933073)   #7
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74fuely! I can go through period Autosprint magazines to look for something, I remember Pellanda raced a 2002 in circuit racing, I saw him here in Monza, but the car was more Group 2 than Group 5! Maybe the German route is the one to take...
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Old 7 Apr 2004, 10:22 (Ref:933228)   #8
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http://www.pistonheads.com/doc.asp?c=103&i=8215
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Old 7 Apr 2004, 15:07 (Ref:933561)   #9
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Schnitzer 2002 ti

I think the way to go is the Italian route. As I looked back at some of the photo's, I noticed the fire suppression bottles were Italian. The car may not have started out in Italy, but I am sure it ended up there.

The flares are unlike anything I have ever seen before on a 2002 (they look much like a IMSA 3.0 CSL / Gruppe 2 CSL flare) and house big coolers for both the engine and rear differential. This car is ultra "trick" and has essentially every "goody" a racing 2002 could have.


This car also has a correct fabricated Schnitzer sytle (early BMW Motorsport) rear wing. Interestingly enough it had a proper "KKK Turboloader" sticker on one side of it.
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Old 7 Apr 2004, 20:08 (Ref:933813)   #10
Frank de Jong
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I can say that I've seen many 2002's in the past, in 1974-1975-1976 group 2 form as well as the Schnitzer group 5 cars and even some atmospheric 1977 2002's in group 5 form - but I've never seen flares like these (yeah, on a CSL!).
Interestingly enough, a few months back I had contact with a dutchman who had aquired an atmospheric 2002 Schnitzer group 5 too - this time with Rodenstock livery and early 77 style rear flares. But this car seems to have a German history.
Schnitzer sold group 5 bodywork sets early in 1977.
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Old 7 Apr 2004, 20:42 (Ref:933831)   #11
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I had seen some pictures of a Gruppe 5 Rodenstock car owned by a fellow named Larens Manders I believe in Holland, that is painted up in the Rodenstock livery. The car has no motor and I believe is being sold as a roller. It could be the "real deal", however I noted a number of non-original modifications that would potentially indicate otherwise (not that I really care one way or the other). There weren't many of these cars to begin with and even fewer still today. It is difficult to know how it morphed over the years. An awful lot of time and money was spent putting the car together. Other than the bad paint job and a hack job on the battery being reloacted inside the car-it was in its original "unmolested" state which is remarkable for one of these cars. I have to believe that someone who attended these hillclimbs has seen the car or a picture of the car. I am convinced that that was what is being used for prior to coming here.
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Old 7 Apr 2004, 23:44 (Ref:933942)   #12
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hello 74 fuely,
please send me some detailed pics from your car so that i can see if some things are built the same!
greetings laurens
holland
www.mandersautogas.nl
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Old 7 Apr 2004, 23:52 (Ref:933948)   #13
74fuely
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Will do so in the next few days. Not trying to impune the integrity of your car, I love 02's but for now only interested in finding what I can on my car. I am sure you have a ONS Wagenpass for it that shows its racing history. You can also get the FIA homolgation papers to check and see if the modifications that were done to the car are consistant. And of course that isn't to say that someone didn't take a proper car and "improve" it over the years with beyond period modifications. I only have a bad copy of the 1973 Gruppe 2 homologation papers, which of course has both the BMW M12/7 and Schnitzer 20-4 motors (Jan 1, 1973)
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Old 11 Jan 2006, 07:53 (Ref:1499076)   #14
Alex E
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I have a Gp 5 Schnitzer 2002 that also was in Italy. I think there may be a connection?
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Old 12 Jan 2006, 01:33 (Ref:1499618)   #15
Howard Wood
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Slightly off on a tangent I know but some Group 2 Homologation papers are available from BMW Mobile Tradition. They have copies of Homologation 5258 which is Group 2 2002Ti but contains a bit of the 4 valve Tii stuff as well and also Homologation 1630 which is 2002 Touring Tii. Contact Andreas Harz at Andreas.Harz@partner.bmw.de or info.konzernarchiv@bmw.de
If the papers you have, no matter how tatty,are Homologation 1620 which is 2002 Tii please send me a p.m.They are not available from any official source and I have been trying to obtain a copy for my Group 2 2002 Tii.
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