Duty of care to a driver? - Page 2

Hepatic · 5 May 2010, 18:04 (Ref:2684930)

think that hits the nail on the head. you take the incident in and decide on so many things very quickly and part of that is do i trust these drivers? personally if it had been F1, BTCC, F3, GP2 or anything of that international nature i'd not have stayed once ascertaining the driver was generally ok. i witnessed a very scary moment during a GP2 race once that galvanised my view on that - car in a horribly dangerous place, little or no view of on coming traffic and none of the drivers even lifted let alone braked for it whilst one marshal was by the car. if i trust the drivers to react accordingly to yellows then i feel more comfortable for to stay longer and generally you get that in club meetings because the drivers are there for different reasons than in international events.

it sounds like you did everything right. you got the drivers condition relayed to race control as quickly as possible then took a balanced judgement of the best course of action. the key thing being keeping a constant watch on traffic for anything that might endanger yourself, which on the bank is #1 priority. job well done and i'm sure greatly appreciated by the driver concerned.

**Woolley** · 5 May 2010, 19:59 (Ref:2684992)

It sounds to me like you did a good job having weighed up the risk options in a clear and reasoned way giving due thought to the potential for the driver and the type of vehicles racing. You can ask no more of anyone, and think no less of someone who came to a different conclusion at the time.

Well done, you sound like exactly the sort of marshal I'd happily work with.

M Greenslade · 5 May 2010, 20:50 (Ref:2685020)

Well done, you sound like exactly the sort of marshal I'd happily work with.

Absolutely Hear, Hear

A bit like myself in my much younger days!!!!!!!!

Bladders.......

gachjoel · 6 May 2010, 04:57 (Ref:2685132)

Job well done, off the track we would always do something to save the life of another, its what we as humans do.
why do being at a race circuit make it any different ?
is it the Blame/Claim culture we live in make it this way ?

flying muppet · 6 May 2010, 07:30 (Ref:2685174)

Slightly off topic, but the first step towards encouraging better driver discipline under waved yellow flags is to STOP overflagging!

We do NOT need a vigourously waved yellow flag to cover a car that has pulled off by the side of the barrier with both the driver out and marshals clear...

JimW · 6 May 2010, 07:43 (Ref:2685182)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flying muppet

Slightly off topic, but the first step towards encouraging better driver discipline under waved yellow flags is to STOP overflagging!

We do NOT need a vigourously waved yellow flag to cover a car that has pulled off by the side of the barrier with both the driver out and marshals clear...

I've been fighting this one for years with only limited sucess. It is something to which trainers need to give regular attention and Post Chiefs need to keep firm hands on.

Regards

Jim

Piglet · 6 May 2010, 07:48 (Ref:2685188)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flying muppet

Slightly off topic, but the first step towards encouraging better driver discipline under waved yellow flags is to STOP overflagging!

We do NOT need a vigourously waved yellow flag to cover a car that has pulled off by the side of the barrier with both the driver out and marshals clear...

Never?

Piglet · 6 May 2010, 07:51 (Ref:2685189)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gachjoel

Job well done, off the track we would always do something to save the life of another, its what we as humans do.
why do being at a race circuit make it any different ?
is it the Blame/Claim culture we live in make it this way ?

Surely the point is that the OP wasn't saving the live of another and that's his question, he'd established that the driver was OK, so was it sensible to stay in a position of danger?

Nobody has mentioned blame/claim (except you

), the OP's question was whether it had been sensible for him to put his own safety at risk in this situation.

deley · 6 May 2010, 08:15 (Ref:2685198)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flying muppet

Slightly off topic, but the first step towards encouraging better driver discipline under waved yellow flags is to STOP overflagging!

We do NOT need a vigourously waved yellow flag to cover a car that has pulled off by the side of the barrier with both the driver out and marshals clear...

absolutely .... even the BB is clear on this "If the incident is well off the track and marshals are not working at the trackside, the incident may be indicated by a stationary yellow flag, followed by a stationary green flag, or by a Hazard Area board".......

Steven Humphrey · 6 May 2010, 10:07 (Ref:2685249)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flying muppet

Slightly off topic, but the first step towards encouraging better driver discipline under waved yellow flags is to STOP overflagging!

We do NOT need a vigourously waved yellow flag to cover a car that has pulled off by the side of the barrier with both the driver out and marshals clear...

I agree but the incident I mentioned earlier was covered by a single waved yellow until we got to it, then the waving got more vigorous. The double yellows only came out when the drivers were blatantly ignoring the single. Suprisingly it was a clubby race but the drivers were all reported.

flying muppet · 6 May 2010, 11:09 (Ref:2685278)

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnage arnie

I agree but the incident I mentioned earlier was covered by a single waved yellow until we got to it, then the waving got more vigorous. The double yellows only came out when the drivers were blatantly ignoring the single. Suprisingly it was a clubby race but the drivers were all reported.

That's understood - my comment was much more of a generalisation - more of a reminder about the dangers of yellow overflagging.

M Greenslade · 6 May 2010, 12:12 (Ref:2685314)

The sad thing about this incident, it was a low key Clubbie race of competitors who race together regularly and should damm well know better!

Bladders......

Dan Friel · 6 May 2010, 12:17 (Ref:2685318)

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnage arnie

I agree but the incident I mentioned earlier was covered by a single waved yellow until we got to it, then the waving got more vigorous. The double yellows only came out when the drivers were blatantly ignoring the single. Suprisingly it was a clubby race but the drivers were all reported.

Not sure I follow 100%. if the status of the incident didn't change, how can a double waved be justfied? Surely if the drivers can't behave then it should be a red rather than diluting the impact of the yellow (as per comments above)?

Jon. As always I'm certain you would have done the right thing. Just hope the wife wasn't watching from the bank!

Dave Brand · 6 May 2010, 13:02 (Ref:2685345)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Friel

Not sure I follow 100%. if the status of the incident didn't change, how can a double waved be justfied? Surely if the drivers can't behave then it should be a red rather than diluting the impact of the yellow (as per comments above)?

I can't & won't comment on the incident in question, but the basic rule of incident handling is "if it's not safe, don't do it". If the situation is rendered unsafe by the drivers not slowing down under waved yellows, get back to safety & wait for the safety car or red flag. Explaining to the driver(s) involved in the incident just why an incident which could & should have been dealt with under waved yellows may just help spread the word!

As for double waved yellows & overuse of yellows in general, that was discussed at great length here:

http://tentenths.com/forum/showthrea...18272#poststop

Marshal · 6 May 2010, 19:03 (Ref:2685550)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Friel

Just hope the wife wasn't watching from the bank!

Fortunately not...

Stuart H · 6 May 2010, 20:47 (Ref:2685644)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flying muppet

Slightly off topic, but the first step towards encouraging better driver discipline under waved yellow flags is to STOP overflagging!

We do NOT need a vigourously waved yellow flag to cover a car that has pulled off by the side of the barrier with both the driver out and marshals clear...

Hate to say this but i'm with flying muppet on that one!!

Steven Humphrey · 6 May 2010, 21:23 (Ref:2685667)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Brand

I can't & won't comment on the incident in question, but the basic rule of incident handling is "if it's not safe, don't do it". If the situation is rendered unsafe by the drivers not slowing down under waved yellows, get back to safety & wait for the safety car or red flag.

As I mentioned, they would have hit a JCB before us so I felt safe! Where the car had stopped in the gravel wasn't in the 'firing line' of the oncoming traffic so I felt safe when first going out but it had to be snatched a fair distance, some of which was exposed to it.

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