[Driver] Lewis Hamilton is the best driver in F1. Discuss

[Born Racer]

Originally Posted by N.A-D.R

The main problem is too many brits think Hamilton is the best thing since sliced bread, yeah hes a bloody good driver, but hes not the best on the grid. Sorry to burst the bubble guys.

Ah, Australia VS Britain.

[Born Racer]

hes not the best. but he'd be in top 5.

Alonso, Vettel, Kubica, Schumi (hes the best, just not anymore because hes past his peak) and possibly Webber.

That's already five you've listed there. So does Hamilton not fit into that?

[ptclaus98]

I don't see how people can say for sure that Kubica or Vettel is better than Hamilton. I mean, the one race Kubica won, Hamilton dominated the entire weekend and was running away with the race, and Vettel can't handle Webber mano e mano. Hamilton has a world champion teammate who he spotted two wins to early on, and he's mainly kept his head down and just got on with it.



And this is from a hater of his!

[old man]

Thank you peterelise for a well ballanced summary from a real "sport"!

[N.A-D.R]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

That's already five you've listed there. So does Hamilton not fit into that?

I said possibly Webber, but Hamilton is better than Webber.

Im not a hater of Hamilton, hes just not the best. For starters he makes too many mistakes, and hes too aggressive on the tyres, he needs to learn to manage them better during a race and not just go 100% every lap. He still has things to learn, same as Vettel, except i think Vettel has a smarter attitude when it comes to racing, where hamilton just goes fast. I think Vettel has more potential than Hamilton especially when he is 2 years younger too.

[Wims]

Yeah I dont see all the Kubica hype either. Quick Nick had the best of him in the last season they raced together. Are you saying that Heidfeld is one of the best drivers in the world?

[Born Racer]

Originally Posted by N.A-D.R

For starters he makes too many mistakes, and hes too aggressive on the tyres, he needs to learn to manage them better during a race and not just go 100% every lap.

I think he's been doing this though. Where has he had a problem with this recently? He won Canada, which was a race that was hard on tyres.

Who do you think is the best? Alonso? If so, what about his mistakes?

Originally Posted by Wims

Yeah I dont see all the Kubica hype either. Quick Nick had the best of him in the last season they raced together. Are you saying that Heidfeld is one of the best drivers in the world?

Quick Nick is quick though. They were quite evenly matched it seemed, with Heidfeld often ahead. The differences between such drivers are so marginal, it is hard to make definitive judgements.

Heidfeld incidentally, would be doing much better than Schumacher this year.

[Fox89]

My two cents: I thought Hamilton was close to the likes of Alonso in 2008, but as good? Not sure. Not quite. But for me he cemented himself as top of the pack in 2009, considering how poor his car was at the beginning of the season some of the results he got were superhuman.

And he continued to impress in 2010. He's had no more luck than anyone else really when you consider he got knocked off the road by Webber in Melbourne. Then his wheel failed on the penultimate lap in Spain where he had got up to 2nd. And yet he's top of the championship, pulling off stunning overtakes left right and centre (Rosberg in Australia comes to mind) and keeping close to a Red Bull car that's half a second per lap quicker in raw pace at every time of asking.

I've always been a Lewis fan, but I've tried to stay objective when it comes to calling him the best in F1 or not. But now I honestly think he is. And I'm relatively sure I'm making that judgement whilst disregarding any bias!

[pannenmann]

He matured a lot during 2009 and also this season. In 2009 he learned how to drive a not-so-top-notch car. In the beginning of 2010 he got beaten by Jenson and at the first time probably felt serious presure from one of his teammates. Crying at first, he learned to accept the situation. The split from his father also wasn't the worst decision it seems. Besides being stunning fast and a natural racer, what makes him the best driver out there to me is that he learns really fast from his mistakes and therefore also matures quicker than most drivers. Comparison Vettel: He's also quick, but he seems to repeat mistakes (overtaking by squeezing the other one, etc). Alonso is quick and a natural racer, but caught up the emotional drama created by himself - can't see that happen to Hamilton. His mental strength is also one of the advantages of Hamilton. Button would be a match when it comes to this, but he sometimes has setup problems as it seems, is slower in quali and lacks aggressiveness in certain situations. So to me Hamilton is not only one of the fastest drivers, but also the most complete which makes him the best.

Can't really consider Kubica as he still has to prove it. Heidfeld was quicker as said before. And let's not forget that some drivers seem to be quick but screw up when being under the pressure of having the possibility of becoming WDC. So he has a lot to prove. And considering the strange, questionable and dangerous things he has done already, it seems Kubica has a good chance of screwing up. Right now, leaving out the usual front runners, Rosberg is more likely to win a WDC than Robert.

[50-SIX]

Originally Posted by N.A-D.R

Im not a hater of Hamilton, hes just not the best. For starters he makes too many mistakes, and hes too aggressive on the tyres, he needs to learn to manage them better during a race and not just go 100% every lap. He still has things to learn, same as Vettel, except i think Vettel has a smarter attitude when it comes to racing, where hamilton just goes fast. I think Vettel has more potential than Hamilton especially when he is 2 years younger too.

I totallty disagree. Vettel is a smarter racer? Turning in on your teammate is not smart (Hamilton and Button showed how to battle that race). Barging passed Sutil at Silverstone was not smart. Name me one mistake Hamilton has done in the race this year? He is the outright quickest driver on the grid, the most aggresive racer, and is not making mistakes. I think its a no brainer.

I am a Jenson Button supporter. However, I have to admit that based on 2010form Hamilton is doing the best job in the 2nd quickest car. Vettel is 4th in the fastest, so how people can argue he is a better all round driver is madness.

I love this 'Hamilton can't manage his tyres' line people trawl out. Can someone give me an actual race this year where he lost out because he didn't manage his tyres correctly? I can give you one where tyre manangement was crucial and that was Canada. It escapes me now, who won that one.....

[Knowlesy]

Hamilton once had a puncture though.

[garcon]

Hamilton isn't even the best driver at McLaren, never mind the best in F1.

And I predict the driver's standings come the end of the season will back that up.

Hamilton may be the best one day, if he keeps working at it. He'll need to be patient for his next WDC title though.

[Super Hans]

Originally Posted by garcon

Hamilton isn't even the best driver at McLaren, never mind the best in F1.

Paffett has done well in DTM but that's a bold claim.

[Born Racer]

It's a stretch of the imagination to place Button, the man who was beaten by Fisichella in his second season, ahead of Hamilton, the man who just about beat Alonso in his first season.

And we know how Alonso and Fisichella compare.

[Super Hans]

Button is certainly stronger in some areas. At the beginning of the season,when we had a clutch of races conducted in changing conditions, Button led the way. Still, many said at the time that Hamilton would be back on top in normal conditions and that has proved to be the case.

Having Button in the team has certainly been good for Hamilton. Firstly because he can learn a lot from him and secondly because he seems impossible to fall out with, which has allowed Lewis to relax a little.

[Iron Ripper]

So....
We have seen how Hamilton races against Alonso - even. (in the same team)
So they should be on more or less the same level.
Then Hamilton squeezed Kovalainen, who outpaced Fisichella, so he is already better than Massa.
Hamilton is faster than Button, but Jense is somehow near him, so theoretically would be Barrichello who outpaced Button at the latter half of 09.
Button and Villeneuve were pretty even in BAR days, so were Villeneuve and Heidfeld, so theoretically Heidfeld is on the same level as Button, and Kubica, Webber, Vettel.

So the list should be like...
Hamilton & Alonso
Button, Kubica, Webber, Heidfeld, Vettel, Barrichello
Massa...

Of course, that is speaking statistically, Hamilton is on the level of Alonso, and one of the best between them on the grid right now.
At the moment, Alonso is having a little drop of form, so Hamilton should be considered as best on the grid, even as I'm not so keen to admit it.

[JamesH]

With regards to Button vs Hamilton - I think LH has the edge in raw pace (and probably the edge over all the other drivers on the grid) What JB has is a sensible and experienced head on his shoulders. Up till now this has made then equal.

However, LH can gain experience, and learn to be sensible, whereas JB (or indeed any of the others) cannot 'learn' natural talent.

The same argument could also be used in the Webber vs Vettel debate I guess, but Vettel isn't learning as quickly as LH, who seems to be absorbing maturing from JB like some sort of parasitic alien!!

[old man]

Originally Posted by JamesH

The same argument could also be used in the Webber vs Vettel debate I guess, but Vettel isn't learning as quickly as LH, who seems to be absorbing maturing from JB like some sort of parasitic alien!!

An osmotic process perhaps?

[Tim the Grey]

Or why McLaren brought JB in...

I just like the fact that JB has NOT been "blown away" as was so often and loudly predicted in here...

He's holding his own, and a touch of luck here or there, and he's back out front again...

[strider]

I don't know if it counts as osmosis, but I have thought all year that Lewis is soaking up information from Jenson like a sponge, even to the extent that he looked at the relationship Jenson has with his Dad and thought it looked better than the one he had with his Dad and set about changing it.

I agree that Lewis probably has the edge in raw speed, but where it shows most is in qualifying. It's nowhere near as apparent in the races. It's the same problem Jenson had last year and it stems from his super smooth driving style. He could do with another race or two where his experience means that he can make his own decisions without relying on the team. He's far too good to be blown away by Lewis.

Vettel doesn't seem to have realised that he could learn a thing or two from Mark and now he never will. His loss.

[JeremySmith]

Brilliant post strider, to be expected..

[Marbot]

Oh Jeez! Not another 'driver' thread!

At the moment, I don't see a big difference between 'any' of them!

Are they all where we expected them to be?

Sure Hamilton is 'fast', but that's a long way from being the 'best'.

[Born Racer]

I have to disagree. I think Hamilton is quite a bit more ahead of Button than many here think. Hamilton has more natural talent at his disposal. Button is doing a bloody fine job with what he has though and I'm so pleased for him that people will now finally accept his 2009 championship was merited (as if somehow he has to justify this).

[safc_fan89]

Two things. Firstly, I think I am right in saying that the only time Button has beaten Hamilton in the dry was in Spain, when Hamilton was ahead but crashed out with a tyre failure. So in terms of end results, it hasn't been as close as some of you like to think. So 7-3, or 6-2 if you remove the retirements, or more realistically 8-2 as Button would most likely have been nowhere in Monaco due to his poor start.

Secondly, qualifying and the race are completely different things. It is obvious that the Red Bull is stronger in qualifying than the race, relative to the opposition. Therefore, I wouldn't say Hamilton's performances are startling, as Button has also been there or thereabouts. I'd say he is doing what is expected of a car which works very well in race conditions. That's what he is paid to do.

I certainly wouldn't use this season as an example of why Hamilton is the best. You could use it as an example of why Alonso isn't clearly the best, as he has made a lot of errors this season, but that's for another thread...

I don't think anyone stands out at the moment, which is why it is so close, and nice that there are quite a few teams who are capable of fighting at the front.

Also, your evidence for this soaking up? Maybe Lewis just perspires more.

[PabloTeK]

Originally Posted by safc_fan89

Two things. Firstly, I think I am right in saying that the only time Button has beaten Hamilton in the dry was in Spain, when Hamilton was ahead but crashed out with a tyre failure. So in terms of end results, it hasn't been as close as some of you like to think. So 7-3, or 6-2 if you remove the retirements, or more realistically 8-2 as Button would most likely have been nowhere in Monaco due to his poor start.

Secondly, qualifying and the race are completely different things. It is obvious that the Red Bull is stronger in qualifying than the race, relative to the opposition. Therefore, I wouldn't say Hamilton's performances are startling, as Button has also been there or thereabouts. I'd say he is doing what is expected of a car which works very well in race conditions. That's what he is paid to do.

I certainly wouldn't use this season as an example of why Hamilton is the best. You could use it as an example of why Alonso isn't clearly the best, as he has made a lot of errors this season, but that's for another thread...

I don't think anyone stands out at the moment, which is why it is so close, and nice that there are quite a few teams who are capable of fighting at the front.

Also, your evidence for this soaking up? Maybe Lewis just perspires more.

On the Monaco issue, the engine was probably knackered after running a grid lap, sitting, green flag lap, sitting again, revving the engine for the start then having to breathe every other cars hot exhaust fumes! For it to last that long is amazing and then complete 1-2 laps is a feat!

No-one stands out for me either, Jenson and Lewis seem to be equal in race pace (thanks to Lewis driving around a strategy that really doesn't work for him - see Monza '09 - and Jenson working his way up through strategy and the occasional overtake). Webber is probably my current WDC favourite though after showing Vettel a clean pair of heels in what was meant to be a lesser car!

ETA: From last season when Jenson had a good car, we know these European races just don't seem to suit him as well as the flyaway ones such as Australia where he's very quick indeed. Abu Dhabi was a good one for him, that might be down to the difference in track temperatures! (Anyone remember that chase he was doing on Webber?)