MG Works B/C GTs

[275 GTB-4]

Originally Posted by KA

Looking at the Allison/Browning book again,

As to the lightweight shells, he suggests 6 sets of special GT panels were made at Pressed Steel Fisher in Swindon- he described this as a 'tricky process' using alloy instead of steel on the standard press tools. 3 lightweight bodies were then built up by Bodies Branch at West Bromwich, and the first car built at Abingdon around a standard steel MGC floorpan/bulkhead in March '67

As do other books on the subject...therefore, from a base of 6 possibles...you can bet 26 will be possible

[terence]

As Peter has already mentioned,the works were always swapping numbers around,one of the reasons there seem to be a few "North American" works cars around.The reason for this being that if three cars were entered for Sebring,two would be sold off to American BMC dealers to help with the cost of attending the event. On the subject of the ally bodied cars,the monoque,front to rear,was all steel but all exterior panels were pressed in lightweight ally,not the flimsy rubbish that is now available in the way of door skins,but something far more serviceable.
Unfortunately,there are a few "Works cars" around that have been "resurrected" so to speak, using new body shell's and the number plate.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by terence bower

As Peter has already mentioned,the works were always swapping numbers around,one of the reasons there seem to be a few "North American" works cars around.The reason for this being that if three cars were entered for Sebring,two would be sold off to American BMC dealers to help with the cost of attending the event.

Yep, this is well documented.

Originally Posted by terence bower

On the subject of the ally bodied cars,the monoque,front to rear,was all steel but all exterior panels were pressed in lightweight ally,not the flimsy rubbish that is now available in the way of door skins,but something far more serviceable.

So that means apart from the bonnet, doors, front wings and valance(s), the roof and the entire rear wings were alluminium?

Originally Posted by terence bower

Unfortunately,there are a few "Works cars" around that have been "resurrected" so to speak, using new body shell's and the number plate.

Going back to 1986 there was the first "reincarnation" of RMO699F built apparently around some parts found in a Claifornia scrap yard. Not for me to speculate here but it demonstrates how difficult it is to confirm originality sometimes.

Anyway that's good info there Terry.

[Peter Mallett]

OK,

So I see from the pics they were taken in 1992. Barry Sideways was pedalling that day. There's also a rather famous MGB sitting behind RMO in the paddock. And of course that wheel.

[GBRM]

That's was Colin Pearcey's car, with Doug Smith applying the tape and Colin looking on.

[terence]

Certainly was Colin's,I had to go over to his place to collect the original SU's from it,2in specials.That was on behalf of CMS,they sold them on for £350-00 the pair,whilst Colin gave me the Ally Door "Cards" [and a few other bits n pieces] from 6DBL.

[chunterer]

Apologies if I have not read it properly but I was wondering how many, and how many times, the BGT's and CGT's competed at Le Mans if at all?

[terence]

The LM entries were only in 64,BMO541B.[65 was with DRX265C. Obviously too early for BGTs as they did not begin production untill 66. The GTS 'C's did not do LM.The "GTS"'s first event was the Sebring 12hr in May 67,this was the 2004cc engined version. The "C" engine was first used in March Sebring 68 where the works used a C ,B, and a Midget.The C and Midget both won thier Class'es in that years event.

[chormy]

Well nice to find this site, Guys your knowledge of the CGTS is good to see, on a practical note, does anybody have technical data on the suspension and brakes of the C , my car a semi replica is undergoing more engine mods, but it will be time to look at brakes ie upgraded fronts not just pads and discs.
I have a 7/8 antiroll bar and links from Vic Young fitted and upgraded torsion bars is there any set up data for torsion bars.
In fact any setup info would be of use.

[Peter Mallett]

Welcome Chormy, hopefully Terry can assist you.

Interesting pic of a "B" GTS with flat bonnet but wide arches, used by Coys to advertise MG Live, in the June issue of Classic and Sportscar. Looks like a Targa Florio pic but no reg number so what was it?

I'll scan it and post it next week.

[terence]

Originally Posted by chormy

Well nice to find this site, Guys your knowledge of the CGTS is good to see, on a practical note, does anybody have technical data on the suspension and brakes of the C , my car a semi replica is undergoing more engine mods, but it will be time to look at brakes ie upgraded fronts not just pads and discs.
I have a 7/8 antiroll bar and links from Vic Young fitted and upgraded torsion bars is there any set up data for torsion bars.
In fact any setup info would be of use.

WElcome Chormy,sounds like you are pretty much there with you current set up,even more so if you are using something like Koni Classic Shockers.Dont forget that just about everything on the Works cars was kept as standard as possible,just to keep cost's to a reasonable level.As you already have the T/B upgrade you will possibly be running with a 3/4in suspension drop? this seems to be about the optimum in terns of general road/fast road/track use.There really is'nt much else to be altered/modified because of the TB set up,apart from dont pussy-foot with it approaching a bend,let it know who's boss!As for the brakes,if the calipers are in good condion,then why not just fit new [Original} discs and some proper pads? Should be more than enough and also, if you have a servo,rip it off and throw it away,its just another link in the chain that can go wrong.

[neil.pass]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Welcome Chormy, hopefully Terry can assist you.

Interesting pic of a "B" GTS with flat bonnet but wide arches, used by Coys to advertise MG Live, in the June issue of Classic and Sportscar. Looks like a Targa Florio pic but no reg number so what was it?

I'll scan it and post it next week.

Car 230 at the '67 Targa Florio was MBL 546E in its 4-cyl 2004cc guise but it did carry a front number plate, having looked at the picture Coys are using there is no number plate but it looks like 230?!? Another MGB was at the race wearing MBL 547E but i dont know what race number it used.

[neil.pass]

Here's a pic of MBL 546E at the '67 Targa

[neil.pass]

and here's a pic of my recreation of the MBL 546E as it ran at the '68 Sebring

[Peter Mallett]

Hi Neil,

That top pic looks very much like the one in C&SC.

Did MBL run with the all alloy body panels and the C front suspension?

BTW, a lovely re creation there.

[terence]

Apparently,it only had Ally Front wings,Bonnet and Doors,on a B chassis.

[chormy]

Terrance
Thanks the car goes well round the bends but on the straights it was /is a bit short on puff , I hate it when the lotus things go past me but mess me around on the bends.
Just had the engine internals upgraded from that of Dougs fast road, new forged shorter pistons longer forged rods, balanced and polished crank, roller rockers,new oil pump. All because the clutch release bearing went, I though oh well! good job as no 6 piston was not healthy and would have gone on me.

I did speak to a guy in Germany who has a number of Mgs including a CGTS , interesting and nice guy. Also has a talented metal work shop.
he has recast the original front brake calipers from one of the original cars, if i could afford such a item mmmnnn! His recreation is something special.
The brakes are ok but when your behind something thats worth a lot more than your car and he stops with modern brakes it a heart in mouth time. I have Mintex 1144 pads on drilled rotors and the do not fade as much as the original. On the rear just upgraded shoes, and uprated lever shock.


Neil, your car looks very nice, your side exit exhausts can you track day the car ie whats the db like, I have standard twin single box rears and the db has gone fom 104db origainaly to 110db , I was told the side exit are quieter ??

[chormy]

Found some pics along time ago of what may be a alloy engine, note the other cars in background, apparently only one survives in working order its in a modsport car in France??
the others failed . The engine bay is one of the works cars a unknown on maybe in france ? and the other is mine with the first alloy rad just before the fan blades broke and destroyed it.
Dougs old car was written off the one he had for the track his engine guy has a lot of info on that car, another was in a german museum I did have pics but can't find them.

[neil.pass]

The color photo is of MBL I think, I'm pretty sure it was the only one re-painted BRG after originally being painted red prior to the Targa Florio? Which also suggest its was the same monocoque used for both 4-cyl and 6-cyl installations? but with different front suspension set-ups.

[neil.pass]

Here's a picture of MBL getting a 6-cyl installed in Abingdon.

[neil.pass]

In the interest of keeping this thread going, here's a picture of the original 6 MGC GTS on a rare occurence together, cant remember what event it was but you can see the two factory cars RMO and MBL on the far right with John Chatham's '70 Targa Florio car next to them.

[Peter Mallett]

That had to be taken after 1970 then, because they sold the remaining chassis to Chatham in 1970(?).

Interesting treatment to the front valances on each one.

Looking at the pic of MaBeL I'm still intrigued as to how they worked the front suspension. The front sub assemblies are different between the B and the C so it isn't just a case of bolting bits on.

[terence]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

That had to be taken after 1970 then, because they sold the remaining chassis to Chatham in 1970(?).

Interesting treatment to the front valances on each one.

Looking at the pic of MaBeL I'm still intrigued as to how they worked the front suspension. The front sub assemblies are different between the B and the C so it isn't just a case of bolting bits on.

The monoque was a B because the D type was not ready,hence the use of MG GTS,saved having to actually designate a type.

[GBRM]

The picture looks like Silverstone and there was a big event at Silverstone around 87/88 where they got all the works MGCs together and we did a few high speed laps around the GP circuit - Colin P took me round in his car - Dad was a bit miffed about it as he wanted to go but I enjoyed it!!

[terence]

I think your right Gregor,I was supposed to have taken the replica VHY --- for Arthur but as I was racing my car,it was a bit awkward.