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Old 9 Nov 2017, 01:00 (Ref:3779551)   #1
Richard Casto
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Williams documentary

Apologies if there is already a thread about this. I searched and couldn't find one. Anyhow, I don't think I was aware of this film until today. I discovered it on Netflix and just finished watching it.

I have always been a Williams fan and tended to really like Frank. Particularly given his history in the sport. He is an icon.

My thoughts was that the documentary was well done. I learned things I didn't know (particularly how driven he is/was). I had no idea there was conflict between Claire and her brother Jonathan around her ascendence within the team. Claire looks very much like her mother. It is interesting that Frank had never read his wife's book that describes the period after his accident and its impact her and their family.

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Old 9 Nov 2017, 02:22 (Ref:3779559)   #2
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I also watched it this week and really enjoyed it -especially some of the archive footage.

I was, however, a little disturbed by some of the social dynamics portrayed by the film....
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Old 9 Nov 2017, 03:31 (Ref:3779567)   #3
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I was, however, a little disturbed by some of the social dynamics portrayed by the film....
by which i presume you mean some of the more personal family matters? i thought they were handled brilliantly, not dwelled upon but vital in the story of frank and his family.

i mentioned this film in the mclaren thread in armchair, but i really enjoyed it too. the historical footage was excellent, and the additional "dramatic" footage created to illustrate certain parts of the family story wasn't intrusive at all.

i particularly like how no effort was made to over-humanise either claire or frank himself. to have done so would have betrayed who they are, and taken it over to the slightly emotionally manipulative side of the spectrum where i personally feel the senna movie sits.

very much looking forward to reading ginny's book. she sounded like a wonderful woman.
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Old 9 Nov 2017, 03:57 (Ref:3779572)   #4
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Does anyone have the title of this doco?
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Old 9 Nov 2017, 04:12 (Ref:3779577)   #5
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Does anyone have the title of this doco?
It is called simply "Williams".

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Old 9 Nov 2017, 04:24 (Ref:3779578)   #6
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The full movie is also available on youtube. Roughly 1 hour 45 minutes long.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyXbNAZ69ew
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Old 9 Nov 2017, 03:16 (Ref:3779565)   #7
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Fangio's son Oscar claimed to know SFW during his F3 and F2 Temporada outings in the late 1960s.
Wonder if is sth about it in the documentary.

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Old 9 Nov 2017, 13:14 (Ref:3779613)   #8
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I agree, some of the family stuff was a little odd, and the brother is clearly being kept at arms length for some reason.

I kind of knew this was what Frank was like, but maybe did not realise he was SOO polarised.

She was besotted with him, and I guess that, and the kids are why she put up with it!

And deep down, I am sure he was with her obviously too
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Old 9 Nov 2017, 16:41 (Ref:3779641)   #9
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I agree, some of the family stuff was a little odd, and the brother is clearly being kept at arms length for some reason.
i think it's because claire is more like frank, with some of her mothers more human traits and the brother is predominantly his mother with some of his father. if it's the other way round there's no drama, but when the girl is more capable in a business setting it can create some friction with the brother. his reaction to the "does claire come down here?" question was very petulent, whereas claire's response was more considered and she was sad about the situation.

people are different, he's probably brilliant at *insert something here*, but as a son, in a male dominated occasionally macho environment, to have your younger sister asked to take a responsibility ahead of you in the family business, the thing by which siblings are judged, is very problematic. what he chooses to ignore is that he was probably given an opportunity to prove himself earlier in his life and didn't do a good enough job, and he either wouldn't see the big picture, or hasn't had the guidance to help him.

i think running the heritage side is a wonderful responsibility away from the stresses and strains of running the team, but he didn't seem to feel that way.

i'm sure there's more to it but as the daughter of the family in a similar situation i can absolutely see that claire's version of events will be at the core of it.
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Old 9 Nov 2017, 19:23 (Ref:3779676)   #10
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his reaction to the "does claire come down here?" question was very petulent, whereas claire's response was more considered and she was sad about the situation.
I had the same reaction. But... we are also clearly seeing an edited version of whatever interactions the filmmaker had with the family. So I would take that as the story he was trying to tell. Similar to the editing near the end in which the voice over talked about Frank not going to retire and that he was likely to die at the track (as they showed him falling asleep in the garage... with it looking like someone passing away... just before we woke up again). In fact that one scene was the only one in which I had a negative response. I felt like it was overly dramatic with respect to using that visual with that particular commentary (unnecessary)

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what he chooses to ignore is that he was probably given an opportunity to prove himself earlier in his life and didn't do a good enough job, and he either wouldn't see the big picture, or hasn't had the guidance to help him.it.
I know nothing of the family other than what I have read, but what you say is likely very true (in that sense that it is probably something that plays out day after day in family owned businesses). I can't point to a link, but after watching the movie I did some Google searching and thought I saw a comment in an article that said or implied that Jonathan as more reserved (or something like that.) It ultimately was some quality that to me was not advantageous for a leadership role.

I have my own somewhat (but not totally) fractured relationship with a sibling. It's never easy and also sometimes there are real issues that are not easily resolved even if that would result in a fairy tale ending.

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Old 10 Nov 2017, 22:47 (Ref:3779849)   #11
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the thing is, wnut... when you get involved with a man of the sport then you understand that you are second to his work life. it's just how it is. if you don't accept that and deal with it your relationship falls apart. plenty of women don't accept that, and aren't willing to be second in the relationship - and more importantly, have any children second to anything. but others stick with it - maybe because having them around the place all the time like in a civilian relationship would do their head in!

ginny went into the marriage knowing that was what he was like. she left her first husband for him. she knew he had all the groupies around him, and she coped with it. she knew what his life revolved around.i'm sure she felt frustrated by his lack of emotion, infidelity and commitment to her and the children but she got on with it, because those are the downsides of loving a man like him.

if he was that terrible a man, then she would have left him with the children and created a better space for them. she didn't. that ought to tell you how secure and safe she felt in the relationship. so why does that make her unfairly treated? you can't apply your standards to someone elses relationship...
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Old 10 Nov 2017, 22:50 (Ref:3779850)   #12
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Old 11 Nov 2017, 04:44 (Ref:3779877)   #13
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An excellent film but whoever decided to insert the footage of Le Mans 1955 and the appalling segment showing poor Bandini's burnt body had very poor judgement. The stuff was not even relevant to Williams' story, was gratuitous, crass and unnecessary . Uninformed viewers get to find out just how dangerous the sport was from Courage's death in a Williams De Tomaso.

That apart- very good indeed . I read Virginia's book and ended up disliking both her and Frank . Although far from uncommon in the sport, boasting about jolly japes escaping creditors and ripping off punters does not endear them to me. That said , his drive and achievements are extraordinary and were well illustrated by the film .

Claire comes over superbly - smart, compassionate , businesslike and endearingly human - considering how dysfunctional her family appears to be ('No , I haven't read my wife's book ..'). But her brother..wow ..there's a whole case study of bitterness and family schism there . He did not strike me as being quite the sharpest tool in the box compared to his sister.
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Old 11 Nov 2017, 05:15 (Ref:3779883)   #14
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Purchased a copy recently in one of the UK high street outlets for 6.49.

Santa has put it away, along with the McLaren story for Christmas!
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Old 11 Nov 2017, 07:37 (Ref:3779893)   #15
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Have not watched this doco yet. Waiting 'till seasons end, and a cold winters night. Sir Frank Williams is a man I admire greatly. A true inspiration.


Would love to see Williams win another championship. Sir Frank deserves it.
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