Point and shooter strikes again.

[Pigit]

I was at the HSCC meeting at Brands standing at the exit of sterlings when i saw this point and shooter trackside with no media vest and no wristband,is it just me or does anyone else get p*ssed off when you spend a lot of hard earned cash(and the flexible freind)on your kit and try your heart out to get accredited and you see this sort of thing,maybe i'm taking it to seriously but i was fuming,so i ask him how he got to get trackside and he waved some sort of paper in front of me saying i've got this,what it was i haven't a clue but is there a funny handshake or a special club i'm missing here.

[Stephen Green]

That's not anyone I have seen at Brands before. If it happens again, speak to the nearest marshal as we will then check his credentials and if he is not accreditied, we will have him removed by security. All photographers at Brands have to wear a wristband or tabbard. Sorry to hear you have had problems.

[WouterM]

Yep it happens everywhere. Even at Le Mans I saw two kids with tiny cameras trackside at the test day.

[Stephen Green]

The simple fact is that if they are there without the necessary accreditation, they are there illegally. That means they are not covered by any insurance and therefore the circuit would want to know immediately.

Most marshals would not want someone in their sector who should not be there, and will do their utmost to have the person removed. Don't forget that we are in direct contact with Race Control.

[Pigit]

The thing is there were marshalls there,so maybe he had permission but what was he doing there without a media vest or wrist band.

[Snapperjack]

It's not the size of his equipment that matters it is the lack of a media vest or wrist band that is the problem. Whatever was on that piece of paper worked.

As long as someone has the right vest or band on they could use a pin-hole camera if they wanted.

[WouterM]

Originally Posted by Snapperjack

As long as someone has the right vest or band on they could use a pin-hole camera if they wanted.

It's a waste of an accreditation though, especially if another 'proper' photographer is refused for it.

[Snapperjack]

Originally Posted by WouterM

It's a waste of an accreditation though, especially if another 'proper' photographer is refused for it.

You cant judge everyone by their equipment alone. Just because someone might have for example a D70 & 120-300 lens that does not automatically make them a 'proper' photographer. A P&S can produce excellent images easily useable by magazines reporting on a race meeting. As long as it gets his job done (and they have the correct media passes).

The absence of a media vest or wrist band is still the issue here.

[PaulSands]

He is a regular attendee at HSCC meetings I see him all of the time

[Pigit]

Was'nt questioning the equipment it was the lack of vest and wrist band,and snapperjack your right just because i have a D70 and a 120-300 lens it does'nt give me the right for accreditation.

[Az]

lol nice shots Pigit, particularly like the bokeh in the second one!

[Pigit]

Thanks AZ that would be 120-300 LOL

[Jaxs]

Pigit, are you a professional photographer?

[DWA]

The only problem is if he had not signed on and therefore has no insurance cover etc. Apart from that who a circuit/promoter/media office etc choose to accredit is absolutely not the concern of any other photographer. Provided a photographer has agreement from someone and has signed on etc then they should be allowed to work unhindered and without comment from anyone else, whatever the equipement and appearance.

[Pigit]

Jaxs No im not,Why.

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by Pigit

Jaxs No im not,Why.

So how do you think pro photographers may about you going track side and taking work from them.
I am a keen amateur and would love to go track side to get my shots which, BTW are used for various websites, but I am not allowed to and I accept it.
It all sounds a bit like sour grapes on your part to me, the guy had permission to be there so why try and cause trouble?

[Pigit]

Wasn't causing trouble at all,but if i do get track access i would be wearing a wristband or media vest just to be safe and noticed by the marshalls,faclemob do you think every photographer that gets trackside access is a pro i dont think so,there are alot of togs that are amateur like you and me and get trackside.

[Hubble]

Originally Posted by falcemob

.........the guy had permission to be there so why try and cause trouble?

This is what Pigit is trying to point out. Where is the evidence he has permission to be there? Just because he was not turfed out by the marshalls does not mean he had permission. He MUST have been issued with at least a wristband by the media centre staff, and normally any meetings on the GP circuit require the wearing of a tabard also. Yet none are visible. If he was not signed on and something happened resulting in an injury or worse, what do you think the implications would have been on a) the marshalls and b) the circuit owners?

In addition you shouldn't get into the whole 'taking work from the pro's' thing, we've done that one to death on here already. There are many media outlets that wouldn't be in a position to pay for images, so in these cases an enthusiastic amateur would not be taking work away from anyone.

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by Hubble

In addition you shouldn't get into the whole 'taking work from the pro's' thing, we've done that one to death on here already.

I must have missed that in the 7 odd years I have been here...sorry I'll mind my own business then.

[Jaxs]

Let's clarify. on Post for the HSCC, post 19, man carry camera and lens, obviously SLR, with no tabard and no wristband. he made the point of attracting the attention of the Marshals and clarifying his 'right' to be track side. He then went on to chat to the 'tabard' dressed photographers. Nobody brought out the rubber truncheons or bright lights to question his right to be there.

For anyone to be questioned by a spectator who is carrying a camera, well... words fail me for once.

If you feel aggrieved, bring it to the attention of the Marshals

The question, are you a professional?

The attitude of professional to amateurs, and this is not only Motor Sport, they give photographs away, undermine the standards and usually get in the way of someone trying to carry out his or her chosen profession.

Now, imagine, your walking along, minding your own business and someone from the other side of the wire, suddenly asks why you are there. Do you think the guy has got that far round the circuit without being asked?

I question your motives

[Pigit]

Jaxs you put as tho you was there,i ask the said gentleman a simple question about him being trackside without a wristband and tabard,as a mear ametuer photog am i not allowed to ask said question.If you look closly in the background there was also a gentleman talking to the marshalls without a tabard or wrist band,was he also a pro tog without a camera or was he just a freind talking,if you wasn't there how can you talk about said incident,that was the reason i did'nt say anythink to the marshalls because there was a feeling that it was one of there freinds.There i've said it now and i did't want to go down this route because without marshalls were would this sport be nowere thats all im going to say on this matter now...BYE

[924nut]

The key issue here is that once you are trackside you should always be highly visible - I personally would never go trackside without my tabard - and I would think that goes for most people that are rightfully signed on (pros or not)

[Stephen Green]

pssssst...marshals only has one L

Guys, it seems to me that in this case the guy was there ligitimally and therefore I don't see why we are prolonging the arguement? He showed whatever it was to the marshals on post who were satisfied of his credentials, that should be anough and quite frankly an end to the discussion.

I would point out that it is not actually part of a marshals job to check every photographers pass, we tend only to do so when a vest or wristband are not obviously visible.

[Owain Shaw]

He is wearing something black around his left wrist, looks to be done a little tight for a watch. I was signed on at an HSCC meeting at Cadwell (another MSV circuit) where all one was given was a day-glo orange wrist band of rather thin dimensions. The papers he is holding are in the left hand, it is possible what he showed the marshals was that wrist band.

Whatever, it's long since been cleared that he had whatever documentation he needed and I'm not really adding anything further to that ...

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by Pigit

If you look closly in the background there was also a gentleman talking to the marshalls without a tabard or wrist band,was he also a pro tog without a camera or was he just a freind talking........

Maybe he was a marshal (with one L Stephen)
Admin, can we have a "throw your teddy out the pram smiley" please