The Camel Saga (Merged)

Gerben24 · 4 Jan 2006, 14:50 (Ref:1494853)

I just read this very bad news; Pons has pulled the plug for the 2006 season. The reason: no main sponsor... Pons does intend to be back in 2007. This leaves Checa without a ride.

Bad times for motorised sports. The majority of the manufactures pull out of WRC, the same can still happen with F1, if the manufactures are going to split with the current format, Nascar is not getting any better with the proposals for the car of tommorow (or something like that) and 3 major sponsors have left MotoGP with the retirement of the Pons team as a result.

Mystery · 4 Jan 2006, 15:26 (Ref:1494866)

Bad news for sure but not sure I'd agree with the sentiment about it being a bad time for motorised sport generally. A bad time for the elitist side of it maybe, but lower categories appear to be flourishing in numbers e.g. the 250cc class, BSB, GP2, A1GP etc

Before too long the huge dollars being asked of people to support teams in the very top classes of all motor sport get questioned and if they dont get value in return then the sponsorship will no doubt end.

pink69 · 4 Jan 2006, 17:23 (Ref:1494914)

Motogp is beginning its own demise. The manufacturers wanted a series where they could show their technological might against each other and Kawasaki and Ducati came in as a result. But the costs are starting to pick the teams off now so unless either a new wave of sponsors start coming in or costs start coming down, I fear motogp grids may continue to lose top flight teams like Pons. Strange to think only 4 years after the regulations changed the series is already starting to struggle for teams and sponsors. Hopefully the change to 800cc will bring in more teams again.

chunder · 4 Jan 2006, 18:13 (Ref:1494943)

Dont think thats right to be honest
In all honesty the 800 cc rules will make it more expensive for eberyone concerened, coz every manufacturer currently involved is gonna have to build a completely new bike! How can that be cheaper.
I think they are going backwards anyway. The current rules do not promote maximum power at all, its all about driveability which means electronics, which means computers which ,means money. Who says the 800cc bikes are not gonna be more powerful. An RC45 pused out nearly 190 bhp in 750 form restricted by WSB rules!
I think its a retrograde step to be honest.\Pons will be back anyway, he is huge fan, but just couldnt get the cash together.\Real point is, who is gonna take Checa's place on the grid.\
Bet D'Antin is kicking himself now eh! There's a Spaniard who can ride for yer Luis

BootsOntheSide · 4 Jan 2006, 18:34 (Ref:1494967)

Correct chunder about 800cc bikes - attracting new manufacturers isn't the issue, attratcing semi-works or private teams is the problem, and a new wave of development costs and the inability to race year-old bikes won't help that. Anyone planning a private team will have to wait for 2008. And now we've lost Biaggi, Barros and Checa amongst others - viewing figures will surely suffer in the short-term.

SALEEN S7R · 4 Jan 2006, 20:26 (Ref:1495039)

Shame to lose Pons, but according to the article I have read Sito Pons is now concentrating on returning to Moto GP in 2007 with a package that can fight for the world championship. I really dont think that viewing figures will suffer this year, ok Pons are gone and so are Biaggi, Barros and Checa, but coming into Moto GP more signifcantly IMO are Dani Pedrosa and Casey Stoner. These are some of the guys that will be fighting with Rossi this year I think. Biaggi, Barros and Checa are all good riders yes but IMO they have had their chance and are probably a little past their best as it is. Time for some new blood and Pedrosa and Stoner are just that and I'd be willing to bet that both Pedrosa and Stoner will finish on the podium several times this year and perhaps even take a couple of race wins.

chunder · 4 Jan 2006, 20:39 (Ref:1495046)

Whoa thats a bold claim about Stoner and Pedrosa taking wins!. It took Hayden long enough and he had winning pedigree on winning bikes!
I think Dani might get a win but not Casey, we dont know what spec his bikes are going to be either.
Far as viewing is concerned Vale alwasy does us proud by waiting a bit before launching an attack and usually getting rubbish starts like Mick used to.
But he is sitll the big draw for fans, so cant see the figures going down too much.

SALEEN S7R · 4 Jan 2006, 20:47 (Ref:1495052)

Yes it is a bold claim about Pedrosa and Stoner taking wins, personally though I think it is achievable. Both though I feel will get at least podiums during the coming season, Pedrosa has been extremely fast during testing, proof of this is the most recent Sepang test where he had the 3rd fastest time overall over 3 days of running. If Stoner gets a machine that is anything like decent he should be capable of getting podiums, race wins are probably out of the question though. I wasnt clear in my inital post, what I meant was that both Stoner and Pedrosa are capable of acheiveing podium finishes in this years Moto GP championship and that Pedrosa is capable of race wins. Stoner isnt, not because of a lack of skill but because of a lack of factory support. IMO.

KE30MAN · 4 Jan 2006, 21:27 (Ref:1495076)

I think Casey might struggle with the machinery and Pedrosa with the larger bikes, but give them both a few seasons...

ASCII Man · 4 Jan 2006, 22:30 (Ref:1495118)

If they only just kept the 500cc 2-stroke formula...
All that 'changing this, changing that', MotoGP is starting to act like F1, for God's sake...

As the cliché saying goes, 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it!'...

Hazza · 5 Jan 2006, 08:02 (Ref:1495269)

All valid points, and what what it's worth I'll add:
* Casey and Dani will do better than nicky for the plain fact that they have been racing on theese circuits for the last 6 years, where as Nicky's been doing it for less than that.

* I don't dig the franchise deal, and I never have as I feel it makes it more difficult for a team to enter the series, and to make it worse there is no obligation as far as I am aware for people to have to utilise their grid spots.

BootsOntheSide · 5 Jan 2006, 09:02 (Ref:1495301)

Once you've been in MotoGP for 3 years, you should know all the circuits pretty well - and not having experience of the bike is a bigger issue to performance at first. Agreed about the franchises, although I don't think many new teams would be keen to enter this year anyway - maybe for 2007 it needs reviewing.

N I Tram · 5 Jan 2006, 14:16 (Ref:1495547)

WSBK will have a bigger and more balanced grid this year - I can see Rossi and Melandri winning most of the races between them, unless Ducati have moved forward. At least WSBK doesn't need a huge budget or works support to be competitive, as Chris Vermeulen has proved.

Hazza · 5 Jan 2006, 14:33 (Ref:1495568)

Useless fact for the day:

Haga won a race on a bike that they build from a showroom R1.

Schummy · 5 Jan 2006, 15:03 (Ref:1495590)

After they changed 500cc to MotoGP I was afraid it was going the F1 way, that I don't like as I like FIM GPs. We have had very good years of MotoGP (but 500cc was great too, and 125cc and 250cc too!), but perhaps now it is showing some alarming signs of "F-Onitis".

And a side note, I *hope* they don't drop 125cc... By the way, I don't like the age rule in this category. Why they don't put an age limit in 100 meters (track and field), lol!

I agree with ASCII Man, if you fix something that works, you will have a high probability of getting a worse result.

Yoong Montoya · 5 Jan 2006, 19:57 (Ref:1495803)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hazza

Useless fact for the day:

Haga won a race on a bike that they build from a show-room R1.

And from 18th on the grid!

chunder · 5 Jan 2006, 21:55 (Ref:1495860)

You cannot have a series that uses machines that have no relevance in todays market.
None of the big guys make two stroke bikes for the sports market, its as simple as that. And none of them have for a very long time!
I agree the 2 strokes were great to watch and harder to master at the limit.
But you would have never had a Kawasaki 2 stroke GP bike and you definately would never have had a Ducati 2 stroke bike. And i think the series is better as a result.
i think they will keep the smaller classes as we are hearing that the new bikes will be more corner speed orientated. And the manufacturers can sell 125 and scooter based bikes using the styling and at least they use 2 stroke engines. Besides the technology in the 250's and 125's is largely static until the likes of KTM and Derbi come in and try things differently. They move the goalposts and the Japanese have to jump to combat, I have no problem with that.

Ryan_Briscoe1 · 6 Jan 2006, 14:16 (Ref:1496207)

so what the hell does this mean for stoner next season? is there any other seats available?

Hazza · 6 Jan 2006, 14:38 (Ref:1496220)

Stoner signed for LCR racing, which have now secured Honda bikes.

http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=76225

**gomick** · 9 Jan 2006, 23:41 (Ref:1498229)

seems camel are now major sponsor of the yamaha moto gp team - could valentino & max turn up to camel pr events together in the future

looks like valentino has stole max's thunder again

chunder · 10 Jan 2006, 00:25 (Ref:1498253)

Well i think this is a weird one to be honest.
We were told that Vale didnt want a fag sponsor.
We were told that Gauloises left as a result of that!
Then it is revelaved that Vale didnt wnat a fag sponsor coz it would clash with Marlbors who are no dount paying fot the tests in Ferrari!
Which means eitehr Vale is lying or Yamaha canrt affors to have him unless they pay for it with fag money!

chunder · 10 Jan 2006, 00:27 (Ref:1498254)

I tell you what, I bet Sito is fuming now.
The sponsor he got into the sport just jumps ship to be with a rider that allegedly doesnt even want fag money adorning his biek.
And Sito has had to pull out coz the money they promised left with his rider.
I think Camel are a bunch of decietdul arses and I will not support them. They have deprived the grid of not one but two riders now and that stinks

ASCII Man · 10 Jan 2006, 00:54 (Ref:1498273)

So much for Vale's so-called "principles" that he doesn't want to represent fags...
Looks more like he has the "SHOW ME THE MONEY!" principle now.

SALEEN S7R · 10 Jan 2006, 03:14 (Ref:1498310)

I just guess it shows that money talks and ******** walks. Interesting switch from Gauloises to Camel, I wonder why Yamaha made the switch? I find it hard to beleive it was for financial reasons.

**gomick** · 10 Jan 2006, 04:44 (Ref:1498324)

are yamaha running 4 bikes or 2 in 2006 - if its only 2, that means we will be 4 bikes shorter in motogp.... make that 3, forgot about stoner!

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