Button in Hungary

sonic · 6 Aug 2004, 14:07 (Ref:1058279)

On another Webber Vs JB angle Its interesting how the two different drivers let their respective existing teams down:

Webber went to the jag factory and told his mechanics what he was doing in 2005, face to face like a man

Button has run away, switched off his mobile and let everyone down who helped him rebuild his career - like a ****

Honestly how will he look his engineers in the eye in Hungary?

and will his pit crew 'remember' to do all the wheels up?! [joke].

Kicking-back · 6 Aug 2004, 14:08 (Ref:1058281)

The team and Jenson still both want to do as well as possible for the rest of the season.

Mr V · 6 Aug 2004, 14:11 (Ref:1058286)

I have to say that (from an outside view, so maybe i'm wrong) i'm disappointed that Jenson has seemingly taken this route, however, if he thinks that this is the best thing for his career, then it's up to him!

darcym · 6 Aug 2004, 14:14 (Ref:1058290)

If the reports of how this has been handled are true, this could be the kiss of death for button. Frank dropped him last time, frank could drop him this time if there are problems. They way he has conducted himself at bar has been great, however to then (according to reports) do this - what team would want to gamble with button

GP Racer · 6 Aug 2004, 14:29 (Ref:1058309)

Quote:

Originally posted by Kicking-back
The team and Jenson still both want to do as well as possible for the rest of the season.

I think you forget the human side of this KB.

Yes, I'm sure the team and Jenson still want to do well, but whether conciously, or subconciously, they simply won't be at there best anymore. They will be deflated, they will be down about this whole mess. It seems that Jenson didn't make this move very smoothly, and there will undoubtedly be some hard feelings out there this weekend...

The team bosses will have there hands full, trying to motivate the team from this point on...

**garcon** · 6 Aug 2004, 14:34 (Ref:1058316)

There will be no problems for Button or BAR in Hungary, because he and the entire team are professional enough to forget 2005 and concentrate on the job in hand. Sure, the camaraderie will be affected, and it could feasibly take a slight edge off the performance, but remember, Jenson is still fighting for 3rd in the WDC and BAR is still fighting for 3rd (and a long shot at 2nd) in the Manufacturer's title.

And, naturally, a lot of stuff is reported and interpreted that may not be entirely accurate as far as how things were announced etc. Besides, Webber moving from Jag and Button m oving from BAR are two entirely different sets of circumstances - Jag are not, and probably never will be, competing at the top and it was obvious that Mark would move on.

Kicking-back · 6 Aug 2004, 14:39 (Ref:1058325)

Who won the final two races of 1993?

What team was he driving for the next season?

And we knew it already.

**Adam43** · 6 Aug 2004, 14:47 (Ref:1058332)

There is a difference there. Although we (and I suspect some involved) hardly have all the facts.

Although it seems the story came as a bit of a shock to all concerned. It had been leaked to one of the papers and Williams acted quickly to announce it late last night. How much time did it give Jenson to tell anyone? I know Dave says they work night and day, but I bet it was only the most dedicated and the cleaners there...

Matti Alamaki · 6 Aug 2004, 14:48 (Ref:1058337)

True but, Senna had completed his job comprehensively and was always going to leave McLaren with dignity.

Kicking-back · 6 Aug 2004, 14:57 (Ref:1058348)

The point Adam makes is right.

I now understand Williams and BAR have been talking about this for at least a few days.

Sir Frank hoped to sort everything amicably, but had to act last night by tipping off the BBC, because he'd heard someone at BAR had leaked the story to a newspaper.

Mr V · 6 Aug 2004, 15:01 (Ref:1058353)

Quote:

Originally posted by darcym
Frank dropped him last time, frank could drop him this time if there are problems.

Jenson knew full well that JPM would be driving for Williams from 2001 onwards and that he was a "stop-gap". It's a bit different now.

sonic · 6 Aug 2004, 15:01 (Ref:1058354)

Quote:

Originally posted by Matti Alamaki
True but, Senna had completed his job comprehensively and was always going to leave McLaren with dignity.

agree. KB and Adam don't you agree there is something seriously devious and downright rude about the way Button has conducted himself - i mean not telling BAR at all!?

Why announce the deal instantly at 10pm? Its surely only good manners to let the people you work with know first. As far as we know JB still hasn't actually spoken to BAR.

Even in the fastest timings Senna would have called David - then announced it to the world's media.

And as for Team harmony and 2004 Richards is now seriously P*** off! "I have got 400 people in this factory who have worked their socks off night and day and then the guy who gets all the credit and drinks the champagne turns around and ditches them." (reuters).

Mr V · 6 Aug 2004, 15:03 (Ref:1058359)

Quote:

Originally posted by sonic

Even in the fastest timings Senna would have called David - then announced it to the world's media.

Just like when he signed for Lotus?

sonic · 6 Aug 2004, 15:12 (Ref:1058375)

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr V
Just like when he signed for Lotus?

Ha! bit before my time that!

nevertheless, I don't think it really justifies it.

Richards was giving it the big father figure role for button here and believed in him when no-one else did - I would imagine its more personal than when Senna was at toleman.

Which lets face it was a bit of a loser team and Lotus was an obvious step up - unlike BAR in its current guise...?

Kicking-back · 6 Aug 2004, 15:15 (Ref:1058379)

Despite what David Richards says, and I understand his disappointment, he did know about this before last night.

And it was a leak on the BAR side that forced Frank to go public.

GP Racer · 6 Aug 2004, 15:45 (Ref:1058412)

I would not want to be in Jensons shoes this weekend...

Knowlesy · 6 Aug 2004, 19:34 (Ref:1058661)

I am very dissapointed in the way Jenson has conducted himself during this, I have to say.

I wouldn't like to cross Dave Richards like he has, put it that way. He is a tough man!

I think BAR's season is now running the risk of going a little flat as well, because the camaraderie will be destroyed. There is a team that was enjoying its successes together and sticking together through problems and then this happens.

There was nothing to stop Jenson from discussing this with Dave.......he couldn't make him sign a BAR contract after all!

Yoong Montoya · 6 Aug 2004, 21:36 (Ref:1058811)

Quote:

Originally posted by sonic
On another Webber Vs JB angle Its interesting how the two different drivers let their respective existing teams down:

Webber went to the jag factory and told his mechanics what he was doing in 2005, face to face like a man

Button has run away, switched off his mobile and let everyone down who helped him rebuild his career - like a ****

I don't want to sound ignorant but when Montoya signed for McLaren did he tell Williams face to face what his plans were for next year? I know it's a bit off topic, but I really hope he didn't do the same as Button and just run away.

Knowlesy · 6 Aug 2004, 21:43 (Ref:1058817)

He didn't....Frank got to know pretty much straight away IIRC.

Kicking-back · 6 Aug 2004, 21:53 (Ref:1058824)

And it was totally clear JPM was free to move, rather than a contracturally complicated case like this one

Hazard · 6 Aug 2004, 22:18 (Ref:1058849)

And focusing on the subject title...from how this is panning out (Button just on BBC News/5 live by the way) - I wouldn't be surprised to see Button da Matta'd for the rest of the season.

Sato san · 10 Aug 2004, 20:05 (Ref:1062505)

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr V
i'm disappointed that Jenson has seemingly taken this route, however, if he thinks that this is the best thing for his career, then it's up to him!

thats true....but then that doesnt explain why he has done it the cowards way does it ?...

He said on Speed Sunday interview that he paid management and Lawyers to sort all that out for him .....thats rather an arrogant attitude i think .....surley he is man enough to tell someone to their face and then let the management and laywers sort out the legal stuff....

Id say Jensons head has got a bit to big with all these good results hes had this year .....which is a real shame !

I think he will struggle like hell to look his mechanics in the eye this weekend ...and quite right too ...

Tweed · 10 Aug 2004, 20:41 (Ref:1062526)

Just been reading an Autosport from earlier this year where Damon Hill says Jenson would be " mad to leave BAR at the end of the season " and to " resist the temptation " to move. Oops!

It'll be interesting to see the mechanics faces in qualifying if Button were to put it on pole.

foreversideways · 10 Aug 2004, 21:56 (Ref:1062588)

Button has handled this as if he was a 13 year old child getting his dad to fight his battles for him.

Kicking-back · 10 Aug 2004, 23:32 (Ref:1062647)

Given that we don't know the full story and will never hear an unbiased version of it, we can't really say what Jenson did or did not do.

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