BMMC & Proban Overalls.

[thepits!]

Originally Posted by Fay

Whilst this may be a good idea, it was always good when the regalia officer had some stock. Lots of new marshals sometime turn up and want their overalls then and there, now they will have wait to have them delivered. Also if you rip your overalls and decide you wanted some on the day, again you will have to wait. Personally I think you may loose out on some sales. Is there no way regalia officers could just carry maybe a stock of 3, 1 medium, 1 large and 1 extra large?

There was a long discussion over this at the last council meeting - but in the end with the delivery promises from AWS it was agreed it would be impractable and illogical for the regalia officers to keep stock.
What's left of the stock of the old overalls will still be available.

[Ian Lewis]

Originally Posted by Dave Brand

Good news & bad news!

Two-piece & made-to-measure overalls will be welcomed by a lot of people; however, the bad news is the prices! My current overalls, the 'old' BMMC style, made by H T Hughes, cost me £39.50. It looks as though, to get a similar specification (leg pockets, radio loop, epaulettes, etc.) it will be necessary to buy the more expensive GPX at a cost, including postage, of £54.05. Even the cheaper style, with postage, comes to £45.24.

Not whingeing, just stating the facts! I do appreciate the big advantage to the club of not having to carry large stocks, especially of the sizes for which there is very little demand.

Dave,

How long has the current set of overalls lasted?

Ian

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by Ian Lewis

How long has the current set of overalls lasted?

Two years so far - that's about 90 days' use - & looking good for at least another year, probably two or more.

[Clive]

Gosh, my current overalls are at least 10 years old and are well patched, with loads of badges covering some of the repairs. They are wearing a tad thin on the bum, but have a lovely insert to reinforce them.

Question. Should we be in bright orange 'new' smart overalls to present a 'professional' image, which might mean a new set every year, and if so, who pays? or as we are at the mo with all shapes and states? Now there's an opportunity for a sponsor - all that 'free' advertising at every race meeting, just for the one off cost of issuing every marshal with a set of probans!!!

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by Clive

Now there's an opportunity for a sponsor - all that 'free' advertising at every race meeting, just for the one off cost of issuing every marshal with a set of probans!!!

That already happens! Racesafe (bike) marshals are provided with free overalls with the sponsor's name prominently displayed. The downside? No badges to be affixed, no riders' signatures allowed on overalls, the 'official' overalls must be worn at all meetings; the overalls they supply are quite basic - not what I'd wear given the choice.

[Stephen Green]

The BMMC overals are sponsored by Remguard so in some respects your question has been answered. I happen to disagree with everyone having to wear overals provided by a sponsor as it takes away the individuality of the person wearing them. There is also the question of whether a marshals sponsor would be acceptible by each circuit we marshal at.

I do agree that in a perfect world we would have our overals provided free, but as we all know, that's not likely to happen. There is also the question of choice. I prefer the standard AWS overals for example, others may prefer a different style or manufacturer. Thats part of the fun of marshalling I guess.

[Gridlock]

Sorry Stephen but as usual I cant agree. I see no problem in having the same overalls be it style or colour. Do we want it to display individuality or a proffessional team image. I would opt for the latter as we work as teams and want to be recognied as part of that team. Overalls indicate a corporate image. Hence we should encourage a sponsor that if not provides free overalls provides them at a much reduced cost.
If a circuit is not prepared to accept this then they must provide and alternative or we dont marshal there.
I know we would not need marshals without the circuit owners, racing teams and drivers who make the sport for us in terms of finance. However at present they do need marshals to run meetings and I agree with Clive that we should be more proactive in selling this opportunity for sponsorship and not take a defeatest attitude to the advantages it may bring.

[Stephen Green]

I can see your point but would argue that being orange (in the main) gives us a 'corporate image'. My comment regarding sponsorship related to someone, late say for the sake of arguement a cigarette company, wishing to sponsor/provide free overals, which would clearly be in breach of etiquette at most circuits.

I think there will always be some who prefer to buy their own overals, that is after all their choice. The BMMC overals are sponsored by Remguard, but then not every marshal is a member of the BMMC and so you would end up with some in BMMC overals and some in others.

I can see you point and in many ways agree with you, but the practicality is less easy to achieve.

[scorch]

The tone of this thread is getting to be very BMMC is everything to marshalling can i just say that, not every marshall in the country is a member of the BMMC, (i'm not and i have no interest in joining, but's thats another topic).

So it may be fine if the BMMC provide cheap overalls and you can all look the same and present a professional image but what about non members, you last thing you want to be doing is forceing marshalls to wear a particular overall (colour or design), because all that will do is turn away marshalls.

[Ian Lewis]

I am a member of BMMC but choose to wear AWS overalls.

No one is forcing anyone to wear a particular brand.

[Gridlock]

Whilst I am a member of BMMC I do believe it is "The Marshals Organisation" and therefore should have marshals interests as their prime concern. Which I believe in general they have and therefore deserve our support. However I am also "at present" a member of BARC, BRSCC, BRDC and MGCC. I notice that in most instances the prime concern of these organisations is related more to organising race meetings. I have no problem with this but believe in some instances there can be conflits of interest.
With regard to the breach of advertising etiquette. There are off course lines to be drawn but I am sure there are acceptable organisations who are not aware of the potential.
I do not think a corporate image for marshals would put people off especially if they didnt have to pay for them. There is one circuit that has a corporate image (Yes I know they pay for them) and I dont think they have any bigger problem in recruitment and retention than any other club.
If a sponsor was found I dont see that the overalls should just be available to BMMC but all marshals. Of course with a small charge to non members. ( An incentive to join BMMC).
I am sure majority would go for suitable clothing but with all this said we should not take away individual choice?
Does anyone have any comments about good and bad advertisments, or is this another Thread.
I can imagine Stephen in overalls sponsored by "VIRGIN"

[Dave Brand]

As I said in an earlier post, Racesafe does provide 'free' overalls. I've got two hanging up in the wardrobe, which I used when I was doing Racesafe events (BSB) because the rules are that the sponsored overalls, & only the sponsored overalls, must be worn at these meeetings. I've never, however, worn them at any non-Racesafe meetings, because they are not really very good for the job - they are, in effect, an orange Proban version of a standard industrial boiler suit. I prefer to buy a better garment which has been designed to meet the requirements of the job. The problem with 'free' overalls is that it's very unlikely that any sponsor would be prepared to pay for a more expensive option - you're going to get cheap & cheerful, with no choice as to style.

Nobody's being forced to buy BMMC, or any other, overalls - the choice is yours. At something like £10/year's use, it's not a major expense......

[The Fat Clerk]

Blimey after all this controversey I'm glad I wear Black ones for Cars & Orange ones for Bikes. All the time we are volunteers it's down to personal choice & long may it remain so.

[Stephen Green]

I think thats what I was trying to say but in a very verbose manner

[Garry Holmes]

Surely if a club can provide cheaper overalls to its members, however that is funded, then that must be a good selling point to potential new members wishing to join that club? BARC do it, so why not the BMMC? As Stephen says you have a choice, if you are a BMMC member, take up the offer from AWS and get some new overalls at a reduced rate, or get some other that cost more.

[jim69]

Even though I know Mike Newton well (Remguard) I do not know how much he contributes to the price of the overalls. However he has always supported the marshals in any way he can, and provided a car for the Oulton track day. (see seperate thread). I think as marshals we should offer the same support for him, and wear the overalls from AWS.

If overalls were provided free, how often would they be replaced? What rules would there be on who got them? Its just a can of worms.

When I need some more overalls I will be happy to buy them from AWS, and wear them with pride, being thankful that someone has at least made a contribution towards the cost.

Maybe Stephen could tell us how many marshals there are. Multiply this by £40, I think you will find this is a large sum of money for a sponsor to part with.

I welcome any comments on this.

[Stephen Green]

Jim, I am not sure how many marshals there are in the UK so am unable to answer that one.

I have the frist set of AWS/BMMC overals and wore them for the first time today (Race Car LIve). They are well made and of the same quality as any other AWS overal, so we are not being asked to accept a lower quality for the price we pay.

[Eric Ridler]

Originally Posted by jim69

Even though I know Mike Newton well (Remguard) I do not know how much he contributes to the price of the overalls. However he has always supported the marshals in any way he can, and provided a car for the Oulton track day. (see seperate thread). I think as marshals we should offer the same support for him, and wear the overalls from AWS.

If overalls were provided free, how often would they be replaced? What rules would there be on who got them? Its just a can of worms.

When I need some more overalls I will be happy to buy them from AWS, and wear them with pride, being thankful that someone has at least made a contribution towards the cost.

Maybe Stephen could tell us how many marshals there are. Multiply this by £40, I think you will find this is a large sum of money for a sponsor to part with.

I welcome any comments on this.

Since the original conception of the Remguard sponsored overalls circa 1995, over 1500 pairs have been sold. Thus Mike Newton's contribution runs into several thousand pounds and this from a racing driver who is still a member of BMMC. (Red Badge)

[Steve Tarrant]

Originally Posted by Garry Holmes

Surely if a club can provide cheaper overalls to its members, however that is funded, then that must be a good selling point to potential new members wishing to join that club? BARC do it, so why not the BMMC?

Do they? I have never publicly seen any scheme to reduce their prices.

Therefore I look at everything on the market, and choose what I feel is best for the HOBBY I enjoy, and will do the job I am there to do.

I am left questioning why people seem so concerned about wanting everything for free for their hobby. If you play football, you buy football kit. If you enjoy photography, you have to buy a camera, etc. So why do we see so much ranting about buying overalls????

Right, back to the wheelchair!!!!!!


Steve

[jim69]

Originally Posted by Eric Ridler

Since the original conception of the Remguard sponsored overalls circa 1995, over 1500 pairs have been sold. Thus Mike Newton's contribution runs into several thousand pounds and this from a racing driver who is still a member of BMMC. (Red Badge)

Thanks Eric.

[Mark Mitchell]

Originally Posted by Stephen Green

I have the frist set of AWS/BMMC overals

Any chance of a photo of them Stephen (Modelling them is not a requirement!)

[Pistonbroke]

Originally Posted by Steve Tarrant

I am left questioning why people seem so concerned about wanting everything for free for their hobby. If you play football, you buy football kit. If you enjoy photography, you have to buy a camera, etc. So why do we see so much ranting about buying overalls????
Steve

Well said Steve, couldn't agree more. While drivers couldn't enjoy their sport without us, the opposite is equally true. They shell out (ouch, sorry!) for cars etc, we shell out for overalls................

[Gridlock]

Steve
I suppose much depands how each person considers their contribution to the sport. If it is a hobby then no problem pay whatever it costs and get on with it.
If however you see yourself as a "voluntary worker" whose reason for being there is purley to enable the sport to take place then its no longer a hobby and you are a "volunteer worker" and according to the volunteer code of pratice volunteers should not be out of pocket in pursuance of their voluntary work.
I think most marshals I have met treat it as a hobby and dont seek a financial reward. However the gifts received from the MGCC each year are a very nice mark of appreciation.

[Stephen Green]

Mark, I will try and post a piccy later in the week.

[Sheila M]

I've already seen a piccy! It was on display at the BMMC AGM yesterday. The overalls look pretty good, which is more than can be said of the wearer