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Old 27 Nov 2023, 11:41 (Ref:4187509)   #26
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morninggents should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Another race ruined by the idiotic decision of the stewards to penalise Perez I don't know how much these idiots are paid but I think even peanuts would be too much. The problem with giving people power (but no resposibility) is that they are then hell bent on using that power.
In my mind I see Ferrari as the real second best team.
That being said, I thought Russell has a good race.

I haven't seen any other comments but I believe this is the second consecutive race ruined for Sainz by track problems. Do the FIA not employ track inspectors?
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 12:33 (Ref:4187516)   #27
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I haven't seen any other comments but I believe this is the second consecutive race ruined for Sainz by track problems. Do the FIA not employ track inspectors?
How is running your car too low a "track problem?"
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 12:47 (Ref:4187518)   #28
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RBR are facing a $7.4 million entry fee for 2024.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/r...ason/10552487/
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 14:00 (Ref:4187533)   #29
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Was 2nd really that important? This season, second place brings little in the way of kudos.....
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Just a little matter of $9 million!
Do you want kudos and the money, or the wind tunnel time bonus? Croft thought maybe the time was worth more, Brundle was you always go for highest place always
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 14:04 (Ref:4187534)   #30
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Originally Posted by morninggents View Post
Another race ruined by the idiotic decision of the stewards to penalise Perez I don't know how much these idiots are paid but I think even peanuts would be too much. The problem with giving people power (but no resposibility) is that they are then hell bent on using that power.

In at least one of the post-race interviews Perez said it was unfair because basically if you are diving for an overtake like that "you are out of control"....which doesn't seem like the best excuse for failing to make the corner and running an opponent off the track. At least when Verstappen does it you know its deliberate, rather than having run out of talent.....
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 14:32 (Ref:4187541)   #31
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Was 2nd really that important? This season, second place brings little in the way of kudos.....
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Do you want kudos and the money, or the wind tunnel time bonus? Croft thought maybe the time was worth more, Brundle was you always go for highest place always

Gotta be the time right?

Also think RB are serving their previous season budget penalty next year so they will have even less wind tunnel and CFD time then their 1st place finish allows..for a team like Merc who have a lot of catching up to do perhaps development time would have been more useful in those efforts?
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 15:52 (Ref:4187561)   #32
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Originally Posted by morninggents View Post
Another race ruined by the idiotic decision of the stewards to penalise Perez.
Well obviously I'm totally out of step with everyone else this time as I thoroughly enjoyed the race. I also disagree with morninggents over the Perez/Norris incident. Perez missed the apex by a country mile. Lando had given him a huge amount of room but he couldn't keep the car under control. He then produced another lame excuse for another bit of lame driving. I used to have a lot of respect for Checo, especially his ability to make tyres last far longer than others, but most of this season has been a disaster. I'll take another step out of line and predict he won't be in the car next year.
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 20:36 (Ref:4187603)   #33
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How is running your car too low a "track problem?"
I have not seen any reference to running the car too low, except for your post. On the other hand one of the commentators on Ch 4 stated that the track surface had been 'planed' where the bump was between sessions.
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Old 27 Nov 2023, 23:18 (Ref:4187613)   #34
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I have not seen any reference to running the car too low, except for your post. On the other hand one of the commentators on Ch 4 stated that the track surface had been 'planed' where the bump was between sessions.
Running your car too low is the only thing that causes it to bottom out over bumps lol!
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Old 28 Nov 2023, 06:40 (Ref:4187623)   #35
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Originally Posted by peebee2 View Post
Running your car too low is the only thing that causes it to bottom out over bumps lol!
It was not bottoming out that caused Sainz to lose control of the car. lol!
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Old 28 Nov 2023, 07:55 (Ref:4187624)   #36
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It was not bottoming out that caused Sainz to lose control of the car. lol!
Lol, yes it was. Maybe not in an official press release though. Lol!
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Old 28 Nov 2023, 08:12 (Ref:4187625)   #37
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Lol, yes it was. Maybe not in an official press release though. Lol!
I'm not referring to any press release - but the actual footage of the incident itself. From both onboard and external footage, you can see that the back end of the car becomes unstable before the bump in the circuit. You can even see a very slight puff of smoke from the rear tyres, before any bottoming out has occurred, as they lose traction.

The only reference that has been made to the car bottoming out and causing the incident has been your claim - that is unsubstantiated other than by adding 'lol' to the post.
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Old 28 Nov 2023, 08:36 (Ref:4187626)   #38
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Originally Posted by TrapezeArtist View Post
Well obviously I'm totally out of step with everyone else this time as I thoroughly enjoyed the race. I also disagree with morninggents over the Perez/Norris incident. Perez missed the apex by a country mile. Lando had given him a huge amount of room but he couldn't keep the car under control. He then produced another lame excuse for another bit of lame driving. I used to have a lot of respect for Checo, especially his ability to make tyres last far longer than others, but most of this season has been a disaster. I'll take another step out of line and predict he won't be in the car next year.
This is an interesting point and it shows you the difference between the great drivers and the good , middle pack drivers

In a midfield team Perez was great on tires but once in a top team he cannot hold a candle to the best like Ver, Ham or Alonso on tire preservation - it shows what makes a driver truly great driver and how easy it is to overlook this when they are always at the front
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Old 28 Nov 2023, 08:47 (Ref:4187628)   #39
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I'm not referring to any press release - but the actual footage of the incident itself. From both onboard and external footage, you can see that the back end of the car becomes unstable before the bump in the circuit. You can even see a very slight puff of smoke from the rear tyres, before any bottoming out has occurred, as they lose traction.

The only reference that has been made to the car bottoming out and causing the incident has been your claim - that is unsubstantiated other than by adding 'lol' to the post.
Yes, it bottomed out.

Yes, it caused the rear tyres the slip, causing tyre smoke.

Yes, they planed the circuit overnight (not because of some car failure, rather obviously).

Yes, Fred said it bottomed out.

No, I don't think they issued a press release for it.
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Old 28 Nov 2023, 09:21 (Ref:4187634)   #40
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Well obviously I'm totally out of step with everyone else this time as I thoroughly enjoyed the race. I also disagree with morninggents over the Perez/Norris incident. Perez missed the apex by a country mile. Lando had given him a huge amount of room but he couldn't keep the car under control. He then produced another lame excuse for another bit of lame driving. I used to have a lot of respect for Checo, especially his ability to make tyres last far longer than others, but most of this season has been a disaster. I'll take another step out of line and predict he won't be in the car next year.
I agree completely (with the Perez incident, not the enjoyment of the race though.... ). He was nowhere near the apex and forced Norris out. I don't agree with most of these silly penalties, but on past history, that one was perfectly reasonable.
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