Home Mobile Forum News Cookbook FaceBook Us T-Shirts etc.: Europe/Worldwide. eBay Motorsport Links Advertising  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Saloon & Sportscar Racing > Australasian Touring Cars.


View Poll Results: Is it time to award the ATCC & Bathurst 1000 for TCR?
Yes, within 1-2 years 7 26.92%
Maybe later (in 3-6 years time?) 6 23.08%
Never 13 50.00%
Voters: 26. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10 Jun 2020, 10:24 (Ref:3981105)   #1
V8 Fireworks
Veteran
 
V8 Fireworks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,928
V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Is it time to award the ATCC & Bathurst 1000 for TCR?

Many people are saying that the Australian Touring Car Championship Group 3A Supercars "party" is over.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 275 GTB-4 View Post
So sad to see a series that has gone close to beyond its remit...and people still want to hold on for parochial reasons...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Casper View Post
Some people do not realse the party is over because the guests have left they being the domestic manufacturers and the four door family car is nearly extinct.
In that case it would seem logical that the Australian Touring Car Championship and Bathurst 1000 titles instead be contested by ARG's TCR Australia touring car series.

Thoughts?
V8 Fireworks is offline  
Quote
Old 10 Jun 2020, 12:08 (Ref:3981122)   #2
bludvl_x19
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Australia
umop apisdn
Posts: 1,529
bludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridbludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridbludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridbludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
When Supercars falls over, it is logical that TCR becomes the new holder of the ATCC. Until that time, Supercars have a contractual arrangement that they contest the ATCC.

The Bathurst 1000 is an easier proposition. Just get a race weekend there, run a 1000k race, and convince everyone that yours was the original one.
bludvl_x19 is online now  
__________________
Supercars isn't the sport. The sport is motor racing.
Quote
Old 10 Jun 2020, 18:19 (Ref:3981190)   #3
NaBUru38
Veteran
 
NaBUru38's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Uruguay
Las Canteras, Uruguay
Posts: 8,497
NaBUru38 has a real shot at the championship!NaBUru38 has a real shot at the championship!NaBUru38 has a real shot at the championship!NaBUru38 has a real shot at the championship!NaBUru38 has a real shot at the championship!
You can't compare a 500hp V8 RWD car to a 300hp inline-4 FWD car.
NaBUru38 is offline  
__________________
"Show me a driver who didnít make a handful of errors this year, and Iíll show you someone who wasnít trying hard enough." - David Malsher
Quote
Old 11 Jun 2020, 02:54 (Ref:3981238)   #4
mayhem
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Aruba
On that Island in LOST.
Posts: 3,153
mayhem should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmayhem should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks View Post
Many people are saying that the Australian Touring Car Championship Group 3A Supercars "party" is over.





In that case it would seem logical that the Australian Touring Car Championship and Bathurst 1000 titles instead be contested by ARG's TCR Australia touring car series.

Thoughts?
Arent you burying a body that still has a pulse?
mayhem is offline  
__________________
The Jerk Store rang...
Quote
Old 11 Jun 2020, 04:43 (Ref:3981241)   #5
Mixer
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location:
Surry Hills, NSW
Posts: 5,621
Mixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks View Post
In that case it would seem logical that the Australian Touring Car Championship and Bathurst 1000 titles instead be contested by ARG's TCR Australia touring car series.
A bit premature there aren't you?

You're talking about a series where the promoter still owns more than half the cars and are propping up the rest and if the wind blows in a different direction TCR would disappear just as quickly as GT-P did. It is eerily similar.

Also a series that is being splintered from within by eTCR. VW & Audi won't be the last to go.

Other than Honda and Hyundai nobody else is really serious about it, the rest of the cars quite literally wouldn't make 1/4 race distance at Bathurst. Hell the Subi was a basket case when it was new, and the Astras are orphaned, and the Audi and Golf unfortunately will fall away from being competitive as the existing cars get updates.

GRM's cars show flashes of speed but don't finish races anywhere.

The Lynk and Co will win WTCR again and I bet fold up their tent without being BoP'ed in any national series.

GRM, Wall Racing and HMO put on a show, but they are not prime time anything.
Mixer is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Jun 2020, 08:46 (Ref:3981477)   #6
one five five
Veteran
 
one five five's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,851
one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridone five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by bludvl_x19 View Post
The Bathurst 1000 is an easier proposition. Just get a race weekend there, run a 1000k race, and convince everyone that yours was the original one.
Spot on, couldnít have said it better

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mixer
You're talking about a series where the promoter still owns more than half the cars and are propping up the rest and if the wind blows in a different direction TCR would disappear just as quickly as GT-P did. It is eerily similar
The part-owners of Supercars have been propping up the grid to various degrees for 24 years to varying degrees havenít they?
one five five is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Jun 2020, 08:57 (Ref:3981480)   #7
Mixer
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location:
Surry Hills, NSW
Posts: 5,621
Mixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Err well the part owners of Supercars are the teams themselves so it's kind of a ridiculous assertion really. Supercars has never owned or purchased cars or paid contracted teams to run cars and pretend they owned them off their own bat....

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk
Mixer is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Jun 2020, 21:23 (Ref:3981625)   #8
Compromised
Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 691
Compromised should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I liked TEAM SYDNEY's COCA COLA car...
Compromised is offline  
Quote
Old 13 Jun 2020, 00:39 (Ref:3981645)   #9
bludvl_x19
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Australia
umop apisdn
Posts: 1,529
bludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridbludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridbludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridbludvl_x19 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Compromised View Post
I liked TEAM SYDNEY's COCA COLA car...
Well played.
bludvl_x19 is online now  
__________________
Supercars isn't the sport. The sport is motor racing.
Quote
Old 14 Jun 2020, 21:16 (Ref:3982109)   #10
Matt K
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 784
Matt K should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
There is no comparison. All these years of ATCC + more than 20 years of Supercars is the heritage of VASC while TCR Australia is just some poor national championship that is part of global regulations made for cheap racing, which have their own 'top' championship - WTCR. Supercars are way more exciting and better racing cars than TCR and winning Supercars means that you really ARE Australian Touring Car Champion. Winning TCR Australia means winning just some national championship of minor importance.
Should I go on?
Okay, I understand, Supercars is now in a difficult situation but it is just time for a change, not to pretend the championship is now dead and unimportant. TCR Australia could be on its support bill as a feeder series but as long as Supercars exists this will be the premier motorsport category in Australia.
Matt K is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Jun 2020, 08:29 (Ref:3982143)   #11
one five five
Veteran
 
one five five's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,851
one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridone five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt K View Post
There is no comparison. All these years of ATCC + more than 20 years of Supercars is the heritage of VASC while TCR Australia is just some poor national championship that is part of global regulations made for cheap racing, which have their own 'top' championship - WTCR. Supercars are way more exciting and better racing cars than TCR and winning Supercars means that you really ARE Australian Touring Car Champion. Winning TCR Australia means winning just some national championship of minor importance.
Should I go on?
Okay, I understand, Supercars is now in a difficult situation but it is just time for a change, not to pretend the championship is now dead and unimportant. TCR Australia could be on its support bill as a feeder series but as long as Supercars exists this will be the premier motorsport category in Australia.
How does the ATCC lose any stature just because the ruleset might be used overseas?

When the ATCC used Group A regulations, Group A had their ďtop tierĒ ETCC and WTCC, did that lesson the importance of the ATCC?
one five five is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Jun 2020, 09:03 (Ref:3982151)   #12
Matt K
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 784
Matt K should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I'm not saying this is the only reason but it adds to it all. Yes, in the past we had what we had but it was the past. By saying TCR is global I wanted to highlight that the ruleset is just created for some minor national championships and I can't really imagine TCR Australia getting more important than Supercars and the ruleset is one of the reasons.
Matt K is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Jun 2020, 11:21 (Ref:3982168)   #13
chavez
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Australia
The Basin, Victoria
Posts: 2,386
chavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt K View Post
I'm not saying this is the only reason but it adds to it all. Yes, in the past we had what we had but it was the past. By saying TCR is global I wanted to highlight that the ruleset is just created for some minor national championships and I can't really imagine TCR Australia getting more important than Supercars and the ruleset is one of the reasons.
WTCR is the only touring car category that does have World Cup Status.
chavez is online now  
__________________
Real race cars don't have doors.
Quote
Old 15 Jun 2020, 12:07 (Ref:3982173)   #14
Matt K
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 784
Matt K should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
And what does it add to TCR Aus vs Supercars discussion? We talk about ATCC title, not the world championship status. But truth is, in my opinion, winning Supercars means more than winning WTCR in which barely anyone is interested. Definitely it means more than winning TCR Australia, that's for sure.
Matt K is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Jun 2020, 12:29 (Ref:3982176)   #15
V8 Fireworks
Veteran
 
V8 Fireworks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,928
V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt K View Post
As long as Supercars exists this will be the premier motorsport category in Australia.
It would help if there was only one touring car category. Splitting entrants across the Australian Touring Car Championship and the Austalian Super Touring Championship weakened both categories... The quality of the ATCC increased considerably when teams like Brad Jones Racing and Paul Morris Motorsports (formerly LoGaMo Racing / BMW Motorsport Australia) came back into the field.

The quality of the TCR Australia series would likely rise in a similar way, if many of the teams and sponsors come across to affordable TCR from a defunct overly expensive Supercars series.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt K View Post
winning Supercars means more than winning WTCR in which barely anyone is interested. Definitely it means more than winning TCR Australia, that's for sure.
You're presuming that Supercars will continue to exist, which is exactly the troublesome point!

You said so yourself...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt K View Post
I think it's unlikely to see any of them entering at the moment...
So no new manufactuers and just Ford vs Ford:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt K View Post
If there are only Mustangs then I'm probably not that interested.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem View Post
I doubt Ford would be interested either.
Resulting in the inevitable conclusion:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Casper View Post
The reality is it [Supercars] has no future commercially and once Archer get out who has the capital to support it?
Supercars was and is so reliant on General Motors Holden, that very soon when Holden no longer exists, it will cast doubt on the very existence of the Supercars category.

Meanwhile TCR is reasonably cost effective touring car racing with a wide variety of brands. It's arguably the perfect category for the Australian Touring Car Championship and Bathurst 1000km race. The cars are a bit slow and sound bad, but that doesn't matter if the on-track action and battles are good -- having an influx of high quality teams, drivers and sponsors from Supercars would very much help that cause.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaBUru38 View Post
You can't compare a 500hp V8 RWD car to a 300hp inline-4 FWD car.
The latter is still a touring car and represents a variety of vehicles you might actually buy. Mustang GT sales aren't nearly as numerous as four cylinder econobox (sports version or economy version) sales, as Mustang GTs are just a bit too impractical and use too much fuel for most people.

Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 15 Jun 2020 at 12:50.
V8 Fireworks is offline  
Quote
Reply

Bookmarks




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
History of ATCC/V8SC/VASC & other Touring Car Television coverage & TV deals pre-2015 one five five Australasian Touring Cars. 23 13 Aug 2017 01:52
[V8SC09R18] SuperCheap Auto Bathurst 1000, Mt Panorama Bathurst NSW (Now with poll!) GTRMagic Australasian Touring Cars. 699 13 Nov 2009 08:25
Bathurst 1000 about time - booze limits... fomoco Australasian Touring Cars. 24 12 Sep 2008 05:34


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:22.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2018 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.