Has the axe fallen in the right places?

[Ian Sowman]

I'm surprised that there isn't already a thread on this.

These are the series that have been refused a permit for 2006 by the Race Championship Control Panel:

Modified Production Saloons
Roadsports
Thorougbred Sports Cars
Cockshoot Cup
Scottish MINIs
SEMSEC Single Seaters and FFords
JEC Saloons

Now, as I understand it BARC had no intention of running ModProds in 2007, nor did 750MC plan to run Roadsports. So I think in those cases it is more a question of permits not being applied for.

Thoroughbred Sports Cars tend to be rather variable in grid numbers - too many similar championships here. Everyone who races here should find a home (although I suspect this will survive as a series).

Then we come onto some regional series: the Cockshoot Cup, which gets mediocre rather than dreadful grids; the Scottish MINIs which tends to get about a dozen cars but, without exception, provides the best racing of any class I have seen this year; and the SEMSEC single seaters. Now, although I'd suggest that SEMSEC should work with BARC SE on the open-wheeler front, I'm not sure the MSA should have been getting too het up about the others.

JEC Saloons is an odd one, in that it has averaged a very healthy 22 cars this year but seems to have been damned on past form.

These championships have been given notice to improve:

SEAT Cupra - may get an upturn with new cars in future.
SCSA - as Marcus Pye says in Autosport, beyond help.
VSR/Super Silhouettes - cracking on paper, but perhaps time to shelve it.
Fiats - where have they all gone?
Club F3 - a fair cop based on numbers, although the action has been decent.
Metros - perhaps they should merge with the Fiats...
Scottish Legends - who are they hurting exactly?

The problem is, there is a way of avoiding being bitten by the panel. Well, a couple actually.

1) Run as a series - which some of the above may well move to do, so what has this mullarkey solved? But already running on such a basis are the likes of Ferrari Open and AMOC Mid-Engined Sports cars, which attract paltry grids and are often a turn-off to spectators, and can't be that much fun for competitors.

2) Run multi-classes as separate races on one permit. Mighty Minis and their Super and Xtreme brethren are one example; Club Formula Ford is another (although thankfully the two FF1600 segments just about provide acceptable grids).

So have the right championships been axed and warned?

[Tim Falce]

There is some confusion over the Thoroughbreds as they seem to qualify for championship status but have been refused for some unexplained reason.

[Dan Friel]

Metros are a MGCC series, so should merge with Cockshoot or Total Butler...

Fiats are probably a victim of italian build quality and rust. Why aren't there Puntos running??

750MC Caterhams will run as a "series" not a championship I believe, but Roadsports are gone. The grids need to improve as the 750MC would rather have more financially benefical grids as part of their package.

I'm surprised by the Thorougbred Sports Cars being on the list. I've never seen a bad grid, but then again I haven't seen them this season.

[Tim Falce]

Dan, the Thoroughbreds have had good grids this year, an average of 18.6 per race last year and 21+ this year. The MSA decision is to be appealed however.

[Snapper Baz]

Ian, the VSR/SS's at Brands the other week (see my picture in Aut'!; ) had a good grid (15 actually)and the racing (up front) was very good throughout the weekend. The BRSCC are actively trying to push the series and I'm sure I read the other day that they are trying to get the VSR's out in some reasonable numbers with some sort of push, unfortunately I think there was only one out at Brands. I wouldn't mind betting that this will be a series to watch next year as it has a good deal of interest it seems...I have been know to be wrong once though in the past!!

[The STIG]

Can someone explain the difference between a series and a championship please?

I'm sad to see the Mod Prods go, however with the grid steadily shrinking it was on the cards - However the Scottish Minis seems ridiculous!

[R59]

The issue with SCSA is internal (probably infernal!) politics.

Rookie training (or lack thereof) has kept people out of the series this year due to the requirement for all new drivers to be licenced specially to race on the almost flat "oval". I understand some of the drivers in the "queue" as being unsuitable having no ARDS licence.

They can red card it if they like, but it will still happen while there is a will from the teams/owners to make it happen. It could run as a "Cup" as it did before it became a championship in the first place!

The best way forward is for the circuit owners to take it all in-house, and promote it themselves, and roll a share of the profit from the gate into the series (like NASCAR). If the series is a success, they win. The series wins. If it really fails, then that's it, shut Rockingham, and then look back and learn from the mistakes. There were plenty of them.

It needs a BIG title sponsor willing to put money in to market the series properly to the general public, as well as the converted.

It needs more ovals to race on - sadly, the longest of our "short" ovals offer no faclilites for this type of racing (no proper pit area), and are shabby to say the least (except Wimbledon which is a shining example of how to operate a short oval!)

If the Silverstone 1/2mile oval goes ahead, it MUST be banked properly (30 degrees). Rockingham is only 1.4miles, and the MSA put the mockers on it having proper banking. Even the late Tom Delaney wondered what happened to the banking! What the .... do they (MSA) know about proper oval racing?

Another IF - upgrade Mallory, make the 1-mile oval proper and flat (get rid of the "bump" at the end by the Esses), and put in a decent pitlane - there's another venue for it.

Then there's Jochen Mass' idea of bringing Nascar Busch cars to Europe, siting SCSA as a feeder series.....

The cars are now "very" cheap. The only hurdle is the rookie training rules. It's a National A series, so it's not like a championship for people who've never raced before! Maybe they should up it to Intl. Open, and drop the rookie training which will let drivers of experience in without the need to jump through hoops.

Moving on to the rest of the list....

Thoroughbred Sportscars? I don't understand this one either!!!!

Fiat Challenge - Where the Punto's ? They all have "Bad Boy Extreme" bodykits on them with 10" exhaust tailpipes and stereo's bigger than Motorhead's PA setup for the Hammersmith Apollo! riding up and down the local highstreet.

It's a shame about Roadsports - it used to thrive, but hey, that's the way the cookie crumbles.

I feel the SEMSEC single seater saga is more down to their dates clashing this year with BARC-SE, and other meetings - with their competitors "shared" between each other.

The JEC Saloons - again, does not compute.

I never saw the worth of the Cockshoot Cup as the people in it seem to be from the other MG championships as a bit of an extra race on the day. Why not just make the existing races "double headers" or "twin races".

At least this time, there is a net reduction in the number of championships for the first time in absolutely ages.

Final shot... Why hasn't the BTCC been shown a yellow card for lousy grids?

Rob.

[R59]

Originally Posted by The STIG

Can someone explain the difference between a series and a championship please?

I'm sad to see the Mod Prods go, however with the grid steadily shrinking it was on the cards - However the Scottish Minis seems ridiculous!

A series doesn't score points (officially) - there would be no recognised champion.

A championship is just that.

I'm sad to see Mod Prods go, but it's run it's course. I feel that Trackdays are probably responsible for most of that.

Rob.

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by racing59

A series doesn't score points (officially) - there would be no recognised champion.

A championship is just that.

Thanks for that Rob.

[Snapper Baz]

Your right Rob, BTCC has had some awful grids over the last few years but unfortunately unlike SCSA there seems to be a fair bit of money around from manufactures who like the throwing money away treating guests etc and having a good time-the grid sizes are probably ignored by those who turn-up just to get pi****d and nothing more.

[Ian Sowman]

And as MN points out this week, BTCC grids are set to hit a 14-year high this weekend.

As for Cockshoot Cup - theoretically it is a 'regional' series based in the North West. But as far as I am aware, everything in that can race in one of the other MGCC championships, or if they want to stay in the NW I suppose they could do BARC NW...

[R59]

One other point - you can't amalgamate the SCSA with anything else anyway!

It's the only series to run on the Rockingham oval other than the Pickups, and you can't amalgamate those two.

Baz - BTCC is Corporate Banger Racing.

Rob.

[flagwaver]

Racing 59 why on earth do you think any circuit will invest money to make an oval circuit? SCSA has only managed reasonable grids when they were getting paid to race. Ask yourself why the last round had the largest grid so far this season.
As far as I am concerned oval racing like any other form of racing should survive on it's own merits.
Rallycross is just about keeping itself going (politics does play a part in this)
Yet we still hear from rallycross drivers about the lack of investment in there courses, but why should a circuit owner invest in something that may not happen due to lack of entries etc.

[kipper]

I do seem to remember reading that the criteria would be less stringent regarding championships which are somewhat unusual or important, which explains why the BTCC (and I believe T Cars, even though it is not a unique championship any more) has never had a problem despite its poor grids. I had thought that regional championships were also dealth with more leniently, which does make the decisions over the Scottish championships more unfathomable. Regardless of the mechanics of the permit issuing system, one does hope that Thoroughbreds and JEC Saloons can regain their championship status if they so desire.

Personally, I'd like to see more championships being merged such as a combined Metro/Uno championship outlined by Ian, although for this idea to work on a significant scale (i.e. across club motorsport) it would require a number of clubs to work together of which the desire may not be there.

However, one thing I wouldn't like to see is to prevent championships converting themselves to a series. In my view, most people don't understand or care the distinction between the two and when confronted by a single figure Ferrari Open or Radical Challenge grid (highlighted to provide an example) simply regard it as a poor show.

[Al Weyman]

Sad to see ModPrds die, I put a lot of work into it, still it lasted 17 years so not bad I guess in this day and age. Maybe it will live on with the CTRCC but some careful thinking has to be done.

[Woolley]

It's a step in the right direction, but as has been said, it won't stop anyone running the series, just means it counts for even less. I was amused to read the words of the Scottish Mini co-ordinator as quoted in Autosport:

"We are trying to build a new championship. We've had four years and it's slow going but we're getting there. It's so short sighted. Killing something that's got a good chance of moving forward is not constructive."

All I can say is, 'MSA, save us from these co-ordinators'. 4 years is not a 'new' series and if it's still struggling it's probably had it's best years. If he wants to keep going, amalgamate with something (probably should have run within a class for something else in the first place until it was able to demonstrate sufficient numbers). Exactly the sort of attitude that's ruining club motorsport, IMO.

Oh, and well said Marcus Pye, as usual.

[Ian Sowman]

I do disagree on the issue of the MINIs on the grounds that it is a regional championship; it is the major series in Scotland attractive to young drivers; and despite the smallish grids it does, as I say, provide better racing than any other championship that I have seen this year. And as someone who follows FF1600 and commentates for 750MC that is saying something...

If any regional championships do need targeting it is those that getting perhaps 15 cars on the grid in 7 classes.

[Al Weyman]

Slightly off topic but in answer to some of Rob's comments on SCCA and Rockingham.

May I be so bold as to suggest that not allowing the full banking would make levelling the site for housing in a few years down the line so much easier as I really cannot understand why they had to submit to this MSA ruling. I personally think that there is evidence that the whole thing has been orchestrated towards this end from day one, I am a simple man and do not know the ins and outs of how these planning things work but when I am told and have actually witnessed sound engineers recording decibles around the track on race day on behalf of Barrett Homes (the new majority owner I believe) I get very. very suspicious and very, very cynical.

[Peter Mallett]

Hmm,

Metros were stopping at the end of this season anyway as I understand it. They will no doubt merge with the Total Butler Championship.

Like many people I never understood the need for the Cockshoot Cup. It was supposedly a North Western Championship but ran on circuits all around the country.

How would the Mod Prods work with the CTCRC Al?

[greenamex2]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Hmm,

How would the Mod Prods work with the CTCRC Al?

The series are currently pretty close in terms of regs already. The mod prods get some weight savings and dry sump, that about it.

About the only 'sticking point' for most people will be whether slicks are kept or not. I don't believe a decision to keep them would stop a merger, it would probably just affect whether we could bring across Toyo as a sponsor or not.

[Chris Y]

Few odd decisions and surprises in that list for sure!

The warning for the SEAT Cupras was a bit of a surprise - I thought they had pretty good grids this year generally. Other BARC champs like Westfields, SCSA and Mod-Prods, no big surprises there, but then other BARC champs which have been dwindling a little haven't shown up on the radar, which is odd - championships like 2CVs, Welsh Sports/Saloons, BARC Clubmans for example have had some pretty poor showings this year. I don't have any averages though, so can't really be sure.

I too thought regional champs would be cut some slack. Strange to see Scottish Legends on the warning list - Legends are extremely popular. Mind you, the Scottish variants did themselves no favours by going to Oulton and Anglesey and fielding about 5 cars! That must have dropped the average somewhat.

Very surprised at the Jags! Saw them at Snetterton, and they looked in rude health. With a 22 average field, I think they should have been spared the axe.

Fiats. This is a case of very, very poor management, if I may be so bold. In Ireland, the Puntos were introduced to the Unos a few years ago, and gradually most of the Uno runners have 'moved up' to the Puntos. The same cannot be said of the UK series, and it's baffling as to why. 5 years ago there were loads and loads of Unos, and I actually seriously contemplated joining the Fiats, but now I'm glad I didn't.

Also, I was wondering why they couldn't open up the regs to allow the Tipo, for instance, which seems to be slightly more abundant than the Uno, but otherwise quite similar (no doubt I'll be proved wrong there).

As for series that really should be on the culling list, where are the T-Cars? Really, what is that about? As far as I'm aware, they've been limited to 9 cars since the start.. Why? And if this restriction has been lifted, and they still can't muster full grids, then they should face the chop, same as any other. No longer can they say they're the only championship for 14-16 year olds either.

[Ian Sowman]

Scottish Legends were thin on numbers at Anglesey at Oulton, but did share the grids with UK Legends so it wasn't a major problem.

Interestingly, SAXMAX - a T-Car rival if you like - is expecting to field two full grids throughout next season.

[kipper]

Originally Posted by Chris Y

Other BARC champs like Westfields, SCSA and Mod-Prods, no big surprises there, but then other BARC champs which have been dwindling a little haven't shown up on the radar, which is odd - championships like 2CVs, Welsh Sports/Saloons, BARC Clubmans for example have had some pretty poor showings this year. I don't have any averages though, so can't really be sure.

If my understanding is correct, the average figures for grid levels are calculated using 2005 data. Therefore it is quite possible for a declining championship to last for a couple of seasons pulling in small grids. Take the Welsh Sports/Saloons for instance, this year grids have generally been quite poor, with an average grid of just over 11 cars if one discounts the JEC Sports v. Saloons, TVRs and TR Register that have raced with it on occasion. However, if 2005 figures are used then the average grid number is significantly higher due in part to some impressive grids at Pembrey on occasion and a capacity field at Thruxton.

I guess the problem is that if more up to date figures are used then decisions regarding championship status would not be taken until even later in the year which could create a great deal of uncertainty regarding the future of some championships and may deter some people from entering.

[JamesH]

Originally Posted by Ian Sowman

Interestingly, SAXMAX - a T-Car rival if you like - is expecting to field two full grids throughout next season.

I was surprised when the 750MC came up with these -wasnt sure they would be succesful at all with T-Cars already going. But I am happy to be proved wrong, and I think its to do with the boy racers all using Saxo's and the 750MC thinking up a good name!! The cost is pretty low too, so those 'drivers' who spend 10k on blinging up their road car can spend the same and go racing instead. T-cars doesnt seem to have the racing road car image that SaxMax has that is so attactive to the youth of today (tell that to youth of today though, and they wont believe you...)

750MC roadsports case cannot have been helped by the ruinaway wins of the Noble - who wants to compete when you have no chance?!

James

[mark77]

James, I agree its a shame for Roadsports - there must be a load of eligible cars out there, but the Noble's did kill it (why race a car like this in a club series)