2013 Liqui Moly Bathurst 12 Hour: 8-10 February

[MagVanisher]

If GT300 join in the grid for the 12 Hours of Bathurst (when the BoP between them and GT3 has establish a fair parity), I better hope that Super GT might participate on Mount Panorama...

The only thing that is missing in Japanese GT racing is longer races for up to 12 to 24 hours.

[GTRMagic]

Is there anything to be read into MPC trying to unload an Audi R8, and one of the team's transporters on my105?

[Sheep Stations]

Hopefully expanding the Audi part of their businesss and needing a bigger transporter?

Or a customer has pulled the pin, it happens.

[cptkablamo]

Originally Posted by R4z3rw33n

Adding GT300 is a pretty decent idea.

The only (technical regulations) issue which arises is that the SRO BoP reference set (which B12H employs) doesn't take into consideration GT300. Which means the 12 Hour organisers either adopt the SuperGT BoP reference set (which considers this) or, attempt to independently enact balance between the two categories (which seems pretty risky for a single event, with no reference)..

What does the VLN use for BoP? Could it be an alternative method.
As the B12Hr isn't part of a championship, they could explore different options. (although, who wants to touch that political mess?)

[St00ge]

Originally Posted by cptkablamo

What does the VLN use for BoP? Could it be an alternative method.
As the B12Hr isn't part of a championship, they could explore different options. (although, who wants to touch that political mess?)

ask and ye shall receive..

http://vln.de/includes/download.php?...n/2012-BoP.pdf

[Reload]

According to the NSW Sports Sedan website, the Sports Sedans won't be making an appearance at the 2013 12 hour which is a real shame.

[cptkablamo]

Originally Posted by St00ge

ask and ye shall receive..

http://vln.de/includes/download.php?...n/2012-BoP.pdf

Cheers

Shame about the Sports Sedans if that is the case. They certainly had a decent grid. Although a good slot for someone else to fill

[alfacors]

Maybe they will go run at the Motor Festival instead?

[inpitlane]

Originally Posted by alfacors

Maybe they will go run at the Motor Festival instead?

From what I hear, from the local guys down here, they may have trouble getting anyone at all for the 12 hour support categories unless they really drop the cost.
Also the festival means more track time, cheaper entry and everyone sharing the attention, sadly no one want's to play second fiddle to the 12 hour race, everyone wants to be a star.
Regardless I hope the organisers hold their nerve and continue down the GT path.
Going back to the production cars only would be a waste of a great racetrack.

[alfacors]

Interesting given the IPRA guys manage to get a full field and reserves every year...

[woodduck97]

Originally Posted by inpitlane

Going back to the production cars only would be a waste of a great racetrack.

Pretty shortsighted comment given that it was "Production" based cars that made Bathurst the legend that it is....

GT3 has done wonders for the 12 hour... almost halved the grid.

[D.R.T.]

If only the success of an event is determined by how many cars enter

[Silver 3]

Originally Posted by woodduck97

Pretty shortsighted comment given that it was "Production" based cars that made Bathurst the legend that it is....

GT3 has done wonders for the 12 hour... almost halved the grid.

What utter rubbish-- the track has created the legend. Cars with 4 doors should be confined to what they are designed for-- moving people-- and often as taxi's!

[Shane001]

here we go again...

Did anyone watch the Nurburgring 24hr on the weekend. That's how to put on an endurance race!

[rich07]

Originally Posted by Shane001

here we go again...

Did anyone watch the Nurburgring 24hr on the weekend. That's how to put on an endurance race!

Amen!

A great mix of GT and production cars with interesting cars and stories all down the grid. If only the B12 could be an aussie version, it would be something not to be missed.

I dont speak German so thank god for Radiolemans! Those guys are informative and entertaining, especially towards the end when you could tell they were lacking some decent sleep . They really need to come down here, they'd be an asset towards opening the event up to more exposure.

[Shane001]

Yep, totally agree, the level of international exposure RLM could bring would be huge, only problem is they (the organisers) need to get the event up to spec first I feel. It's not going to look good on the International stage with only 20 odd entrants.

The organisers need to suck some humble pie, pull the Aus GT crew and the Aus production crew together and bang heads until they come up with a solution that keeps everyone happy, and puts 50+ cars on the grid.

Grid numbers should be first and foremost for this event. Get the grid numbers up and everything else will fall into place.

[alfacors]

Originally Posted by Shane001

The organisers need to suck some humble pie, pull the Aus GT crew and the Aus production crew together and bang heads until they come up with a solution that keeps everyone happy, and puts 50+ cars on the grid.

Might as well try herding cats with a toothpick...... no matter what rules/regs/entry criteria are determined, there will also be a crowd who are unhappy and want to whinge about how it's unfair/disadvantages them etc.

The organisers have to set about tweaking the rules as they go to obtain a happy medium. If they can get 70-80% of people happy, that would be a massive result.

Whatever happens, I will be there again.

[R4z3rw33n]

Originally Posted by woodduck97

Pretty shortsighted comment given that it was "Production" based cars that made Bathurst the legend that it is....

GT3 has done wonders for the 12 hour... almost halved the grid.

Seems the event's drawn far greater interest (both locally and abroad) since this change was enacted - which seems pretty vital for an event that's about generating interest.
That might be worth disregarding if it doesn't suit your interests.

Originally Posted by Shane001

here we go again...

Did anyone watch the Nurburgring 24hr on the weekend. That's how to put on an endurance race!

They've had forty years to get it right.
It also helps that Germany seems to have a high volume of willing (and reasonable) privateers and, a decent number of local manufacturers to support the event.

[Oldtony]

As Shane said, here we go again!
Cheap shots and whinges, but not much put forward by way of a soloution.
This years GT race was a great weekend, I enjoyed it, but it was certainly not the basis for an important event in the overall sports-events calendar. That can't happen without making it an important part of the overall motor trade/industry scene. And that won't happen until we give the trade an incentive to get involved. The curent structure of motor sport in Australia is in fact almost hostile to manufacturer, importer or dealer involvement.
V8SC and F1 have moved the sport to an entirely entertainment focus and the fact that there are cars involved is almost irrelevant.
The B12 could be the thin end of the wedge for the sport to re-engage with the industry if it provided the incentives, and the opportunity to demonstrate the product.
The GT3s would seem to be here to stay, and as with the NR24 they give glamour and the high status benchmark by which other runners can compare. But there needs to be something for the others to compete for on which they can hang their hat with sponsors and the media.
In a world that is looking at energy resources surely someone can come up with an "index of performance" formula that takes into account not only fuel use and speed, but some relativity to the seating space, roadabilty and usability to give manufactures/importers/dealers a peg to hang their hat on? And running that in conjunction with the GTs gives the public a level of comparison with the glamopur cars.
Now I'll go back to celebrating my NR24 interest in how the hell those blokes got a XF Jag home in front of the BMWS in class D3T.
Guess that shows where I'm coming from.

[alfacors]

Originally Posted by R4z3rw33n

They've had forty years to get it right.
It also helps that Germany seems to have a high volume of willing (and reasonable) privateers and, a decent number of local manufacturers to support the event.

Not just Germans, cars from all over the Euro landscape. Plus drivers from all over the globe including several Aussie like Mal Rose, Al Shepherd, Peter O'Donnell, Garth Duffy, Frnoics Jouy etc....

[Shane001]

From memory I heard on the RLM feed that there were 15 aussies in this years race!

[woodduck97]

Originally Posted by Silver 3

What utter rubbish-- the track has created the legend. Cars with 4 doors should be confined to what they are designed for-- moving people-- and often as taxi's!

The track is the track and it is awesome... but... what made the track was the racing that was on it, and the legends of Brock v Moffat, GTHO Falcon, Torana etc etc... Which was based on Series production rules or variants.

How many Ferrari's, Lamborgini's, Aston's or even Porsche's are known for their success at Bathurst.

None.

GT3 is a great formula, the race on the weekend was terrific.. but europe is a different swimming pool entirely....a lot more people, more money and thus a greater volume of cars, drivers etc. GT3 certainly has a place in Australia, and with what the Quinn's are seemingly planning it could be a great category....but...

The last 2 years have shown that in the 12 hour concept, it doesnt work for whatever reason. Armour All obviously thought so too..... If we could get 50 GT3 and GT4 cars out there, then that would be a sight to see - but Australia doesnt seem to have the wealth depth and competitor interest to get that many cars together at the moment.....who knows, it may happen...

Production car racing showed it could get cars on the grid... Gt3 showed that it couldnt, and even though there are obvious "status" and "exotic" improvements with GT3, the crowd didnt swell, the majority of Australian GT competitors gave it a wide berth... and the naming rights sponsor walked...

Sorry to keep going over old ground, but the "waste of a great racetrack" comment was worth shooting down. again.

[Umai Naa]

You really have to ask yourself, has there been much racing by exotic marques on the mountain overall? No. But, in the same fell swoop, you've compared it to what eventually evolved into V8 Supercars. Which, as a whole, has been racing there for 50 years, and on the odd occasion, more than once in any given year.

Once again, another apples verses oranges argument on here.

[R4z3rw33n]

Originally Posted by alfacors

Not just Germans, cars from all over the Euro landscape. Plus drivers from all over the globe including several Aussie like Mal Rose, Al Shepherd, Peter O'Donnell, Garth Duffy, Frnoics Jouy etc....

SP9 (GT3) consisted nearly entirely of German teams/marques - this is where the factory support exists. Schubert, Vita4One, Phoenix, Mamerow, Raeder, Black Falcon, Heico, Rowe, and Manthey are all local outfits.

The only non-German GT3 outfit in contention was MarcVDS.
There's a significant volume of competitors from abroad. The majority are supported by local outfits and, (within the higher categories) manufacturers.

Originally Posted by woodduck97

How many Ferrari's, Lamborgini's, Aston's or even Porsche's are known for their success at Bathurst.

None.

This might be worth further consideration.

Originally Posted by Umai Naa

You really have to ask yourself, has there been much racing by exotic marques on the mountain overall? No. But, in the same fell swoop, you've compared it to what eventually evolved into V8 Supercars. Which, as a whole, has been racing there for 50 years, and on the odd occasion, more than once in any given year.

Once again, another apples verses oranges argument on here.

[Shane001]

Originally Posted by woodduck97

The track is the track and it is awesome... but... what made the track was the racing that was on it, and the legends of Brock v Moffat, GTHO Falcon, Torana etc etc... Which was based on Series production rules or variants.

No disrespect intended to anyone, not the least Brocky (RIP), but it could be said the mountain made the legends. Australian motorsport would not be what it is nor have the history or the personalities that it does without Mt Panorama.

The organisers really need to figure out how to make this event what it should be, a full grid, regardless of what type of car!