Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Single Seater Racing > Formula One

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 26 Oct 2020, 14:37 (Ref:4013214)   #1626
V8 Fireworks
Veteran
 
V8 Fireworks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,923
V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam43 View Post
Equally back in the day we didn’t have to force anyone to do anything.
Because Lotus & Ford were sporting, something the current selfish entrants struggle with. Lotus put the interests of the sport above their own.
V8 Fireworks is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Oct 2020, 14:40 (Ref:4013215)   #1627
V8 Fireworks
Veteran
 
V8 Fireworks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,923
V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aysedasi View Post
Are we allowed to use the 'simple' word in a discussion about F1 regs?
A simple 3200mm maximum wheelbase was proposed by the FIA for 2022, but the selfish F1 teams refused it because they don't want to redesign their 1m long gearboxes and slim radiator layouts. So the maximum wheelbase will be 3600mm, about the same as the current limos.

Ridiculous.
V8 Fireworks is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Oct 2020, 15:00 (Ref:4013223)   #1628
chillibowl
Veteran
 
chillibowl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Canada
winnipeg, canada
Posts: 9,719
chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!
i cant seem to find it but i thought that one of the changes coming was a fixed price on the engine supply?

that combined with the overall budget/cost cap and increase in prize money distribution, plus one would assume that if the engines are again frozen, engines costs will come down over time so that engine costs will not be as big of an issue going forward?

if anything, with what RP has done and the last real hold out/Williams sale, most of the small teams are looking to give more money to their engine supplier and to buy a whole lot more than just engines.

other than for RB, who right or wrong have alienated both Renault and Ferrari and would probably do the same to Merc, are any of the teams still worried about the current engine formula or its costs?

granted, i know many of the drivers dont like them which i suppose is as good a reason as any to get rid of them.
chillibowl is offline  
__________________
Home, is where I want to be but I guess I'm already there
I come home, she lifted up her wings guess that this must be the place
Quote
Old 26 Oct 2020, 16:25 (Ref:4013240)   #1629
Adam43
14th
1% Club
 
Adam43's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
European Union
New Orleans
Posts: 42,425
Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks View Post
A simple 3200mm maximum wheelbase was proposed by the FIA for 2022, but the selfish F1 teams refused it because they don't want to redesign their 1m long gearboxes and slim radiator layouts. So the maximum wheelbase will be 3600mm, about the same as the current limos.

Ridiculous.
In terms of simplicity a 3200mm and a 3600mm rule are equal. I agree with it being reduced, but the argument is not due to simplicity.
Adam43 is offline  
__________________
Seriously not taking motorsport too seriously.
Quote
Old 26 Oct 2020, 16:29 (Ref:4013241)   #1630
Adam43
14th
1% Club
 
Adam43's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
European Union
New Orleans
Posts: 42,425
Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks View Post
Because Lotus & Ford were sporting, something the current selfish entrants struggle with. Lotus put the interests of the sport above their own.
Basically that example is from the ‘60s! Albeit with that engine lasted to the early ‘80s. Not been like that since, so for the majority of the world championship.

Of course there was an example of Brawn needing engines and McLaren and Mercedes coming to the rescue.

And generally more recently manufacturers have expanded supply when needed.
Adam43 is offline  
__________________
Seriously not taking motorsport too seriously.
Quote
Old 28 Oct 2020, 11:58 (Ref:4013519)   #1631
Taxi645
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Netherlands
Posts: 979
Taxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridTaxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I would also propose a different scoring system as seen in the attachment.


As you can see, for most positions the percentage of the total collectable points in a grand prix stay roughly the same. Just that the points for positions 9 and 10 gain slightly more weight.


In the current system the points for position 9 and 10 are almost worthless.
Attached Thumbnails
score system.jpg  
Taxi645 is offline  
__________________
Constructive discussion: A conversion where participants are maximally open to yet critical of each others (and their own) arguments, with the intend of enhancing the knowledge, understanding and/or handling of it's subject.
Quote
Old 28 Oct 2020, 13:04 (Ref:4013531)   #1632
gert
Veteran
 
gert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Belgium
Antwerp
Posts: 6,137
gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645 View Post
I would also propose a different scoring system as seen in the attachment.


As you can see, for most positions the percentage of the total collectable points in a grand prix stay roughly the same. Just that the points for positions 9 and 10 gain slightly more weight.


In the current system the points for position 9 and 10 are almost worthless.
That's the old WSC / Group C point system.

IIRC that was on the table a long time ago before they chose the current one but was rejected because there wasn't enough emphasis on the top scoring positions.
gert is offline  
Quote
Old 28 Oct 2020, 13:09 (Ref:4013532)   #1633
Taxi645
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Netherlands
Posts: 979
Taxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridTaxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by gert View Post
That's the old WSC / Group C point system.

IIRC that was on the table a long time ago before they chose the current one but was rejected because there wasn't enough emphasis on the top scoring positions.

Didn't know that, thanks.


Strange they rejected it for that reason because as one can see, the first six position roughly get the same percentage of the total score as they do now.
Taxi645 is offline  
__________________
Constructive discussion: A conversion where participants are maximally open to yet critical of each others (and their own) arguments, with the intend of enhancing the knowledge, understanding and/or handling of it's subject.
Quote
Old 28 Oct 2020, 15:25 (Ref:4013542)   #1634
gert
Veteran
 
gert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Belgium
Antwerp
Posts: 6,137
gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!gert is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645 View Post
Strange they rejected it for that reason because as one can see, the first six position roughly get the same percentage of the total score as they do now.
I think the rejection was due to the absolute numbers - the gap between the scoring positions.

The difference between the top positions is 7 - 3 - 3 - 2 etc... in one system and 5 - 3 - 2 - 2 etc... in the other and that was deemed not enough
gert is offline  
Quote
Old 29 Oct 2020, 02:08 (Ref:4013651)   #1635
Adam43
14th
1% Club
 
Adam43's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
European Union
New Orleans
Posts: 42,425
Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!Adam43 is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Yes, as you highlight, specifically the first to second.

Top six getting points is fine by me. 9-6-4-3-2-1.

Although in contradiction to this I am a fan of FL point.
Adam43 is offline  
__________________
Seriously not taking motorsport too seriously.
Quote
Old 29 Oct 2020, 16:53 (Ref:4013752)   #1636
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam43 View Post
Yes, as you highlight, specifically the first to second.

Top six getting points is fine by me. 9-6-4-3-2-1.

Although in contradiction to this I am a fan of FL point.
That was the points system F1 used from 1962 - 1990. I never understood why they changed it.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 29 Oct 2020, 19:15 (Ref:4013770)   #1637
S griffin
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,325
S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!
It seemed to work well then. To be fair, the points systems have usually been fair, but there was something wrong when the gap between first and second was the same as second and third as it was in 2003-2009
S griffin is offline  
__________________
He who dares wins!
He who hesitates is lost!
Quote
Old 29 Oct 2020, 19:19 (Ref:4013771)   #1638
Anyopenroad
Veteran
 
Anyopenroad's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
England
London
Posts: 1,442
Anyopenroad has a real shot at the championship!Anyopenroad has a real shot at the championship!Anyopenroad has a real shot at the championship!Anyopenroad has a real shot at the championship!Anyopenroad has a real shot at the championship!Anyopenroad has a real shot at the championship!
After 1600 comments and 110 pages I'm surprised we haven't fixed F1 yet. I mean, anyone would think it was difficult!
Anyopenroad is offline  
__________________
I like taking pictures of cars going round tracks, through forests and up hills.
Quote
Old 29 Oct 2020, 20:38 (Ref:4013780)   #1639
V8 Fireworks
Veteran
 
V8 Fireworks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,923
V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anyopenroad View Post
After 1600 comments and 110 pages I'm surprised we haven't fixed F1 yet. I mean, anyone would think it was difficult!
Apparently, the way to fix it is to change the points system.

Coincidentally, so that lower-order teams score less points and don't get a representative WCC score, which is why it was changed in the first place.
V8 Fireworks is offline  
Quote
Old 30 Oct 2020, 00:30 (Ref:4013808)   #1640
S griffin
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,325
S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!
The extra point for fastest lap has been an excellent addition. I think keeping the score for the top ten is the way to go. Keeps those lower down something to fight for, which means more significance when battles happen down in the midfield
S griffin is offline  
__________________
He who dares wins!
He who hesitates is lost!
Quote
Old 31 Oct 2020, 22:44 (Ref:4014166)   #1641
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anyopenroad View Post
After 1600 comments and 110 pages I'm surprised we haven't fixed F1 yet. I mean, anyone would think it was difficult!
Roll on 2022,
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 31 Oct 2020, 23:14 (Ref:4014169)   #1642
Greem
Veteran
 
Greem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
United Kingdom
Posts: 5,067
Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!Greem is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith View Post
Roll on 2022,
Comments, or calendar year?

Greem is online now  
__________________
Walk a mile in someone else's shoes.
When they realise you have, you'll be a mile away and you'll have their shoes.
Quote
Old 1 Nov 2020, 10:58 (Ref:4014223)   #1643
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greem View Post
Comments, or calendar year?

The new F1 regs; I'm sure the comments will follow.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 6 Nov 2020, 01:44 (Ref:4015114)   #1644
wnut
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 8,088
wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!
Rules made to prevent teams copying one another:

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/a...f1-regulations

I really think this is a bad idea!

Would it prevent the copying of Brawn's double diffuser?

All I want is close racing at the end of the day, quite bluntly, I don't care how they get there.
wnut is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Nov 2020, 07:02 (Ref:4015126)   #1645
Armco Bender
Llama Assassin and Sheep Botherer
Veteran
 
Armco Bender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
New Zealand
International Sheep Ambassador
Posts: 4,212
Armco Bender is going for a new world record!Armco Bender is going for a new world record!Armco Bender is going for a new world record!Armco Bender is going for a new world record!Armco Bender is going for a new world record!Armco Bender is going for a new world record!Armco Bender is going for a new world record!
Armco Bender is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Nov 2020, 07:40 (Ref:4015128)   #1646
wnut
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 8,088
wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Armco Bender View Post

Bring back trolley buses!
wnut is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Nov 2020, 09:02 (Ref:4015141)   #1647
crmalcolm
Subscriber
Veteran
 
crmalcolm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Nepal
Exactly where I need to be.
Posts: 12,292
crmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
I thought the current engines were already disliked because they are too quiet and lack the 'passion' of previous units?

May as well make the leap to full EV now.....
crmalcolm is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Nov 2020, 09:19 (Ref:4015144)   #1648
S griffin
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,325
S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!
No thank you, I don't want us to be nostalgic for the current engines
S griffin is offline  
__________________
He who dares wins!
He who hesitates is lost!
Quote
Old 6 Nov 2020, 11:42 (Ref:4015156)   #1649
Richard C
Veteran
 
Richard C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,803
Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!Richard C is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnut View Post
Rules made to prevent teams copying one another:

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/a...f1-regulations

I really think this is a bad idea!

Would it prevent the copying of Brawn's double diffuser?

All I want is close racing at the end of the day, quite bluntly, I don't care how they get there.
Teams can still copy each other, they would just have to do it the old school way. They have just taken away the modern tools that make it MUCH easier. I think it may be hard to enforce if teams are brave enough to try to do it anyway.

Richard
Richard C is offline  
__________________
To paraphrase Mark Twain... "I'm sorry I wrote such a long post; I didn't have time to write a short one."
Quote
Old 6 Nov 2020, 13:12 (Ref:4015170)   #1650
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 37,234
Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Casto View Post
Teams can still copy each other, they would just have to do it the old school way.
Yup, take a copy of the design to your nearest print-shop and run it through the copier. Never been done before.
Peter Mallett is offline  
__________________
I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead.
Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DP's Fix gttouring Sportscar & GT Racing 31 31 Mar 2003 13:52
Is this a fix? Peter S Formula One 28 25 Mar 2003 14:17
Williams trying to "fix car" 2 weeks before Melbourne? Sodemo Formula One 8 28 Feb 2003 10:12
If you want to fix it mtpanorama Road Car Forum 3 17 May 2001 02:09
How to fix F1 Crash Test Formula One 2 24 Jun 2000 23:23


All times are GMT. The time now is 00:43.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.