Club F3 2007

JohnMiller · 7 Jan 2007, 20:32 (Ref:1809055)

Calendar:

April 14th Oulton Park

May 12th & 13th Pembrey, Double header

June 23rd & 24th Rockingham, Double header

July 28th & 29th Snetterton (BTCC)

August 25th & 26th Silverstone, Double header

September 9th Brands Hatch

October 13th & 14th Snetterton, Double header

Less dates, more double headers, less cost is good.

BTCC support is good too even if it will probably either be at 4 am or 7:30 pm!

TV package continues...

I'm sure there will be bigger grids this year.

SALEEN S7R · 7 Jan 2007, 20:39 (Ref:1809060)

Looks like a good calender, a bit of a shame theres no Thruxton round though. Going by the TV pictures it looked to me as though the Thruxton event was one of the best attended by spectators. Ah well, maybe ill make the trip to Brands Hatch or Silverstone.

Is there a regular support package for club F3?

Suze · 7 Jan 2007, 20:44 (Ref:1809064)

There's only one club event full stop at Thruxton this year unfortunately - see here

BTCC support and TV package is good news though, and be good if bigger grids too - hope for series sake there will be. Saw Silverstone race on TV and enjoyed it though be nice to see more cars out there too.

JohnMiller · 7 Jan 2007, 21:00 (Ref:1809074)

Silverstone was the first race which several missed.

Rockingham should be fantastic.

SALEEN S7R · 7 Jan 2007, 21:02 (Ref:1809075)

Indeed Rockingham should be good. What was the biggest entry for Club F3 last year? I think I remember a grid of around 18 cars at one of the events but cant remember which. If the series can build on this and have 19 car grids as a base line level things are looking good for the series.

JohnMiller · 7 Jan 2007, 21:06 (Ref:1809079)

There were 19 at Donington.

FFmygale · 10 Jan 2007, 20:23 (Ref:1811729)

Less dates, more double headers, less cost is good.

I presume you mean "fewer dates"!

JohnMiller · 10 Jan 2007, 21:49 (Ref:1811804)

Yeah, OK.

Mind you, your exclamation mark should be within your inverted commas.

Dan Friel · 11 Jan 2007, 08:54 (Ref:1812106)

Club F3's ran at the Thruxton British F3 meeting last year, hence the large(ish) crowds..

With regards to grammar and the exclamation mark, are we being logical or conventional on ten-tenths?

Cleggie · 11 Jan 2007, 12:55 (Ref:1812288)

...logical or conventional, I never did like dates.
!

JohnMiller · 13 Jan 2007, 12:08 (Ref:1813974)

I'm sure there will be plenty of interest this year.

Yes, winter news and promotion has been very disappointing but with a good calendar there is plenty of interest.

With this type of championship people are always talking about selling cars, but generally come the first race they all turn out. If they sell, chances are they are sold for new drivers to Club F3 anyway.

People need to remember that Club F3 was not just ARP continued, it was new last year and this will be only it's second year!

The change to modern radial tyres has helped with interest as well. In fact, I am certain that new drivers will be announced in new cars soon, to add to last year returnees...

Redracer77 · 13 Jan 2007, 20:20 (Ref:1814475)

I think Club F3 will have an okay year. It needs at least 18 on average in my view and the likes of Steve Patania from F4 and maybe Neil Toft's from UK FF will only help Club F3 improve. Like John says the people that can't sell cars will be back. It will just mean Driftwood will have a lot of cars to race with in 2007

ianpearson · 16 Jan 2007, 13:27 (Ref:1816514)

[QUOTE=JohnMiller]The change to modern radial tyres has helped with interest as well. QUOTE]

Does that mean you will be running on British F3 style rubber?

Whats your registration & entry fee costs looking like for this season

I noticed on your website the championship appears to have a sponsor, is that going towards any prize money or does that pay for the tv coverage or reduce entry costs

Redracer77 · 16 Jan 2007, 13:30 (Ref:1816520)

I am not sure on the prize money Ian but there is TV I gather for 2007 like 2006.

If you are interested then speak to Keith Baldwin, his number is on the website I think.

Redracer77 · 16 Jan 2007, 13:37 (Ref:1816528)

[QUOTE=ianpearson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnMiller

The change to modern radial tyres has helped with interest as well. QUOTE]

Does that mean you will be running on British F3 style rubber?

Whats your registration & entry fee costs looking like for this season

I noticed on your website the championship appears to have a sponsor, is that going towards any prize money or does that pay for the tv coverage or reduce entry costs

Ian, you could win Club F3 for the same money as FR BARC..... Car might cost you a little more money than a FR2000 but at least you can work on the cars yourselves like you do at the moment.

JohnMiller · 16 Jan 2007, 14:09 (Ref:1816577)

Tyres - radials yes, but a previous British F3 spec. I think Avon are bringing out revised rubber for BF3 this year anyway.

Prize money - don't think so.

TV - I think so, yes.

Registration £245.

Entry fees, unknown, 2006 was £275 SH £400 (?) DH but bear in mind 25 min qualifier and 25 minute races.

Interestingly, comparing notes I think a proper budget to be run in BARC FR or Club F3 is near identical.

driftwood · 16 Jan 2007, 14:11 (Ref:1816578)

Tyres are not the same spec as Int F3 avons
i think running costs for BARC FR and F3 are the same cars cost similar amount
sponsor is not giving prize money but i believe they pay the bulk of the TV fees
entry fees are around £300 ish for the DH events
entry fees boil down to the amount of track time you have these days its all calculated over the meeting some race meetings cost more to stage depending on the circuit hire fees
BRSCC loose money on some events and gain at others

Circuit fee is the biggest single cost to a race organiser and its this reason that events like BTCC races are not at certain tracks as they cannot agree terms
Im sure circuit owners think they can hold racers to ransom
its about time the tracks where owned by share holders who are the RAC licence holders not profit making companies

Come the Revolution brothers and power to the racers! or whatever Citizen Smith said

driftwood · 16 Jan 2007, 14:17 (Ref:1816589)

I see Mr Miller has nowt else to do as well !!
running different compound tyres from Int F3 makes no sense for a club series
there was no need to change tyres they had a good 2004 spec tyre -then they give out another spec for 05 then damned if they dont screw it u in 06
now they change to radials and give a different compound

schomosport · 16 Jan 2007, 19:29 (Ref:1816867)

Quote:

Originally Posted by driftwood

running different compound tyres from Int F3 makes no sense for a club series
there was no need to change tyres they had a good 2004 spec tyre -then they give out another spec for 05 then damned if they dont screw it u in 06
now they change to radials and give a different compound

Possibly a plot so Mono pilots who don't care how old the rubber is can carry on running at £10 a corner......ill wind that blows no one no good!

Cleggie · 18 Jan 2007, 16:20 (Ref:1818567)

It must be better if Club F3 cars can run on Radial instead of Crossply tyres. The car was designed for Radials (if that matters).

But I can't see what difference the type of compound Avon will use for Club F3 in 2007 will have for the racers. If they can use the current British F3 tyre, then everyone would try and get British F3 used tyres, and demand for new tyres would fall away, if this happened I can't imagine Avon giving track side support. Who would fit these old cases onto the rims? Can't be all that safe!

A set of tyres are expensive, but only a bit more than FF1600 tyres anyway. When you think of the effort and expense some people may go to just to gain a bit more speed then the cost of a set of new tyres represent a very quick, easy and cheap alternative, with the best return on your investment.

Neil1982 · 18 Jan 2007, 19:41 (Ref:1818716)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleggie

It must be better if Club F3 cars can run on Radial instead of Crossply tyres. The car was designed for Radials (if that matters).

But I can't see what difference the type of compound Avon will use for Club F3 in 2007 will have for the racers. If they can use the current British F3 tyre, then everyone would try and get British F3 used tyres, and demand for new tyres would fall away, if this happened I can't imagine Avon giving track side support. Who would fit these old cases onto the rims? Can't be all that safe!

A set of tyres are expensive, but only a bit more than FF1600 tyres anyway. When you think of the effort and expense some people may go to just to gain a bit more speed then the cost of a set of new tyres represent a very quick, easy and cheap alternative, with the best return on your investment.

I seem to remember when it was questioned a while ago why ARP ran on the crossply tyres several people on this forum piped up saying it would be ridiculous to change to Radials because everyone would lose their set up data...funny how things change

Regarding Safety... not sure what the validity of that point is? Many competitors use 2nd hand tyres, and have them fitted by any usual tyre sales place for minimal cost (often they do it for us for free)... I don't think I have ever seen a tyre failure at an event due to incorrect fittment? Lets face it you could survive (safely) without Avon trackside support.

As for expense, new tyres are very expensive, but do represent a significant performance gain...problem is its only for a couple of sessions and then your back to where you started! Remember you can get very lightly used 2nd hand sets from F3 teams for one fifteenith of the price (literally!). Do you not think that making this option avaliable to competitors with older F3 machinary, or just those who want to play in the mid-field would not perhaps significantly increase your grid sizes. One things for sure it would make Club F3 accessable to more competitors. Complete Cars (late 80's early 90's) can be found cheaply now, so it must partly be the running cost that is putting people off.

andy97 · 19 Jan 2007, 12:05 (Ref:1819276)

Interesting to see in yesterday's Autosport that the series is now to allow ground effect cars in from the early 1980s. Anyone know if there is any interest? The Ralt RT3 was always one of my favourite looking cars.

driftwood · 19 Jan 2007, 12:27 (Ref:1819306)

Tyres
It is totally ridicules to run a radial tyre that is not the same as International f3
yes there is a benefit for some guys to acquire used tyres from a current UK F3 team but to be honest these days they can only run 6 tyres per meeting and are usually too worn to be of use to a "competitive " driver
However the radial tyre plays into the hands of the 02-04 car owners no one else

These cars have been designed and built with the negative camber in the chassis and this is why they did not perform on X plies
the 95-01 dallara cars where ok on x ply tyres

When i asked in the past about radila tyres i was told the X ply was better for club drivers as radials where harder to work with and broke away quicker at the limit !!
Now they are " de Riguer" !!
In a spin a radial will flat spot more easily than a X ply that will hurt the car and wallet !

Tyre service at F3 meetings is useful but every driver is paying for it in the tyre costing Smiffy doesnt turn up for nowt
that is why the x ply was £75-100 more than theInt F3 radial to purchase
Club f3 tyre sales in a weekend maybe 5 sets
International f3 tyre sales 35 set per weekend?
its simple mathematics on sending the truck and 2 men to the circuit

Avon are a "sponsor" of Int F3 and can justify 10-14 meetings in turning up with the sales they achieve
A club racer can do 1 of 2 things
send wheels via a courier (£ 20-30 per trip?) or go to BMTR to get tyres mounted
or
ask local tyre garage to do the task

I have had to do it all ways and even go to race meeting when i know the BMTR truck is there

ok not everyone can afford to own tyre changing kit but i can justify owning the kit now as i was spending £20 per time getting tyres fitted/removed over 3 years the ownership will soon cover its self as well as the convenience

the old saying " you pays yer money and takes yer choice " applies
If u want BMTR at the track they need to recover their costs in the tyre price at the circuit

As to ground effect cars running that is great news for any RT3 Anson Magnum car owner as he can now race his car in F3 spec
will they be quicker than Masters or a dallara
i doubt it but it will add cars to the grid and be fun for the guys trying to beat the other racers

ianpearson · 19 Jan 2007, 16:29 (Ref:1819497)

Just reading through the club F3 web site, the minimum weights for the cars & driver seem quite high, are the cars fairly heavy or are you allowing for a well proportioned driver to still be at minimum weight? Would most cars with a 70kg driver in it need ballast

JohnMiller · 19 Jan 2007, 16:43 (Ref:1819507)

Yep, lead ballast. Or just let yourself go and eat more.

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