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View Poll Results: Should Ron Have Signed Tommy Byrne?
Yes 4 16.00%
No 21 84.00%
Voters: 25. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 1 Feb 2018, 18:58 (Ref:3797543)   #31
chunterer
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Well most people might not be aware that a significant portion of the current F1 grid has been through driver training with Rob Wilson using a Vauxhall road car. If you can't be precise and smooth with a road car it's only going to be exacerbated in an F1 car.

There is actually much that can be learned and to me you can never learn enough. We have coaches in every other sport and I think only in recent years have people come to understand that drivers need them as well. I think any driver that would consider coaching as patronizing is a complete moron.

I'm not a complete JYS fan but I do remember in the earlier seasons around 2005 or so, JYS taking James May around a track in a road car and by the end had shaved 20 seconds off his time.

Jan Magnussen was another who might have had a little turn of speed but never had the mental application or desire to be champion. I think he had his chances with McLaren, Stewart and in CART and he just couldn't keep it together. Again another person that would have benefited from a coach.
To be fair i was specifically referring to JYS rather comical attitude to his drivers, and not referring to professional driver coaches.

I am sure that Rob Wilson or the other guy (can't remember his name..) at least show their pupils some element of respect and intelligence.
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Old 1 Feb 2018, 23:12 (Ref:3797614)   #32
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To be fair i was specifically referring to JYS rather comical attitude to his drivers, and not referring to professional driver coaches.

I am sure that Rob Wilson or the other guy (can't remember his name..) at least show their pupils some element of respect and intelligence.
JYS has had a lot of goofy opinions over the years, but one thing you can say when they ran PSR in the lower formula was they worked to get their drivers looking and acting professional as well as having standards in terms of drivers learning their professions. The drivers who passed through that team overall seemed to have pretty decent careers or at least a shot at a decent pro career.

So in regards to Jan, I think JYS was trying to get him to get it together and after giving him his chance they had to let him go. At the end of the day this is a ruthless brutal industry of results and you either do the work or you get cut and shown the door. JYS was his boss, Jan was just a young guy that hardly knew anything at all and again, get with the program or find new employment. Personally I don't think he was ever that great anyways. I think he was just the Autosport man of the moment.
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Old 4 Feb 2018, 08:43 (Ref:3798378)   #33
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Definitely NOT! Ron Dennis should have signed the true 1982 British F3 Champion, the Argentinian driver Quique Mansilla, who was the best on the entire F3 grid, but due to political causes (Falklands et al) couldn't shine because his incomes were blocked by the European parliament. Mansilla could still compete because the team owner was sure the money invested by Financiera Munro will be given to him when the disclosure of the funds would be allowed.

Aside that, Byrne had a rocambolesque style of life to be a proper serious racing driver. James Hunt, despite his lifestyle, was more correct than him. Byrne has to be grateful to have these three GGPPs he got in Theodore, because when teams owners knew about his manners, they highly will doubt (as they did) that Tommy could be responsible enought to have a serious F1 campaign.

And Tommy's racing carreer after that largely proved what I said on these lines.
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Old 4 Feb 2018, 10:45 (Ref:3798397)   #34
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Definitely he needed a manager did Tommy. In fact he think he actually said he wishes he had one when he went to meet Ron to discuss a contract, as his attitude let him down.
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Old 6 Mar 2018, 13:01 (Ref:3806244)   #35
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The final results of the poll show that 14 of you thought Tommy had shot himself in the foot with his attitude and general misbehaviour, whilst three of us thought Ron should have bitten the bullet and signed him on speed alone.
I appreciate the test was only a prize for winning the British F3 championship, but if the manners and demeanour had matched the speed, then I'm sure Ron would have found a way to move Wattie aside..
What might have been!
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Old 12 Mar 2018, 14:19 (Ref:3807517)   #36
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Would've Ferrari had taken him if he had Ferrari's ear and a space in the line-up?

Ron Dennis is probably the worst guy to approach if you are an *individual* let alone the hyper-volatile Tommy Byrne. I don't care how much of a drill sergeant type you are; you'd probably need a tranquiler dart to keep Byrne quiet and contented.
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Old 12 Mar 2018, 16:07 (Ref:3807532)   #37
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The thing is he probably didn't just cost himself a McLaren drive, but possibly a drive in another team. He was unlikely to get into McLaren straight away, especially with Wattie and the Rat already there
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Old 12 Mar 2018, 17:56 (Ref:3807557)   #38
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McLarens biggest faux pas must have been letting Gilles Villeneuve slip through thier fingers in 1977.
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Old 12 Mar 2018, 22:49 (Ref:3807607)   #39
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McLarens biggest faux pas must have been letting Gilles Villeneuve slip through thier fingers in 1977.
You do know what Enzo called Villeneuve?

"The Prince of destruction."

McLaren let Scheckter slip through their fingers too. A far better development driver, and less prone to dumb crashes.

Also lost Fittipaldi to contractual brinkmanship.

The biggest loss though would have to be faux pas would have to be one A. Newey though.

Last edited by wnut; 12 Mar 2018 at 23:05.
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Old 13 Mar 2018, 13:13 (Ref:3807747)   #40
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You do know what Enzo called Villeneuve?

"The Prince of destruction."
I think you'll find Enzo said that with wink under those dark glasses and a smile on his face.
Famously Enzo didn't care much for his drivers, but he did have a soft spot for Gilles, loving the fact that he always drove to (and above) the absolute mechanical limits of his cars.
And if you doubt my words, just ask Nigel Roebuck, the journalist closest closest to Gilles in his latter career.
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Old 13 Mar 2018, 18:24 (Ref:3807776)   #41
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You do know what Enzo called Villeneuve?



"The Prince of destruction."



McLaren let Scheckter slip through their fingers too. A far better development driver, and less prone to dumb crashes.



Also lost Fittipaldi to contractual brinkmanship.



The biggest loss though would have to be faux pas would have to be one A. Newey though.

Villeneuve, Scheckter and Fittipaldi all raced under Teddy though. And Jody was a bit of a crasher in his first season
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Old 13 Mar 2018, 18:52 (Ref:3807784)   #42
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Originally Posted by wnut View Post
You do know what Enzo called Villeneuve?

"The Prince of destruction."

McLaren let Scheckter slip through their fingers too. A far better development driver, and less prone to dumb crashes.

Also lost Fittipaldi to contractual brinkmanship.

The biggest loss though would have to be faux pas would have to be one A. Newey though.
Although Williams screwed up first Imagine if Newey had become a share holder. F1 history would have been so different
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Old 16 Mar 2018, 13:10 (Ref:3808334)   #43
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I think you'll find Enzo said that with wink under those dark glasses and a smile on his face.
Famously Enzo didn't care much for his drivers, but he did have a soft spot for Gilles, loving the fact that he always drove to (and above) the absolute mechanical limits of his cars.
And if you doubt my words, just ask Nigel Roebuck, the journalist closest closest to Gilles in his latter career.
Alas, if Gilles was noted for crashing cars, McLaren had Andrea DeCesaris in his files, who has the record of most cars crashed in a season, during his 1981 campaign.
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Old 16 Mar 2018, 13:13 (Ref:3808336)   #44
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And about Emmo, he'd have left McLaren anyways, the Copersucar thingy done by his brother was taking his time...
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Old 24 Mar 2018, 08:29 (Ref:3810364)   #45
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Samoan Attorney should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSamoan Attorney should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSamoan Attorney should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I had forgotten a polemic from Mike Lawrence on this very topic

https://www.pitpass.com/58775/Self-Immolation
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