Home Mobile Forum News Cookbook FaceBook Us T-Shirts etc.: Europe/Worldwide. eBay Motorsport Links Advertising  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Single Seater Racing > Formula One


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 21 Jun 2020, 16:13 (Ref:3983080)   #61
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 34,164
Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Hmm, effectively there are no assets unless the creditors release them or the Security Agent is given court permission to sell. Complete circle jerk. Bye Bye McLaren...
Peter Mallett is offline  
__________________
In the current circumstances, we need to do all we can to help local businesses. With this in mind I suggest we all schedule our visits to the pub so we can keep the 2m social distancing and whilst there get completely slamied for two hours before handing over to the next shift.

It probably won't stop the virus but nobody would care.
Quote
Old 21 Jun 2020, 17:10 (Ref:3983090)   #62
Mike Harte
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Mike Harte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
United Kingdom
W. Yorkshire
Posts: 3,449
Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Mallett View Post
Hmm, effectively there are no assets unless the creditors release them or the Security Agent is given court permission to sell. Complete circle jerk. Bye Bye McLaren...

Not according to the legal argument in the application put forward by McLaren's barristers; they claim that it amounts to between 20 and 25% of the group's total assets.

And a judge has granted an expedited hearing to take place; so round one to McLaren.
Mike Harte is offline  
Quote
Old 21 Jun 2020, 17:18 (Ref:3983091)   #63
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 34,164
Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Yes I read that bit but nonetheless it looks like the assets are already accounted for. The argument surrounds the security agent's fiduciary duty.
Peter Mallett is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 08:41 (Ref:3983188)   #64
justracing
Subscriber
Veteran
 
justracing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
United Kingdom
West Sussex
Posts: 1,543
justracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridjustracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
At the moment it would appear that the judge's sole responsibility is to determine the credence of McLaren's argument that "Under the terms of the financial documents, the Defendant is obliged to release the Transaction Security in certain prescribed circumstances. Importantly, the finance documents expressly state that Company(McLaren)is responsible for certifying whether the prescribed circumstances exist, and that the Security Agent is entitled to rely upon any such certification.
justracing is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 08:55 (Ref:3983190)   #65
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 34,164
Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Yes it's interesting which is why I suggested it's a circle jerk.
Peter Mallett is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 12:19 (Ref:3983207)   #66
Richard Casto
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Richard Casto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
United States
Durham, NC, USA
Posts: 3,594
Richard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
I didn't read the entire document. But it sounds like a bank is holding McLaren assets as collateral or is in charge of releasing those assets to be used for collateral for future deal. Other investors view those assets as already acting as collateral for debt they own. The other investors don't want the collateral to be diluted with others debtors being brought into the picture. The bank is caught between McLaren and threats from existing debtors. Question is... what is the details of the financial agreements with the other debtors? Has McLaren offered assets to more than one party as collateral?

Am I getting this right? This sounds serious. Why is is the F1 press not talking about this? I understand the issue here with respect to McLaren > Zak Brown > Motorsports Network, but there are others who report content like this that are not "tied" to McLaren.

Richard
Richard Casto is offline  
__________________
To paraphrase Mark Twain... "I'm sorry I wrote such a long post; I didn't have time to write a short one."
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 12:23 (Ref:3983209)   #67
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 34,164
Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!Peter Mallett is the undisputed Champion of the World!
It is pretty scary if the numbers are correct. We now have McLaren and Williams subject to predatory investors.
Peter Mallett is offline  
__________________
In the current circumstances, we need to do all we can to help local businesses. With this in mind I suggest we all schedule our visits to the pub so we can keep the 2m social distancing and whilst there get completely slamied for two hours before handing over to the next shift.

It probably won't stop the virus but nobody would care.
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 17:06 (Ref:3983256)   #68
Mike Harte
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Mike Harte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
United Kingdom
W. Yorkshire
Posts: 3,449
Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!
Richard, this is really about one group of creditors trying to get a leg up to become "preferential creditors" so that they can force McLaren to accept their terms for extra funding.

And it would appear that McLaren believe that they can raise the funds on better terms from elsewhere. Whether that's true or not, who knows; but I suspect that now that this has reached court, it might be mute?
Mike Harte is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 19:12 (Ref:3983263)   #69
mark_l
Veteran
 
mark_l's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
England
Posts: 1,458
mark_l should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridmark_l should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Casto View Post
Am I getting this right? This sounds serious. Why is is the F1 press not talking about this? I understand the issue here with respect to McLaren > Zak Brown > Motorsports Network, but there are others who report content like this that are not "tied" to McLaren.

Richard
I suspect the rule of sub judice is in effect, that is why the media are not talking about it.
mark_l is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 19:25 (Ref:3983264)   #70
Mike Harte
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Mike Harte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
United Kingdom
W. Yorkshire
Posts: 3,449
Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark_l View Post
I suspect the rule of sub judice is in effect, that is why the media are not talking about it.

It's a civil matter being heard by a judge from the Chancellery Division, not a criminal case. And the judge has already published most of the salient details in his judgement allowing a speedy hearing to take place in early July.
Mike Harte is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 19:29 (Ref:3983266)   #71
mark_l
Veteran
 
mark_l's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
England
Posts: 1,458
mark_l should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridmark_l should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Harte View Post
It's a civil matter being heard by a judge from the Chancellery Division, not a criminal case. And the judge has already published most of the salient details in his judgement allowing a speedy hearing to take place in early July.
https://www.pinsentmasons.com/out-la...tempt-of-court
mark_l is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jun 2020, 22:23 (Ref:3983284)   #72
Richard Casto
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Richard Casto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
United States
Durham, NC, USA
Posts: 3,594
Richard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameRichard Casto will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
I can't speak to the particulars of UK law, but I assume any UK specific sub judice provisions only apply to UK based entities? I have been trying to find any other mention of this situation. I did find the link below which is a summary:

https://www.law360.com/transportatio...ough-uk-courts

Richard
Richard Casto is offline  
__________________
To paraphrase Mark Twain... "I'm sorry I wrote such a long post; I didn't have time to write a short one."
Quote
Old 23 Jun 2020, 08:59 (Ref:3983338)   #73
midgetman
Veteran
 
midgetman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
England
Rural Wiltshire
Posts: 5,562
midgetman is going for a new world record!midgetman is going for a new world record!midgetman is going for a new world record!midgetman is going for a new world record!midgetman is going for a new world record!midgetman is going for a new world record!midgetman is going for a new world record!
It was mentioned on Radio Five Live today. Something along the lines of "McLaren have said they need emergency funding by the end of July to ensure their continued participation. They want to out up their factory and collection of historic cars as security."

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
midgetman is offline  
__________________
Midgetman - known as Max Tyler to the world. MaxAttaq!
Quote
Old 23 Jun 2020, 09:38 (Ref:3983343)   #74
Mike Harte
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Mike Harte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
United Kingdom
W. Yorkshire
Posts: 3,449
Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!Mike Harte has a real shot at the podium!
By virtue of the fact that the judge published his initial findings, i.e. that there could be an expedited hearing on the matter, it becomes a public document. Therefore, as there were no reporting restrictions on the case, it would be entirely a matter for the media to decide whether they wished to cover the story.

There are no sub judice, or contempt of court, issues in reporting facts published by the judge.
Mike Harte is offline  
Quote
Old 23 Jun 2020, 11:36 (Ref:3983363)   #75
Moneyseeker
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,756
Moneyseeker is going for a new lap record!Moneyseeker is going for a new lap record!Moneyseeker is going for a new lap record!Moneyseeker is going for a new lap record!Moneyseeker is going for a new lap record!Moneyseeker is going for a new lap record!
The thing that interests me about McLaren and Williams situation is that both apparently need financing again in a short period, both have allegedly already commited their assets against other borrowing already. Fast forward and both have their investors, but what is the return?

Both McLaren and Williams are pinning their future fortunes on the budget cap of 145m. They will still have to beat the 'works' teams who will not 'unlearn' how to build an F1 car and will still attract the best sponsors and afford the best drivers. So you are in a scrap for 5th in the WCC in a battle that is going to be much closer than the one at the front - so you could easily still be quite competitive and only finish 6th or 8th with the FOM income that goes with it.

I imagine both teams will spend every penny of the 145m budget cap, which means Williams (for example) would need to spend more than they do now, which means neither are likely to deliver big (any?) profits. So, aside from putting your son in an F1 car, where is the upside (as they say these days) I can only see that it is getting assets on the cheap surely?
Moneyseeker is offline  
Quote
Reply

Bookmarks




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Will Bathurst get its funding ???? marcus Australasian Touring Cars. 12 18 Jan 2002 10:34


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 04:54.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2018 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.