Commodore Gone

[Sandgroper]

Ever driven or read the write ups on the territory.
thats 1 hideous car

[Forda]

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

Ever driven or read the write ups on the territory.
thats 1 hideous car

Wheels magazine test of a Territory vs a BMW X5:
https://www.whichcar.com.au/features...parison-review

Territory the winner, of course.

[Langers]

Originally Posted by Driver TBA

I was more thinking about a racing model, rather than a showroom model.

Holden have a cult following, so it kind of makes sense to keep racing and keep some passion for the brand.


Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

How do you monetise that is they’re not selling cars anymore?

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Razor

It's interesting to see Holden killing off cars that aren't SUV/4x4.

Seems to be a trend gathering pace around the globe sadly. Up in Europe the next generation Opel/ Vauxhall (acquired by PSA from GM a couple of years ago) Insignia is apparently going to be some high riding thing too. Big sedans are an endangered species.

I do love the big old rebadged Holdens that Vauxhall imported into Blighty. Although I am pootling around in a much smaller Astra VXR these days 😁

[Tourer]

A friend in the industry told me that Commodore is the best selling large sedan - not a bad car really but that segment of the market has collapsed effectively.

For the future - hard to know. I can see some benefit in doing at least some Co-branding with GM branding / signage added. That way Chev, Caddy for example could be sold with their existing badging etc through GM dealers. Either that to maybe wean the market off being used to the Holden name or just rip the bandaid off & re-brand the whole thing.

Would mean the end of a Holden racing program if that happened but might instead by GM or Chev, maybe Caddy?

[chavez]

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

Ever driven or read the write ups on the territory.
thats 1 hideous car

My wife's Territory drives well.

Then again the only Commodore I've ever liked driving is the Opel.

Was designated driver last night and drove a new Commodore again - I can't see anything wrong with it, other than the demand for medium to large sedans outside of the luxury brands has passed.

[Sandgroper]

Originally Posted by Forda

Wheels magazine test of a Territory vs a BMW X5:
https://www.whichcar.com.au/features...parison-review

Territory the winner, of course.

Easy done on a test but as a regular driver would have said. Thanks but no thanks. Eitherway I never purchased one, just from what ive heard from people that have one.

[Sandgroper]

Originally Posted by chavez

My wife's Territory drives well.

Then again the only Commodore I've ever liked driving is the Opel.

Was designated driver last night and drove a new Commodore again - I can't see anything wrong with it, other than the demand for medium to large sedans outside of the luxury brands has passed.

A family member who worked for Holden and HSV for years suggested the latest model is the best model he has ever driven for Holden. Shrugs
I guess if it was a V8 or Twin Turbo then people may have jumped on board.

Oh the memories

[Axeman444]

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

Easy done on a test but as a regular driver would have said. Thanks but no thanks. Eitherway I never purchased one, just from what ive heard from people that have one.

I had one for 10 years until upgrading 2 months ago, went well. Towed trailers up and down the East Coast faultlessly

[bludvl_x19]

Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks

Why do Ford refuse to build a sedan variant of the Mustang, called (I don't know) say the Falcon?

Because Ford US don't want that.
https://www.inc.com/minda-zetlin/for...-vehicles.html

[Forda]

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

Easy done on a test but as a regular driver would have said. Thanks but no thanks. Eitherway I never purchased one, just from what ive heard from people that have one.

Your criteria for assessing the Territory was reading a "write up" on one:

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

Ever driven or read the write ups on the territory.
thats 1 hideous car

So a Wheels road test was provided; where it beat the benchmark for the category, the X5.

But now what matters is what you "have heard from people that have one".

Righteo.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by Forda

Wheels magazine test of a Territory vs a BMW X5:
https://www.whichcar.com.au/features...parison-review

Territory the winner, of course.

If European mag did that test the Territory would not have got a look in. Wheels used to do unbiased road tests that were not influenced by anyone.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks

Unfortunately the Territory (and Falcon) platform ONLY supports right-hand-drive. Furthermore, while much loved, the Barra inline six is an orphan engine (long estranged from Ford's global six cylinders) and certainly doesn't meet Euro 6.

I did mention updating the technology did I not? That would naturally include ditching that lump of cast iron and using a motor that met current emissions standards.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by Forda

Your criteria for assessing the Territory was reading a "write up" on one:

So a Wheels road test was provided; where it beat the benchmark for the category, the X5.

But now what matters is what you "have heard from people that have one".

Righteo.

You obviously believed the road test, if it had been anti the Territory you would never have posted the link.

Righteo?

[Forda]

Originally Posted by Casper

If European mag did that test the Territory would not have got a look in. Wheels used to do unbiased road tests that were not influenced by anyone.

Huh? Why would a European mag do a road test on a Territory?

Where would they do the said test - in Europe, or here?

Agree Wheels independence is questionable, but it's never been slanted towards Ford.

[Forda]

Originally Posted by Casper

You obviously believed the road test, if it had been anti the Territory you would never have posted the link.

Righteo?

It was actually the first one which came up - found when the question was asked: "Ever driven or read the write ups on the territory."

That you didn't like it, is something you'll need to deal with.

Remember of course this has all arisen from the original and incorrect argument you put forth: "Both Ford and Holden failed for similar reasons, failure to read the market changes was one."
Ford read the emerging SUV market, and produced the Territory accordingly.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by Forda

It was actually the first one which came up - found when the question was asked: "Ever driven or read the write ups on the territory."

That you didn't like it, is something you'll need to deal with.

Remember of course this has all arisen from the original and incorrect argument you put forth: "Both Ford and Holden failed for similar reasons, failure to read the market changes was one."
Ford read the emerging SUV market, and produced the Territory accordingly.

I am an observer here and not a dogmatic fan of either Ford or Holden so I have no horse in this race. You are so you pick the arguments to suit your POV. How are the sheets of paper going these days, that was the most ridiculous defense of an argument I can remember in a long time.

[JAFA851]

Originally Posted by Casper

I am an observer here and not a dogmatic fan of either Ford or Holden so I have no horse in this race. You are so you pick the arguments to suit your POV. How are the sheets of paper going these days, that was the most ridiculous defense of an argument I can remember in a long time.

So true

[Forda]

Originally Posted by Casper

I am an observer here and not a dogmatic fan of either Ford or Holden so I have no horse in this race. You are so you pick the arguments to suit your POV. How are the sheets of paper going these days, that was the most ridiculous defense of an argument I can remember in a long time.

You didn't read what was said correctly, then waded into someone else's flimsy story, obviously to suit your own strange agenda.

While you might claim to be "an observer", you offered 'expert' opinion which was easily found to be incorrect.

It might be best you refrain from offering any more incorrect opinions.

[Sandgroper]

Originally Posted by Forda

Your criteria for assessing the Territory was reading a "write up" on one:

So a Wheels road test was provided; where it beat the benchmark for the category, the X5.

But now what matters is what you "have heard from people that have one".

Righteo.

Your so 1 eyed its inceredible. It was actually reading up, listing to a best friend that has and had one and opinions of 2 mechanics in the family. But ok then

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

Your so 1 eyed its inceredible. It was actually reading up, listing to a best friend that has and had one and opinions of 2 mechanics in the family. But ok then

I am a red blooded Holden man but the Territory was a good thing.

But it was still a passenger car while ****ing idiots drive around in cab crew trucks to save a little bit of tax.

[Woolley]

Keep it polite chaps, it's OK to disagree. As a Beemer driver I quite surprised when people get all territorial over 2nd rate manufacturers

[Casper]

Originally Posted by Forda

You didn't read what was said correctly, then waded into someone else's flimsy story, obviously to suit your own strange agenda.

While you might claim to be "an observer", you offered 'expert' opinion which was easily found to be incorrect.

It might be best you refrain from offering any more incorrect opinions.

Can you please expand on my incorrect opinions please and why they are incorrect in your version of the story. It is easy to assert things without evidence to to the contrary. Sheets of paper was an example of this.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Casper

Why Ford did not switch the Territory to off shore production is on of life's mysteries but I guess their masters in the US knew better. It had a good following here and with a new design and using good late model technology it would have continued to be popular. A revamped Territory would have sold world wide but Ford are dumb a***s just like GM.

The Mustang has sold 24,000 in how many years? Not what I would like to rely on and the numbers will sink further as the slide has already started. It is a one trick pony whereas the Ranger is sold in many segments of the market from commercial to Recreational and everything between.

Goes back to the AU Falcon. Ford Australia had the chance to engineer it for left hand drive but feared once it was left drive capable, Ford USA would seize on it and either see it as competition that needed killed off or take over the platform completely and make it in the USA making Ford Australia irrelevant. In the end, it didn't matter, Ford Australia and the Falcon ended up as an unprofitable outlier in Ford's worldwide scheme and it all got shut down anyways.

Sad deal for Australia to lose it's unique cars and manufacturing capability but in this global world it's manufacturing and cars were going to be at risk as they were owned by global brands. Perhaps if brands such as Holden were owned by Australians and sold unique Australian cars worldwide, things would have been different.

[chavez]

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

Your so 1 eyed its inceredible. It was actually reading up, listing to a best friend that has and had one and opinions of 2 mechanics in the family. But ok then

I asked two family members and one mechanic.

Family members it agreed it was a good car and appreciated the seven seat option and the luggage capacity.

The mechanic said the front end can be a little fragile but most of this customers seems to like the. Many bought a second after owning their first one.

So I guess both of our scientifically dubious survey and research resulted in slightly different outcomes.

According to wikipedia Ford sold over 175,000.

While I cannot be certain that not all of those buyers were mugs, there must have been many people happy with them.

The only mugs in this argument are those Holden fans that criticise the current Commodore model like Star Wars fans criticise the Last Jedi - just because it is not the car (or film) you want does not make it a bad car (or film).