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Old 9 Jun 2018, 06:56 (Ref:3827785)   #1
Greg Cozier
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Are there any restrictions on liquor livery?

In UK on historic race cars are there any restrictions on the advertisement of alcoholic beverages?
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 05:10 (Ref:3828006)   #2
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I’ll try and check more thoroughly when back home, but my initial thoughts are that period / historically correct advertising is allowed for ciggies, booze etc.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 06:29 (Ref:3828013)   #3
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Thanks Mike.

There seems to be lots of mis-information about.

I've read that it is OK as long as there is no monetary gain (as in no actual sponsorship).

Steve Perez carries Amigos livery on his Stratos for historic rallies in UK and EU.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 06:35 (Ref:3828014)   #4
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Mike, dont you think the appendix k states about this? I remember reading something meaning that you have to check with your local responsible, MSA and so, if it complies with actual domestic rules.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 08:02 (Ref:3828026)   #5
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I do not believe that there are any restrictions in the UK against alcohol advertising in motor sport. Current F1 cars carry sponsorship decals at the British GP, and several cars on the BTCC package carry similar decals.


I cannot see why historics should be treated differently in the UK.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 08:41 (Ref:3828035)   #6
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Mike, dont you think the appendix k states about this? I remember reading something meaning that you have to check with your local responsible, MSA and so, if it complies with actual domestic rules.
Yes, it’s the decision of individual country’s governing bodies. Pretty sure U.K. MSA allow if historically correct, and of course livery has to be detailed in HTP papers now... I will read up when home, or if anyone else has time- should be in The Blue Book?
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 09:00 (Ref:3828037)   #7
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Had a look at the blue book, and the only restriction for motor sport appears to apply to tobacco decals/advertising. However, it does state that if evidence is provided that cars ran in period with tobacco related advertising, they are still permitted.


Hence we still see the Marlboro, Camel, Players, etc. cars still being run at events in the UK.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 12:53 (Ref:3828064)   #8
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Thanks Mike.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 14:18 (Ref:3828091)   #9
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Hence we still see the Marlboro, Camel, Players, etc. cars still being run at events in the UK.
Interestingly, in France the F3 Classic competitors have had to change the liveries of their cars, even if they carried cigarette advertising in period. Hence, Gitanes became Titanes and Ducados became Docados.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 14:44 (Ref:3828101)   #10
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And Bas……… something became Basto? with a question mark.
Alan are you sure about authentic cars like Matra, Ligier, Lola and some Porsches too? I'm not sure it was the case during last tour auto but have to check.
F3 Classic have to show the right example, its a leader grid.
Greg's question was about liquor, then in this matter in France you should add "avec modération" and could keep the livery.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 14:44 (Ref:3828102)   #11
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Interestingly, in France the F3 Classic competitors have had to change the liveries of their cars, even if they carried cigarette advertising in period. Hence, Gitanes became Titanes and Ducados became Docados.

But haven't we seen the old F1 cars and sports racers in their original liveries at Le Mans. I'm sure that I recall seeing the Big Cats in their Silk Cut colours in last couple of years.
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Old 10 Jun 2018, 15:38 (Ref:3828110)   #12
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And Bas……… something became Basto? with a question mark.
Alan are you sure about authentic cars like Matra, Ligier, Lola and some Porsches too? I'm not sure it was the case during last tour auto but have to check.
F3 Classic have to show the right example, its a leader grid.
Greg's question was about liquor, then in this matter in France you should add "avec modération" and could keep the livery.
I guess the UK equivalent is "Please drink responsibly" I was just making the point that individual ASNs seem to be able to make their own rules. Sponsorship on racing cars has a bit of a notorious history in the UK. The fact that Surtees was sponsored by Durex (a condom manufacturer) was cited as a reason not to broadcast motor racing on TV in the UK in the mid-seventies.
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Old 11 Jun 2018, 10:58 (Ref:3828352)   #13
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I guess the UK equivalent is "Please drink responsibly" I was just making the point that individual ASNs seem to be able to make their own rules. Sponsorship on racing cars has a bit of a notorious history in the UK. The fact that Surtees was sponsored by Durex (a condom manufacturer) was cited as a reason not to broadcast motor racing on TV in the UK in the mid-seventies.
Restrictions on advertising are decided by each country (as with all "EU laws", the EU don't impose the laws it is each country that does so in the way they desire).

There was a time when some EU countries allowed fagvertising but others didn't hence different schemes at different European races. Of course those events were televised, so the relevant law would presumably have related to TV advertising.

Given that historic races aren't usually televised they wouldn't fall under the same laws but ASNs might decide to impose such rules across the board (which as with most FIA stuff would be of questionable legality but it's basically a private club so they can pretty much do whatever they want).

Alcohol adverts are presumably covered by similar regulations these days, with similar local variations, but the usual principle with old cars is that if they ran a livery in period it is acceptable to run it now - however Germany apparently insists on the fagfree version on F1 cars, so again it is a local issue...

I guess the answer to the original question is you need to check with the local ASN of each country you intend to race in... assuming it is an FIA event, otherwise ask the organisers.
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Old 12 Jun 2018, 06:53 (Ref:3828578)   #14
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The fact that Surtees was sponsored by Durex (a condom manufacturer) was cited as a reason not to broadcast motor racing on TV in the UK in the mid-seventies.
Hehehe this reminded me of their poster campaign at the time. Outside my office in Euston Rd was a huge poster adorned with a pic of the Durex liveried F1 car with the print underneath proclaiming "The small family car"
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Old 13 Jun 2018, 04:28 (Ref:3828780)   #15
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Cheese

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Outside my office in Euston Rd was a huge poster adorned with a pic of the liveried F1 car with the print underneath proclaiming "The small family car"

A measure against condoms, hard…… to believe!
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