|
|||||||||||
|
|||||||||||
7 Feb 2018, 20:03 (Ref:3799387) | #1 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
Masters Announce more rev limits plus.....
Masters HR already regulate the rev limits in Historic F1, World Sportscar Masters and V8 engines in Pre ‘66 Touring Cars, but for 2018 the last category will now have rev limits across the board. For over 3 litre engines, 7000rpm, smaller units 8000rpm. As with WSM, MSD 6AL ignition control units will be required to be fitted, and apparently will be sealed. Not clear as to how the rev limit is checked however.....
To help competitors with the extra expense, DT will supply the MSD units at 15% discount, and Masters will match this in the form of a credit against race entry costs. The 2018 regulations are now available on Masters website- http://www.mastershistoricracing.com/championships/ Will be interesting to see if the performance of smaller engined cars is affected, but it’s suggested that the emphasis is on controlling build and rebuild costs. Peter Auto have also introduced rev limits for Classic Endurance Racing entries, using the same control unit, plus a limit of 2 engines per season (sealed), so there appears to be a theme...... |
||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
7 Feb 2018, 21:07 (Ref:3799393) | #2 | ||
Subscriber
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,396
|
Quote:
|
||
|
8 Feb 2018, 06:25 (Ref:3799472) | #3 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
|||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 06:59 (Ref:3799474) | #4 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 10,045
|
Right Mike, not only CER but HTC too.
|
||
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps. |
8 Feb 2018, 07:08 (Ref:3799475) | #5 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
|||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 08:33 (Ref:3799481) | #6 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 9,710
|
That would certainly affect U2TC cars if it were introduced.
most of them don't do anything until they get above 7000 now. |
|
|
8 Feb 2018, 09:20 (Ref:3799486) | #7 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 10,045
|
As to HTC dont think it will really affect anyone. Some using 2 machines, will be allowed 4 engines! And they dont specify if refurbishing is also concerned. As suggested by Mike, how will the MSD pack will cope with points and condenser systems? Does the appendix K allows rev limiters for all categories? May be the end of this old rule?
|
||
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps. |
8 Feb 2018, 09:30 (Ref:3799489) | #8 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 799
|
The 2 engine per season ruling....I wonder how they are going to enforce this?
I presume they have bought it in to stop the Quali spec and race spec engines, and/or new engine every event, but won’t it clobber those honest folk who have chronic bad luck and there single engine has to be rebuilt more than once during the season.....are they really going to be turned away from events? I am pretty sure appx k states you can’t use rev limiters too..... Confused of Camberley! |
||
__________________
Will Stephens 60s endurance 1965 356sc #49 Mag 7's #60 |
8 Feb 2018, 10:42 (Ref:3799503) | #9 | |
Subscriber
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,396
|
So the spot price value of the car, potentially, falls as the season passes and it uses up its "engine allowance" for the year?
Does a car that starts the year with last year's engine still have 2 engines in hand or does what planned life is left in last year's engine count as one engine for this year? I would have thought that economics (for the maintainers perhaps, rather than the owners but still ....) would suggest not a limit per se but a penalty for exceeding the limit. Effectively an "indulgence" payment whether financial, points (in the championship rounds) or grid/laps penalty. Ditto rev limits. There must come a point where for technical reasons it would be better to simply record engine revs and penalise excess in some way without compromising existing build regulations and older technology. All of that said one has to wonder why these sorts of rules are found to be necessary in a hobby sport mainly supported by enthusiasts. |
|
|
8 Feb 2018, 11:03 (Ref:3799508) | #10 | ||
Rookie
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 31
|
App K
6.5.2 An electronic rev limiter may be used from Period F onwards. |
||
__________________
Keith Walker |
8 Feb 2018, 12:35 (Ref:3799532) | #11 | ||||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
Quote:
Quote:
Err, you're forgetting the 'Arms Race'............ |
||||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 12:42 (Ref:3799536) | #12 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 10,045
|
I dont think it will affect the true enthusiasts who are limited by their wallet or common sense!
Not the same effect on all categories though, U2TC as you say and really small displacement like 1.3 litre or less. There are two different classic racing worlds, one for the pros and another for the amateurs/ enthusiasts. I can't see any inconvenient to that, was already the case in period. |
||
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps. |
8 Feb 2018, 13:49 (Ref:3799553) | #13 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
I didn't look close enough at the Masters rev limit initiative! It is being applied to some of the Gentleman Drivers Grid as well. Quoted below-
7.5.1 The RPM limit on all cars will be restricted as per 7.5.3 unless the engine type used is not listed therein. Only the use of an MSD 6AL ignition control (ref: MSD PN 6425) is permitted to control the RPM. The permitted ignition control must be fitted well out of reach of the competitor/driver. 7.5.2 Any control of the advance curve must only be RPM related. It must be executed solely by means of the distributor. No external control of the advance system is permitted. MSD ignition boxes that control advance or allow advance mapping are not permitted. 7.5.3 REV Limits: V8-engines – 7000rpm Twin-cam engines – 8000rpm Jaguar straight-six engines – 6500rpm Austin Healey 3000 – 7000rpm |
||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 15:31 (Ref:3799590) | #14 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 10,045
|
Oups, Escort vs Capri Westlake or GAA will be a hard fight. Nothing about Astons? No external control of the advance is a good thing.
|
||
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps. |
8 Feb 2018, 15:59 (Ref:3799600) | #15 | |||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
Quote:
As far as Aston's are concerned, don't think there many to be seen in GD. I guess if one starts beating cars it shouldn't then a rev limit will be applied to them as well |
|||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 18:25 (Ref:3799647) | #16 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
Appears there’s more changes from Masters, according a report in Autosport today- Specifically Historic F1.....
First is a separate season championship trophy for the over 60s! With an influx of hotshoes driving for owners, that’s a good move for the older or indeed pensioner owner-driver. Second, the grid for the second HF1 race at meetings will be reversed, but only the top 8. Without looking, I’m not sure if the second race grid is based on the result of race 1 or qualifying. Third, and perhaps the most interesting, is that overtaking will not be allowed in a race until after the first corner. This will hopefully reduce the chance of car damage and possible driver injury, Masters say. Last edited by Mike Bell; 9 Feb 2018 at 07:08. Reason: Sp |
||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 18:44 (Ref:3799653) | #17 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 10,045
|
Quote:
Do you remember an Aston beating all the Jag's during last Classic? May be this particular one will be ballasted with its FE? |
|||
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps. |
8 Feb 2018, 19:35 (Ref:3799664) | #18 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 515
|
Perhaps banning the use of dog boxes in fia minis should also be considered.
|
||
__________________
"Hot rods" rule. |
8 Feb 2018, 19:45 (Ref:3799669) | #19 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
|||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 19:49 (Ref:3799670) | #20 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
|||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
8 Feb 2018, 20:37 (Ref:3799687) | #21 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 515
|
|||
__________________
"Hot rods" rule. |
9 Feb 2018, 06:28 (Ref:3799776) | #22 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 14,830
|
|||
__________________
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere. (Einstein) |
13 Feb 2018, 09:12 (Ref:3800887) | #23 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 9,710
|
||
|
13 Feb 2018, 09:23 (Ref:3800888) | #24 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 455
|
Ruling engines by the number and per season is not easy, what is going to be sealed and how is it going to be policed, that is the answer. To my belief and I was behind the desk when that rule was introduced back in 2015 already, it is a matter of saying "there is control" rather than truly controlling the problem of engine development if I may say. As it turned out, some used more than 2 engines already back in 2015 and it has been going on ever since then I guess.
On REV limits, we will see what it brings, we are enforcing it in the FIA Sports Car Championship from this year and accross the whole scope of cars and engines with the responsibility being on the Competitor to police his throttle and us to verify he respects it. We will see how it goes but in Touring Cars, i believe it's a way forward. Some of the recent development have gone through the roof in terms of REVS and short engine life for the sake of horsepower, time to limit it and keep it period in a way... On the Minis, I would not only look at dog boxes but also at gear ratios they are using... It goes beyond gear engagement, trust me... |
||
__________________
The good, the bad, the ugly, it's the law. |
13 Feb 2018, 18:22 (Ref:3801055) | #25 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 10,045
|
For several years, VdeV has been limiting the revs to 8k (protos with Honda engine) after discussions with the teams. Worked fine.
The 6,5 k mark for the Jag's seems period correct but not that generous. All in all a good move forward if common sens prevails. |
||
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps. |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
REV LIMITS on V8s- This season.... | Mike Bell | Historic Racing Today | 43 | 21 Jan 2015 17:48 |
Btcc at Thruxton and Silverstone plus GP Masters | CombeMarshal | Marshals Forum | 7 | 28 Apr 2006 15:40 |
more, more, more | Top Gear | Touring Car Racing | 22 | 2 Jan 2004 22:07 |
To rev or not to rev. That is the question. | Sharky | Road Car Forum | 7 | 4 May 2001 01:39 |