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Old 6 Feb 2018, 22:20 (Ref:3799138)   #511
rich07
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rich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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Originally Posted by peckstar View Post
great. doesnt change or add to the discussion, but great


Thanks for your words of wisdom but your opinion on my posts is irrelevant.

Thereís some wise posters on this forum who are able to debate knowledgeably about where the series should head but youíre certainly not one of them.

I know this post will be deleted but since Iíve already screen capped it thatís irrelevant too
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Old 6 Feb 2018, 22:30 (Ref:3799143)   #512
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Thanks for your words of wisdom but your opinion on my posts is irrelevant.

Thereís some wise posters on this forum who are able to debate knowledgeably about where the series should head but youíre certainly not one of them.

I know this post will be deleted but since Iíve already screen capped it thatís irrelevant too

talking about history of a once a year race that has now changed is not debating knowledgeably. Its throwing in an stawman that is irrelevant.

but on that subject, most of my suggestions regarding improvements to the 12 hour have happened, but the so called "knowledgeable" posters on here argued against them constantly. Your opinion on knowledgeable would thus appear to be incorrect.
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Old 6 Feb 2018, 22:44 (Ref:3799144)   #513
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Axeman444 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridAxeman444 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Nostradamus was always deemed correct also, by people who could manipulate his sweeping generalisations to their opinion/agenda
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Old 6 Feb 2018, 23:52 (Ref:3799155)   #514
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over. When drivers, teams, sponsors, and manufacturers are no longer making long-term commitments to the sport, changes need to be made.

Manufacturers are committed to GT3, GT4, and now TCR, because they are based around business strategies that do actually offer a return on investment, on a much larger scale. They're all based on production cars, so the manufacturer takes their slice of selling the car itself, and by default, wherever the car goes, it'll still carry brand recognition.

The constructor does the design work, the R&D the assembly, the technical and parts support, and amortises the cost of that over the numerous cars they sell to the national agents around the world.

The national agents sell the cars direct to the customer, whilst also offering technical and parts support, and again taking their slice.

The customer buys a car that can be raced anywhere in the world, in any number of championships. The car holds it's resale value, parts can be bought either from the national agent, or direct from the mothership for many years to come. They don't have to worry about the ongoing costs of development, or being left with a dead duck if the series falls over. If they want to put this year's updates on it, they can. If the series promotor leaves town, they can stick the car on Racecars Direct, and ship it off to some other part of the world. The long-term running costs are pretty cheap, and for a sprint round, you could get away with running it with a crew of less than 5 part-timers.

Plug-and-play race cars, on globalised rulesets are the way forward, if professional motorsport wants to be anywhere near sustainable.
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Old 6 Feb 2018, 23:56 (Ref:3799159)   #515
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Nostradamus was always deemed correct also, by people who could manipulate his sweeping generalisations to their opinion/agenda
I think my points have been clear and succinct, even to dot point form and reasoning. Not sweeping generalisations which i guess is was what your post just was
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 00:30 (Ref:3799165)   #516
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E.B should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridE.B should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridE.B should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
This thread was quite interesting.... until it became a b***h slapping tit for tat fest.
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 00:58 (Ref:3799167)   #517
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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This thread was quite interesting.... until it became a b***h slapping tit for tat fest.
Agreed. The snide remarks aren't really necessary.
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 01:25 (Ref:3799176)   #518
V8 Fireworks
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V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by Umai Naa View Post
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over. When drivers, teams, sponsors, and manufacturers are no longer making long-term commitments to the sport, changes need to be made.

Manufacturers are committed to GT3, GT4, and now TCR, because they are based around business strategies that do actually offer a return on investment, on a much larger scale. They're all based on production cars, so the manufacturer takes their slice of selling the car itself, and by default, wherever the car goes, it'll still carry brand recognition.
Spot on.

There is a open niche for 4-door performance sedans with more performance than GT4 and less than GT3, with rear wheel drive and six/eight cylinders (unlike the front wheel drive and four cylinders of TCR) -- akin to the current product but with manufacturer DNA, rather than generic control chassis that isn't enticing manufacturers.

Supercars ought to get at it, and slot their regulations into this gap.
Once it is establshed Supercars could export this set of regulations around the world?

If they play it right, the likes of Tickford and 888 could be filling 50 orders per year for export to compatible series around the globe! It would make an Aussie proud.

It might be seen (in the short term) as a retrograde step to go to production-based Giulia, Stiger or Lexus IS bodyshells and then apply BOP to the resultant racecars, but it might be just what is needed? An actual Stinger twin-turbo or Giulia twin-turbo, with a lightly tuned production engine, and a suitable Hewland or Holinger sequential box behind it, might be the ticket to entice manufacturers?

With BOP they would be ensured both:

1) A product that is relevant to their road-going product.
2) That they will be competitive.

For engineering firms like Tickford and 888:

1) Large source of revenue from vehicles and spares.
2) Thriving business.

For competitors:

1) A capped purchase and spares price.
2) A set homologation period (say 5 years) where they know the car will be eligible and competitive... No expensive development costs involved.

Sounds attractive?

Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 7 Feb 2018 at 01:34.
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 01:42 (Ref:3799178)   #519
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mayhem should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmayhem should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Isnt that a MARC II?
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 02:27 (Ref:3799183)   #520
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Spot on.

There is a open niche for 4-door performance sedans with more performance than GT4 and less than GT3, with rear wheel drive and six/eight cylinders (unlike the front wheel drive and four cylinders of TCR) -- akin to the current product but with manufacturer DNA, rather than generic control chassis that isn't enticing manufacturers.

Supercars ought to get at it, and slot their regulations into this gap.
Once it is establshed Supercars could export this set of regulations around the world?

If they play it right, the likes of Tickford and 888 could be filling 50 orders per year for export to compatible series around the globe! It would make an Aussie proud.

It might be seen (in the short term) as a retrograde step to go to production-based Giulia, Stiger or Lexus IS bodyshells and then apply BOP to the resultant racecars, but it might be just what is needed? An actual Stinger twin-turbo or Giulia twin-turbo, with a lightly tuned production engine, and a suitable Hewland or Holinger sequential box behind it, might be the ticket to entice manufacturers?
IS there a niche though? Therotically yes, But in practise who is crying out for that category. DTM (and their maufcaturers) for instance have just moved away from it.

USA has NASCAR, but who else outside Australia is looking for that category?

europe, in my observation, have tended to have small 4 cyclinder racing, where as in Australia we have preferred thew larger sedans, Which we no longer make.
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 03:36 (Ref:3799187)   #521
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Isnt that a MARC II?
No a Marc II is still a generic spaceframe car, like a COTF Supercar.

The notion of a generic spaceframe strongly deters many manufacturers, who would prefer to have a racecar with the "DNA" of the roadcar and then have it balance-of-performanced as required.

"IS there a niche though? Therotically yes, But in practise who is crying out for that category. DTM (and their maufcaturers) for instance have just moved away from it.

USA has NASCAR, but who else outside Australia is looking for that category?"

The key would be to drop Ford and Holden, and focus on prestige marques who (unlike Ford or Holden) actually sell performance sedans. Especially those who do not current produce a GT3 racer such as Alfa Romeo.
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 05:08 (Ref:3799204)   #522
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the Gt3 Blancpain Gt series. That has now formed the Intercontinental Gt challenge
The Intercontinental GT Challenge was not formed out of the the Blancpain Endurance Series, it's been running for getting onto 10 years now for GT3 cars and will do so again in 2018.
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 05:13 (Ref:3799205)   #523
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The Intercontinental GT Challenge was not formed out of the the Blancpain Endurance Series, it's been running for getting onto 10 years now for GT3 cars and will do so again in 2018.
great, please quote in context, but anyway we have all moved on

but if we are going to be picky then NO! the Intercontinental GT Challenge has not be running for ten years.

Last edited by peckstar; 7 Feb 2018 at 05:20.
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 05:23 (Ref:3799207)   #524
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great, please quote in context, but anyway we have all moved on
You were saying that the IGTC was a European Championship being a World Championship.... given that only 1 event in Europe has ever been a part of the IGTC, how is that so?
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Old 7 Feb 2018, 05:33 (Ref:3799210)   #525
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You were saying that the IGTC was a European Championship being a World Championship.... given that only 1 event in Europe has ever been a part of the IGTC, how is that so?
Not sure why you keep saying things ive never said. It was never a european championship, read the events that have made it up.

Move on, because the rest of us have
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