Home Mobile Forum News Cookbook FaceBook Us T-Shirts etc.: Europe/Worldwide. eBay Motorsport Links Advertising Live Chat  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides  
Related Sites: Classic Cars Monthly Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Historic Racing & Motorsport History > Historic Racing Today


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 23 Jan 2011, 14:20 (Ref:2819530)   #61
Jeremy Hall
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 384
Jeremy Hall should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by JasperClan View Post
No they were cancelled when Clan went bust before paying the bill. However, I believe that there are moves afoot to re-homologate, if thats the right word.

Pete Richards
I understand it some what differently. Apparently there was an application which came to the attention of another manufacturer making a similar car and sharing the same gearbox. Clan had allegedly claimed 100 cars had been made but the other party contactd the gearbox manufacturer and asked how many gearboxes Clan had bought.It was then apparent that the gearbox number was nowhere near the required 100 stated in the application. The other manufacturer contacted the RAC and advised them that the homolgation application would be opposed.There was some chest beating but then Clan allegedly backed down.
Hence no homologation and presumably none in retrospect.
Jeremy Hall is offline  
Quote
Old 23 Jan 2011, 17:39 (Ref:2819568)   #62
one-two
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 203
one-two should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
lotus 7

Does anyone know the current position on Lotus 7 homologation please? Apologies if this isn't the right place to ask. I think there used to be a special note in App K that referred to it, but that seems to have gone in more recent years and there seems instead to be a new range of categories of historic cars that might include it. Many thanks, Robert
one-two is offline  
Quote
Old 24 Jan 2011, 09:58 (Ref:2819778)   #63
Jeremy Hall
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 384
Jeremy Hall should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by one-two View Post
Does anyone know the current position on Lotus 7 homologation please? Apologies if this isn't the right place to ask. I think there used to be a special note in App K that referred to it, but that seems to have gone in more recent years and there seems instead to be a new range of categories of historic cars that might include it. Many thanks, Robert
The Lotus 7 was never homologated. There were various reasons but the principal one was that it lacked doors and every category, outside single seaters, always required at least one door. The knock on effect was that no Lotus 7 took part in an International event-or at least legally- thus it has never been accepted by the FIA as a mainstream historic car. Some ASN -notably France- find a way of running them in ''old car race meetings'' but essentially they remain outside the loop. I suspect that will not change a great deal.
Jeremy Hall is offline  
Quote
Old 24 Jan 2011, 11:31 (Ref:2819816)   #64
JasperClan
Racer
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
United Kingdom
Benwick
Posts: 154
JasperClan should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeremy Hall View Post
I understand it some what differently. Apparently there was an application which came to the attention of another manufacturer making a similar car and sharing the same gearbox. Clan had allegedly claimed 100 cars had been made but the other party contactd the gearbox manufacturer and asked how many gearboxes Clan had bought.It was then apparent that the gearbox number was nowhere near the required 100 stated in the application. The other manufacturer contacted the RAC and advised them that the homolgation application would be opposed.There was some chest beating but then Clan allegedly backed down.
Hence no homologation and presumably none in retrospect.
I think that refers to the Prodsports application and not the actual FIA homologation which was I believe for the rally Clan and undertaken by Andy Dawson.

Pete Richards
JasperClan is offline  
Quote
Old 24 Jan 2011, 12:54 (Ref:2819855)   #65
one-two
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 203
one-two should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
lotus 7

I don't want to distract from the Clan discussion, but my reading of Appendix K is that it now runs well beyond cars that were homologated and/or used in international competition in period. There are a number of references to non-homologated cars in section 2, and in section 2.3.11 we read about National Competition road-going Sports/Grand Touring Cars, which are

2.3.11.1 Models of production road-going Sports / Grand Touring cars from periods E to J which have no competition history at international level but which have established a significant competition history at national level in major events for production sport and/or grand touring cars and which comply with the national regulations relevant to those events.

There may well be a reason why that doesn't cover the Lotus 7, but, to my untrained eye, it doesn't look as if it's its exclusion from period international racing. It looks as if inclusion in period national racing is sufficient? What you then do with your National Competition road-going Sports/Grand Touring car is a different question! Many thanks, Robert
one-two is offline  
Quote
Old 24 Jan 2011, 14:08 (Ref:2819894)   #66
Jeremy Hall
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 384
Jeremy Hall should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by JasperClan View Post
I think that refers to the Prodsports application and not the actual FIA homologation which was I believe for the rally Clan and undertaken by Andy Dawson.

Pete Richards
I cannot find any homologation for this car in the FIA list-but it may be me.
Jeremy Hall is offline  
Quote
Old 24 Jan 2011, 14:38 (Ref:2819913)   #67
JasperClan
Racer
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
United Kingdom
Benwick
Posts: 154
JasperClan should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
That's right. No current homologation unfortunately.

Pete Richards
JasperClan is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Aug 2011, 07:04 (Ref:2941972)   #68
terence
Veteran
 
terence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Germany
Nordschleife
Posts: 12,612
terence should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridterence should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Nothing to do with Clans I'm afraid but thought it worth mentioning that after FIVE years of persistence,searching and anything else you could imagine,we have now got the HTPs for the Bluebell-Gibb's HRG!
terence is offline  
__________________
Living the dream,Chief instruktor and racing on the worlds best circuits-The Nordschleife and Spa.Getting to drive the worlds best cars-someone has to do it, so glad its me.
Quote
Old 18 Aug 2011, 11:41 (Ref:2942450)   #69
Robert Farrell
Racer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 155
Robert Farrell should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I`m unsure as to whether this aids or hinders the Clan discussion. But, looking at at a copy of the 1973 Scottish International Rally. Official Programme. 15p ! Shows Donald Heggie/George Dean. No21. Clan Crusader. Running in category B. Group 5. International competition history? Also I would have thought it must have had some sort of paperwork to present at scrutineering. I know we had to produce ours for our Gp1 Ascona.
Robert Farrell is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Aug 2011, 13:37 (Ref:2942496)   #70
John Turner
Race Official
Veteran
 
John Turner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
United Kingdom
Pontesbury, Shropshire
Posts: 12,893
John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by terence bower View Post
Nothing to do with Clans I'm afraid but thought it worth mentioning that after FIVE years of persistence,searching and anything else you could imagine,we have now got the HTPs for the Bluebell-Gibb's HRG!
Terry, please remind us what year this was built and what spec it runs to. You might guess why I ask!
John Turner is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Aug 2011, 14:42 (Ref:2942517)   #71
JasperClan
Racer
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
United Kingdom
Benwick
Posts: 154
JasperClan should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
At the recent 40th Anniversary celebration of the first production Clan I came across the following in respect of the Clan homologation.

The Clan was homologated into Group 4 sports car racing. Group 4 called for an annual production of 500 identical cars and some drivers of rival makes challenged the homologation, which had been certified by the RAC. An appeal was made by these rival drivers to the FIA, who rescinded the homologation, because the necessary 500 cars had not been built.

The above was in a publication 'Cars of Today'

With all the tales of cars being moved around during inspection for homologation to achieve the required numbers by the large manufacturers its appears to me that Clan were unfortunate in their case.

There must be records of the above and in my opinion you could argue that the Clan was homologated in Group 4 and the statement would be the truth!

Pete Richards
JasperClan is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Aug 2011, 15:35 (Ref:2942536)   #72
Peter Mallett
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
 
Peter Mallett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
England
Here and there
Posts: 31,680
Peter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FamePeter Mallett will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
I know I generally argue the opposite, but there are times when it would make sense to do what you say. If for no other reason that a relatively low cost vehicle would be available to people for historic events.

JR makes a good point in the Spa 6hrs thread when he suggests that there is a general downturn in entries and perhaps enthusiasm at the moment. Cars like the Clan are interesting and fun, so it would be good to homologate them...... or do something. I view them in very much the same light as the Swallow Dorretti.
Peter Mallett is offline  
__________________
Nobody told me we had a communication problem!
Quote
Old 18 Aug 2011, 15:38 (Ref:2942538)   #73
John Turner
Race Official
Veteran
 
John Turner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
United Kingdom
Pontesbury, Shropshire
Posts: 12,893
John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!
Completely agree, Peter
John Turner is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Aug 2011, 16:27 (Ref:2942558)   #74
Robert Farrell
Racer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 155
Robert Farrell should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
As the Clan was accepted in international motorsport events as a Group 5 car. The following indicates it must have been homologated as a Group 4 car at some point.
SPECIAL PRODUCTION CARS (Group 5)
Art 268-Definition: Special production cars for which no minimum production
number is required, but which are derived from those cars benefiting from
a valid homologation in Groups 1 to 4.
Robert Farrell is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Aug 2011, 20:31 (Ref:2942657)   #75
Brian A
Racer
 
Brian A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
England
Sunny West Sussex
Posts: 402
Brian A should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Mallett View Post
........... I view them in very much the same light as the Swallow Dorretti.

Ah - but you would be able to get HTP papers on a Doretti as one raced at an International event at Silverstone in 1954 driven by Don Truman. He was up against the likes of Archie Scott-Brown in a Lister-Bristol, Peter Collins, Roy Salvadori and Carroll Shelby in Astons and Duncan Hamilton, Tony Rolt amd Ninian Sanderson in Jaguars. But he did finish and beat the Austin Healeys which was the purpose of the exercise, Scott-Brown won.

A Doretti also started the 1955 Sebring 12 hours but was black flagged after a few laps as it was formally a reserve - but had started anyway. It seems that the race organisation at Sebring was a little on the relaxed side back then.
Brian A is offline  
__________________
Brian Arculus
Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Tags
homologation papers



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FIA Homologation papers - 1965 Shelby GT350 BBR Historic Racing Today 4 7 Dec 2009 20:00
FIA mustang homologation papers profi Australasian Touring Cars. 33 1 Jun 2009 18:29
FIA historic homologation papers Bud Byrnes Historic Racing Today 1 21 Jul 2005 21:49
FiA Homologation papers zefarelly Historic Racing Today 5 26 Aug 2003 15:41
FIA homologation papers for pre 1967 E-types E-Type Historic Racing Today 4 25 Mar 2000 04:44


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 10:55.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2018 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.