2021 Silly Season

[gert]

In a way they have the luxury of choice AND they can afford to wait.

It is unlikely Perez, Hulkenberg, Albon, Tsunoda, Kvyat all sign somewhere else before Red Bull decides for its own race team and Alpha Tauri.

[steve_r]

At many (most) races, where nothing bizarre happens, there is usually a massive gap between the 2 Mercedes & Verstappen at the front and the next best. I think we need to see Albon stick his car in that gap. If he cant deliver that, then surely he needs to at least be fighting with LeClerc / Riccardo or whoever the "best of the rest" is.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by gert

In a way they have the luxury of choice AND they can afford to wait.

It is unlikely Perez, Hulkenberg, Albon, Tsunoda, Kvyat all sign somewhere else before Red Bull decides for its own race team and Alpha Tauri.

As to waiting. It guess it depends upon how they prioritize the list above (throw in George Russell as a dark horse if you believe rumors of his potential exit at Williams). I broadly assume they would prefer Perez or Hulkenberg over the rest. And if they have a strong preference between those two, might they want to lock up that driver sooner rather than later? Especially as a few seats remain at play.

If Albon's seat hinges upon Imola performance (post on prior page) then they don't have long to wait to pull the trigger on a decision. I suspect a decision on the 2nd RBR seat may trigger other teams to confirm their selections?

Richard

[chillibowl]

as a Thai driver, does Albon indirectly carry more backing that we are not accounting for in this equation?

Perez has money but is not yet a race winner and Hulk brings no money and has never even been on a podium. imo its also an unknown whether either driver is capable of running at the sharp end any better than Albon.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

as a Thai driver, does Albon indirectly carry more backing that we are not accounting for in this equation?

No idea.

Originally Posted by chillibowl

Perez has money but is not yet a race winner and Hulk brings no money and has never even been on a podium. imo its also an unknown whether either driver is capable of running at the sharp end any better than Albon.

If you look at the points situation, Perez is currently ahead of Albon. Not by a lot, but enough to be pertinent. Then the question is the relative performance of RBR vs. Racing Point. I assume Max is getting the maximum from the car and Albon is not. Is that the same for Perez and Stroll? Lets assume that Perez is getting close to the maximum and Stroll is not. If that is so, then it is more likely the car is holding him back and not his ability. And as I say, Perez is scoring more points than Albon at the moment.

Add all of that together, and I think Perez over Albon at RBR is a no-brainer. But it does assume that the Red Bull car is better than Racing Point. While the Racing Point is very good, I don't think putting RBR above it is a bad assumption.

While Hulkenberg has impressed in his substitutions, I think he is more risky than Perez. I like the idea of Russell jumping into the seat, but as much as I like Russell, we need to see him in a better car before he goes straight to one of the top teams (IMHO). He HAS shown quick pace when testing the Mercedes, but it seems to be that Russell runs into issues during the race vs. pure potential. The question is... is that him or is that down to the Williams? So I place Russell as much more risky than Perez or Hulkenberg.

Now, how would Perez perform against Verstappen? Good question. Would he just be "much closer" or would he be pushing/challenging him? That is the question.

Richard

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

Now, how would Perez perform against Verstappen? Good question. Would he just be "much closer" or would he be pushing/challenging him? That is the question.

Richard

I think the real question regarding Perez is: Will he, on track, be a team player if the teams interest requires it from him?

The uncertainty of this question offsets quite a few dollars.

I reckon both Hulkenberg and Perez will be around 0.3s off Verstappen's pace. That's close enough to limit Mercedes strategic options up till a second stop.

[chillibowl]

after being somewhat unceremoniously discarded by RP and maybe being used a bit to protect the owner's son, if Perez had a bad attitude or was not a true team player, one would have expected it to come out by now?

for sure he has banged wheels with his team mate before but surely never as often or egregiously as say his replacement Vettel has.

anyways, while i agree Perez would be the top choice for replacement, just dont see the logic of the switch for RB (or maybe i just dont want to see it?). they certainly cant take his money and fire him in the middle of the season if they decide they dont like him.

Albon gives them that kind of flexibility!

[S griffin]

I think RP have underestimated Perez, how much was this decision down to Stroll and how much has it been to the racing side? I haven’t heard anything about him being difficult to work with, quite the opposite

Yes he sometimes clashed with his team mate, but that was usually both of them being hungry and eager to prove themselves. Other than that he’s been the ultimate pro and I can understand them replacing him with someone like Hamilton, but Vettel is a big risk at this time. Vettel started well in F1, now has looked out of it. Involved in too many incidents and not pushing his car like his team mate and letting too many things get to him

Perez would have been the perfect fit at McLaren or Mercedes. Not sure Red Bull would be right, good car, but an uncertain future for them. He would be better off elsewhere IMHO, too much risk going there.

All in all I hope we see Checo on the grid in 2021

[P38 in workshop]

Hard to see Perez back at McLaren after they booted him out fairly abruptly a few years ago.I'm rather hoping one or two wealthy gentlemen will get the message that throwing money at their sons won't actually buy the talent they lack..........

[djinvicta]

Originally Posted by P38 in workshop

Hard to see Perez back at McLaren after they booted him out fairly abruptly a few years ago.I'm rather hoping one or two wealthy gentlemen will get the message that throwing money at their sons won't actually buy the talent they lack..........

Agreed.. The problem is, with that much money to play with.. its a hobby, not a risk.

[gert]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

I think the real question regarding Perez is: Will he, on track, be a team player if the teams interest requires it from him?

Why would he not?



Or are you really asking - like someone else (maybe you, maybe not) already did - "is he prepared to be #2 and help Verstappen win"?

I'm quite convinced Pereze would be a good team player.
I'm not convinced the "you are number 2" approach will work wonders.

Afer all: we don't see that at Mercedes, or at Red Bull (it happens to be that way, but Albon was never told he couldn't beat Verstappen, nor was Gasly before him), or Ferrari.

We - and possibly the teams as well - may have expectations on how things will unfold in a rather natual way, but I don't think any team will prohibit their so-called #2 to beat their so-called #1 in the first few races of the year.
After a couple of races, the order will establish itself, and teams will take it from there.

Same thing happened at Ferrari last year.

[V8 Fireworks]

Originally Posted by gert

(but Albon was never told he couldn't beat Verstappen, nor was Gasly before him)

Regardless, it is clear that Albon is expected to jump out of Verstappen's way should he find himself ahead after a race start.

Defending hard for lap after lap as the Mercedes speed away would not be tolerated by the Red Bull pit wall.

A good solution could be:

Red Bull - Verstappen/Hulkenberg (Hulkenberg = more pliable as #2)
AlphaTauri - Gasly/Perez (bank those Perez dollars and have a VERY strong midfield pairing to maximise points)

My first preference would be, however, brining in Russell as an equal number one at Red Bull. There are not many chances to steal such a talented junior from Mercedes.

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by gert

Why would he not?



Or are you really asking - like someone else (maybe you, maybe not) already did - "is he prepared to be #2 and help Verstappen win"?

Yes.

I'm quite convinced Pereze would be a good team player.

I'm not convinced that can be said with certainty regarding on track (yes bold and italic as some missed it the first time) behaviour based on previous teammate clashes. What if Verstappen has a mechanical early in the season like this year and Perez has a point lead. Will he still understand that RBR has it's cards set on Verstappen and comply?

I'm not convinced the "you are number 2" approach will work wonders.

Afer all: we don't see that at Mercedes, or at Red Bull (it happens to be that way, but Albon was never told he couldn't beat Verstappen, nor was Gasly before him), or Ferrari.

Mercedes does have a number 2 approach. The difference being that they implemented it beforehand by putting a driver in the seat that is just the right amount slower so things take care of themselves. Mercedes does not need to fight for every point so why enforce any further #2 measures on track?


Albon and Gasly simply were slow enough that there was no requirement for 2# measures on track.

We - and possibly the teams as well - may have expectations on how things will unfold in a rather natual way, but I don't think any team will prohibit their so-called #2 to beat their so-called #1 in the first few races of the year.
After a couple of races, the order will establish itself, and teams will take it from there.

Same thing happened at Ferrari last year.

That depends on how tight the title fight is. If you are in a very tight battle with another team and perhaps your car-driver combo is at a slight disadvantage then yes 2# measures can be enforced.

[gert]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

What if Verstappen has a mechanical early in the season like this year and Perez has a point lead. Will he still understand that RBR has it's cards set on Verstappen and comply?

If Perez has more points than Verstappen AND is in front of him in the next race then I see little reason for him to move out of the way and let Verstappen by (assuming they are on the same race strategy) and frankly I also see little reason for Red Bull to ask or expect him too. I'm not even convinced they would ask him to do that, at that point in the season.

Originally Posted by Taxi645

Mercedes does have a number 2 approach. The difference being that they implemented it beforehand by putting a driver in the seat that is just the right amount slower so things take care of themselves.

If Perez is just that - the right amount slower - then you don't have to worry and the whole "does he comply to the letting-Verstappen-by" is a non-issue since it will solve itself in a natural way just like it does at Mercedes.

If he is not the right amount slower but equally as fast as Verstappen then I see little reason why Perez should move over for Verstappen, or why Red Bull should ask him - especially if he would be in front on points.

[S griffin]

It's interesting to think how Checo would do against Max. For me he would probably be like Bottas is to Hamilton. Good enough to beat him on occasion, just not all time. Not like Ricciardo, who was more like to Verstappen what Rosberg was to Hamilton

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by gert

If Perez has more points than Verstappen AND is in front of him in the next race then I see little reason for him to move out of the way and let Verstappen by (assuming they are on the same race strategy) and frankly I also see little reason for Red Bull to ask or expect him too. I'm not even convinced they would ask him to do that, at that point in the season.

But would he comply if they do ask it of him (if they put all their cards on Verstappen, because they need all the leverage they can get against a superior car)?

If Perez is just that - the right amount slower - then you don't have to worry and the whole "does he comply to the letting-Verstappen-by" is a non-issue since it will solve itself in a natural way just like it does at Mercedes.

If he is not the right amount slower but equally as fast as Verstappen then I see little reason why Perez should move over for Verstappen, or why Red Bull should ask him - especially if he would be in front on points.

Mercedes can afford to settle it like that because they've had sufficient margin to the next team the last 7 seasons.

[gert]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

But would he comply if they do ask it of him (if they put all their cards on Verstappen, because they need all the leverage they can get against a superior car)?

Who knows.

I don't think that the #1 priority for Red Bull to decide who gets the 2nd seat is "Will he move aside for Max".

[gert]

Raikkonen and Giovanizzi staying at Suaber/Alfa for 2021

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/15...nazzi-for-2021

[Taxi645]

Can be deleted

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

But would he comply if they do ask it of him (if they put all their cards on Verstappen, because they need all the leverage they can get against a superior car)?

You know, it could just be covered in a contract. With rewards and penalties.

[Hawkwood]

Confirmed: Russell is staying at Williams for 2021 after all.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/r...paign=widget-1

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by gert

Who knows.

I don't think that the #1 priority for Red Bull to decide who gets the 2nd seat is "Will he move aside for Max".

I didn't say it was their number 1 priority. Possibly it is a serious consideration. Like you say, who knows.

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by peebee2

You know, it could just be covered in a contract. With rewards and penalties.

In the heat of the moment in hectic on track battles, will rewards and penalties help to go against someones nature? Hard to say.


Just saying, I think Nico can be more easily thrusted to play that role, but Perrz has it's own advantages.

[S griffin]

Raikkonen showed at Algarve he still has it, so no real problem with him staying. Giovinazzi hasn’t exactly set the world on fire, but hasn’t done much wrong either, so no problem with him staying too

But I’m really glad Williams have now confirmed Russell is staying. Let’s hope nothing comes up to change that. But let’s also hope Georgie gets a car to match his talent too in good time

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by gert

Raikkonen and Giovanizzi staying at Suaber/Alfa for 2021

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/15...nazzi-for-2021

What an anti-climax.