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Old 27 Apr 2011, 15:26 (Ref:2870678)   #26
bella
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i still don't understand why that's a bad thing and worthy of a tar and feathering. it's only bad if it isn't successful.
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Old 27 Apr 2011, 16:12 (Ref:2870698)   #27
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I don't think there's any pleasing some people on here.

Yes, Caterham was probably bought becase of the Lotus row, incase Team Lotus lost. So? At the end of the day, If team lotus have to change their name after losing their case, they will change it to Caterham. However, if they hadn't of done this then they would probably have changed their name to team AirAsia or 1Malaysia. You would all then moan about the awful name, yet you still moan when a good name like Caterham gets a chance.

Believe me, Tony gets it. Bahr doesn't, and I think TF summed it up brilliantly whilst aiming it at Bahr, 'We just went out and did it – and then announced it. So I would rather do it, and then talk about it.' Fernandes knows what he is doing, he will be good for F1. He is sensible, he has made the right contingency plans thanks to an assult from Group Lotus, he runs a team well and he is a good businessman. He is taking a brand with heritage into the limelight, and that can only be a good thing.

I'm sure if group lotus hadn't of started to push their weight around, Fernandes/Team Lotus wouldn't have bought Caterham. His plans have been changed somewhat, but It is of my belief that he was given no choice but to change things because of Group Lotus.

We should commend Team Lotus for being the better men than Group Lotus, for making the right plans and decisions to tackle the issue in a dignified way, and it could have a great benefit for Caterham and possibly Team Lotus as well.

Well done that Team.
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Old 27 Apr 2011, 16:16 (Ref:2870699)   #28
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They're living in the past by trying to resurrect a name from the past... and now aligning themselves to that name's road cars of the past through the acquisition of Caterham. Lotus themselves sold the rights of the 7 to Caterham almost 40 years ago... and that's pretty much all Caterham have done since.
But Caterham are still making that car today, therefore how can they be living in the past?
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Old 27 Apr 2011, 19:16 (Ref:2870815)   #29
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i still don't understand why that's a bad thing and worthy of a tar and feathering. it's only bad if it isn't successful.
Who's tarring and feathering TF ? I have a lot of respect for the guy and what he has achieved with Air Asia. I just don't understand his obsession over trying to resurrect the Lotus name and what that has to do with enhancing his business portfolio or the success of his F1 team. Dany Bahar, is almost as childish, but at least he could be forgiven for defending the incumbent interests of an auto manufacturer producing Lotus cars.

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But Caterham are still making that car today, therefore how can they be living in the past?
The fact they still, to this day, manufacturing a car to a 60 year old design is precisely why they are living in the past
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Old 27 Apr 2011, 20:12 (Ref:2870858)   #30
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A heavily updated 60 year old design, actually.
The current Caterham 7 has as much in common with the original Lotus 7 as the Ford GT has in common with the original GT40.
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Old 27 Apr 2011, 20:52 (Ref:2870882)   #31
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bella has already said anything I might want to contribute to this debate. Fernandes is very successful and seems to be a people person as well. I predict continued success for him.
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Old 27 Apr 2011, 20:59 (Ref:2870888)   #32
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The fact they still, to this day, manufacturing a car to a 60 year old design is precisely why they are living in the past
The jet airplane was being used 40-50 years ago as well, but the use of these today isn't considered living in the past

Besides, I'm sure the mechanical workings of the Caterham 7 have improved dramatically in 50 years, even though I'm no expert in the car.
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 00:42 (Ref:2870976)   #33
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He'd better hurry though because Bahar is leading Group Lotus into the valley of death.
Just buy it out of Chapter 11
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 00:54 (Ref:2870979)   #34
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bella has already said anything I might want to contribute to this debate. Fernandes is very successful and seems to be a people person as well. I predict continued success for him.

Agree too, just wish he would take his obsession with all things English one step further and buy West Ham...
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 01:28 (Ref:2870984)   #35
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I wonder if you can trademark British Racing Green. In any case, you can't paste Caterham over a single seater. Caterham isn't anything other than, well, a Caterham, or a place in Surrey. It's about as good a fit as a Reliant F1 team. If he's so desperate to name his team something British there's plenty of better alternatives like Cooper or Vanwall. Personally I'm rooting for an LEC revival.
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 02:22 (Ref:2870989)   #36
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Lotus themselves sold the rights of the 7 to Caterham almost 40 years ago... and that's pretty much all Caterham have done since.
And what exactly is wrong with that? The main look of the car might not have changed a great deal, but it's been updated where necessary with more modern components - and most importantly the essence of the car has been preserved.
I fail to see what's wrong with keeping it going! If it's such a old, unwanted thing, how come there are so many clones!
(Disclaimer: I don't own a Caterham, tho would like to if I could afford one as a 1st or 2nd car, but having marshalled numerous sprints, and race days where they've been in action have a fondness for them..)
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 02:25 (Ref:2870990)   #37
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Why don't they also take Morgan and merge it into the Team Lotus MkI (or MkII depending where you sit)
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 02:27 (Ref:2870991)   #38
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But would the FIA allow them to build their chassis out of ash if they were called Morgans? Plus they would have to find a way to make the wing look crosseyed and then go buy some old BMW engines to run.
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 02:47 (Ref:2870993)   #39
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But would the FIA allow them to build their chassis out of ash if they were called Morgans? Plus they would have to find a way to make the wing look crosseyed and then go buy some old BMW engines to run.
Carbon coated ash could be a new technical tweak Adrian Newey has been looking out for to copy..
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 02:56 (Ref:2870994)   #40
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I'm sure I remember Fernandez saying in an interview when the whole Team Lotus vs Group Lotus saga started that when he originally decided to enter F1 with association from Lotus,his intention was at some point in the future for there to be a cross over between Group Lotus and Lotus Racing, and that he wanted a car company like Lotus to add to his portfolio, using the F1 team to build the brand, and end up taking over the car company too.

He then went on to say that he still wanted to keep racing as Lotus in F1, but to fulfil the rest of his ambition, the plan was to either start a rival to Lotus, and include it in the team name, or buy a rival to Lotus, and include that in the team name.

That's just from memory, but with that in mind, I don't see anything sinister about his recent purchase of Caterham Cars.

Team Lotus Caterham or any variant of it, would fit with plans he was talking about publicly at least as far back as Christmas. (I haven't been paying much attention to the whole thing since then, until the Caterham rumour at least)
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 09:34 (Ref:2871085)   #41
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I think its great. I am a huge fan of Caterhams so to me the announcement recently of the SP300R had me all pumped. Now to see a relationship with F1, increased funding for the company and added profile...mixed with TFs ability to run an F1 team with a cool name, some motoring history outside of F1...and the most important thing...adding to the credibility that he is in for the long haul and the investment in the team is genuine.

Well, I am a happy camper...dirty that Proton owned Lotus has done nothing exciting with their car lineup, their new cars whilst a good drive are the same size as an Exige but are 1400kg etc etc means I was losing the Lotus love and did not like how they tried to buy into F1 with Renault rather then support a Malaysian backed team using the racing arm of the company that shares a name.

Anway...happy days and now have a minnow team I am genuinely excited about!
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 16:10 (Ref:2871271)   #42
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It's another mature and smart move from Fernandes. He's living up to the Lotus tradition piece by piece and with good taste.

Unlike that flashy muppet Sahar who thinks he can conquer the world while carving through plenty of Malaysian tax-payers money to do it.
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Old 28 Apr 2011, 16:56 (Ref:2871290)   #43
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"Lotus's original bid application was for a £27.5m loan which would have been put to good use in research and development, crucially allowing Group Lotus to release capital previously allocated to R&D to build the new production plant therefore creating approximately 1200 additional jobs."


At least Team Lotus haven't gone to the British Government asking for our money. He is puttin his money where his mouth is.
Group Lotus had a big ask when clearly, with all the publicity of sponsoring Renault and High Court action did they seriously expect us to pay the bill.
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Old 29 Apr 2011, 09:33 (Ref:2871689)   #44
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Caterham and F1

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McLaren’s Neil Oatley is a source of motorsport minutiae and he has tracked down a most unusual story linked to Caterham, Lotus and Formula 1. Caterham was established to sell the Lotus 7, the manufacturing rights of which were acquired by Caterham founder Graham Nearn. The Caterham Super 7 was a derivative of the original Lotus 7 and that car remains the mainstay of the company to this day. What is not widely known is that a Lotus 7 took part in a Formula 1 race in South Africa in December 1962.
http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2011/...terham-and-f1/
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Old 29 Apr 2011, 09:54 (Ref:2871696)   #45
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Porsche won a race that season too (French GP)! The second place car finished a lap down!

Ironically, Team Lotus could say that they are still now making road cars that have actually already competed in a GP!

Certainly a Caterham 7 is much closer to F1 car DNA than say a Ferrari 599 in that respect.
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