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Old 10 Aug 2022, 21:29 (Ref:4122465)   #101
Alan52
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If they have decided it’s uneconomic for them to run it then I can’t see how it would be an attractive proposition for someone else to come along and sink money into it.
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Old 10 Aug 2022, 21:45 (Ref:4122468)   #102
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Good. I presume they will try to sell it, and that clears the deck for somebody fresh to come in and take over, negotiate with council and residents with none of the BAC baggage, and maybe come up with a DA that allows the circuit to resume at some level.

BAC will take a bath, but they deserve that for all the poor decisions made at WP, starting with buying into something that was already outside its DA, and then inflaming the situation.

They have sunk a fair bit into the circuit, and their income has been slashed - and the longer the stand-off continues the more money they are losing, interest rates are going up, a move like that is no surprise.

If they think that will exert leverage on council they are living in a fools paradise, it is the residents they need to deal with, and the residents will be dancing under the stars at this news.

If it is confirmed?
Its all hearsay atm Ed,

However, I also heard that the 500 BAC members aren't likely to be interested in selling...

Someone fresh? With that legal precedent hanging over the facility?

Marulan is going ahead in leaps and bounds...so it may fill some of the void if WP goes...

The big losers will be the Motorsport community and of course, the Goulburn region...
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Old 10 Aug 2022, 23:56 (Ref:4122476)   #103
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Thanks for the follow-up Mick. Yes, I understand, but something needs to happen, and the circuit is really the only one with flexibility (and pressures) in the short term.

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Old 11 Aug 2022, 02:41 (Ref:4122488)   #104
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Its all hearsay atm Ed,

However, I also heard that the 500 BAC members aren't likely to be interested in selling...
So who is saying that it will be sold if the members aren't in favour? The capital loss would not be a pleasant pill to swallow at all unless someone comes up with a commercial use for it. The more important question might be what the 500 members would do with it instead. It appears that the fat lady has yet to sing.
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Old 11 Aug 2022, 08:24 (Ref:4122501)   #105
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Marulan is going ahead in leaps and bounds
This might be a silly question but as Marulan was originally the Police Driving Training Centre and is now a Race Track is it possibly in the same boat as Wakefield Park
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Old 11 Aug 2022, 08:55 (Ref:4122506)   #106
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This might be a silly question but as Marulan was originally the Police Driving Training Centre and is now a Race Track is it possibly in the same boat as Wakefield Park
That is news to me, but it may have been.

It might be in the same boat, if it is operating outside its DA conditions, which seems unlikely given the recent investment which presumably required a DA.

I have heard they were getting complaints, and I also heard they had bought out one or more neighbouring properties, can't vouch for the accuracy of those stories though.
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Old 11 Aug 2022, 09:26 (Ref:4122507)   #107
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If they have decided it’s uneconomic for them to run it then I can’t see how it would be an attractive proposition for someone else to come along and sink money into it.
I had a quick look at the Goulburn Real Estate market, which seems to "buoyant"...Canberra seems to be red hot.

https://www.realestate.com.au/buy/in...on,+act/list-1

I have heard that Canberrans are opting for a "tree change" and commuting from Glbn to Cbra etc Tirrannaville has a Primary School and is about 10 minutes from the Glbn CBD...so anyone who thinks the Wakefield Park land is "worthless" should maybe think again...

https://www.realestate.com.au/buy/in...sw+2580/list-1
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Old 11 Aug 2022, 09:33 (Ref:4122509)   #108
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This might be a silly question but as Marulan was originally the Police Driving Training Centre and is now a Race Track is it possibly in the same boat as Wakefield Park
Marulan was the MDTC, but don't ever recall Police driver training there, possibly ad hoc? Glbn has the Police Driver Training facility...

Read up on Pheasant Woods development...there is even a possibility of a 12 Km enduro track ("the Nordschleife of the Southern Highlands/Tablelands!")...

https://pheasantwood.com.au/
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Old 11 Aug 2022, 11:12 (Ref:4122522)   #109
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I had a quick look at the Goulburn Real Estate market, which seems to "buoyant"...Canberra seems to be red hot.

https://www.realestate.com.au/buy/in...on,+act/list-1

I have heard that Canberrans are opting for a "tree change" and commuting from Glbn to Cbra etc Tirrannaville has a Primary School and is about 10 minutes from the Glbn CBD...so anyone who thinks the Wakefield Park land is "worthless" should maybe think again...

https://www.realestate.com.au/buy/in...sw+2580/list-1
It is worth more as a working circuit than a block of land whose original commercial use is no longer possible. The market will decide what it is worth if it gets offered so getting all defensive about is is pointless. I reckon it might make a good sheep shearing operation as all the sheds are there. Another opportunity is Tesla buys it and runs track days for owners but they have to use slicks to keep the noise down.
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Old 14 Aug 2022, 23:06 (Ref:4122814)   #110
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A development: https://www.speedcafe.com/2022/08/14...akefield-park/

The article also more or less confirms the shutdown of the circuit at the end of the month.

The 'Special Activation Precinct' looks promising, but the devil would be in the detail. It would not happen overnight either, do the circuit shutdown will not be soon lifted.

It also begs the question of whether the council is behind the support for the circuit, or is it just the mayor and a few councillors, this will only be tested by a vote of some sort.

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Old 15 Aug 2022, 01:05 (Ref:4122818)   #111
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Welcome to Wakefield Park Housing Estate, a lovely rural setting on the outskirts of Goulburn.

We have land now available in Holden Drive, Falcon Close, Porsche View, Datsun Place, Honda Avenue and Nissan Parade.
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Old 15 Aug 2022, 01:42 (Ref:4122822)   #112
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Welcome to Wakefield Park Housing Estate, a lovely rural setting on the outskirts of Goulburn.

We have land now available in Holden Drive, Falcon Close, Porsche View, Datsun Place, Honda Avenue and Nissan Parade.
I hope that is premature, VERY premature ...

Not likely this century. Housing redevelopment would require high density (minimum detached housing), and that land is too far out of town. It is basically featureless plain, and doesn't lend itself to premium small acreage lots either.

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Old 15 Aug 2022, 14:00 (Ref:4122861)   #113
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Call me cynical but it sounds like someone has been doing a lot of political lobbying to give the place some sort of special status to lift the selling price and it almost sounds like BAC have admitted defeat but if they can get a rezoning through then it might be worth more and let the buyer deal with the local issues. I can't see the NSW government getting involved because they have enough problems and the next election is less than 12 months away, Pelican Sheep Station might be interested because the sheds could be useful. It looks like there are going to be a lot of cheap race cars up for sale.
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Old 16 Aug 2022, 04:57 (Ref:4122918)   #114
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Rezoning the area away from rural use to accommodate Wakefield Park seems highly unlikely IMHO.
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Old 16 Aug 2022, 05:36 (Ref:4122919)   #115
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Rezoning the area away from rural use to accommodate Wakefield Park seems highly unlikely IMHO.
Wakefield Park predated the current NSW zoning arrangements, and as an approved activity would be grandfathered into the RU1(?) zone. The activity has not changed, merely the scale/frequency of that activity.

However, it could be rezoned into another category which might be more conducive to higher noise levels than RU1 and its ilk, however this is opening a Pandora's box. In addition, the planners don't like rezoning single/small holdings, and there would currently be no complementary or similar activities in the vicinity of WP to warrant a larger area being rezoned.

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Old 19 Aug 2022, 08:32 (Ref:4123154)   #116
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https://autoaction.com.au/2022/08/19...-september-1st
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Old 19 Aug 2022, 10:37 (Ref:4123164)   #117
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“At this point in time there is no immediate solution to the problems brought on us by the Land and Environmental Court, there is nothing more we can do legally.

Err, excuse me who how come it is all of a sudden a problem brought on by the L&E court? it is about time that BAC stood up and accepted it is they who caused the problems and no one else. all the court did was point out the obvious fact the the operation was violating the regulation in place that defined its operation. Thanks for screwing motor sport in NSW BAC you have done an excellent job.
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Old 19 Aug 2022, 12:13 (Ref:4123181)   #118
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The quote in the story by the BAC official that the closure of the circuit shows “our way of life is under threat on many fronts” would be the most melodramatic piece of rubbish I have ever read.
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Old 19 Aug 2022, 12:31 (Ref:4123184)   #119
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We got ourselves into this mess, now we need somebody to rescue us ...

I wonder what their balance sheet looks like, particularly debt. Mothballing WP will cut their costs somewhat, but with no income there they will be dependent on Winton to keep the bailiffs at bay.
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Old 19 Aug 2022, 15:16 (Ref:4123204)   #120
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We got ourselves into this mess, now we need somebody to rescue us ...

I wonder what their balance sheet looks like, particularly debt. Mothballing WP will cut their costs somewhat, but with no income there they will be dependent on Winton to keep the bailiffs at bay.
I expressed my thoughts on that earlier, it my cause problems for Winton's operation but that is only a guess on anyone's part. if GTB's post is correct then there seems to be a lot of dissension in the ranks of BAC and that means trouble for the management.
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Old 19 Aug 2022, 23:19 (Ref:4123230)   #121
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It's an interesting situation.

WP is a management disaster, but Winton (on the surface at least) seems fairly solid. Did the WP management operate on less oversight? I doubt there is much BAC membership in the vicinity of WP, and that might have been a factor in WP going off the rails where Winton would/might have bottom-up corrective pressures.

It would be interesting to know whether the strictures of the 1993 DA approval were known and appreciated by the BAC Board and membership when the decision to purchase was made. This was the fundamental error, compounded by the subsequent investment.

Talk about building a castle on sand foundations ...

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Old 21 Aug 2022, 03:32 (Ref:4123325)   #122
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I always understood that WP and Winton were under the same corporate structure but that could have changed or my understanding was wrong. It was certainly managed by the same family as Winton and as soon as the Father of that family passed away the sons got shown the door or they chose to leave not long after. My apologies for no names as it has been about 10 years ago and old age has set in.
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Old 21 Aug 2022, 06:02 (Ref:4123328)   #123
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I always understood that WP and Winton were under the same corporate structure but that could have changed ...
Ultimate ownership would appear to rest with BAC (or so I assume), but the ownership of the circuit, and the operating entity were both specific to WP (see the LEC decision). That would be pretty standard I suspect. Probably the same for Winton.

The real question is what is the overall controlling entity, and particularly what level of corporate/financial/governance skills are represented on that entity's management and Board. That is, how much scrutiny and control did they exercise over the ownership and operations WP?

Judging from the mess that is WP today, the answer is 'not enough'.

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Old 21 Aug 2022, 08:19 (Ref:4123333)   #124
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The police used WP for training so it would not be a surprise if they bought it, to build their own would cost a lot more than buying WP. I have no idea if the police have other pursuit training facilities and it is ironic that the police were part of breaking the law so to speak, with their limited use it is most probably possible to stay within the DA regulation for its operation.
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Old 21 Aug 2022, 10:00 (Ref:4123338)   #125
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It was certainly managed by the same family as Winton and as soon as the Father of that family passed away the sons got shown the door or they chose to leave not long after. My apologies for no names as it has been about 10 years ago and old age has set in.
The Ronke family was always linked to Winton, Mick Ronke being in my memory the Patriarch of Winton although his Dad was one of the original guys involved Sadly Mick passed away nearly a decade ago at just 66 and left a bit of a hole.

Not sure of the nuts and bolts but remember his name as Mr Winton from back in the 80's and on.
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