Saving ALMS and Grand-AM

cthib10 · 23 Jul 2009, 18:37 (Ref:2506752)

Check out this article http://lastturnclub.com/index.php?op...=587&Itemid=55

So I was wondering what everyone thinks of this idea? I think it would be very beneficial for both series. In the combined races it will alot of entries for the race as well as bring down costs in both of the series so it really makes everyone happy. Even just having double headers would bring nice bigger crouds and more cost effective as well.

dxk1 · 23 Jul 2009, 19:06 (Ref:2506763)

I've read Kat's article and don't really disagree with it in principle. However, I do doubt that GARRA will want to have their DPs completely blown out of the water at combined events and so will ask for some type of competition equalizing that make it distasteful to ALMS. If these two can agree to run events together (on courses that can handle the number of entries) without any modifications to the competitors speeds, it would certainly be interesting and I think it would sell lots of tickets.

DK

JHamilton · 23 Jul 2009, 19:28 (Ref:2506774)

I don't really see the benefit to either series. I don't think that you would see an increase in attendance. Basically, you would force ALMS fans (the same people that show up to see 15 cars) to watch DPs drone around.

cthib10 · 23 Jul 2009, 19:32 (Ref:2506778)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHamilton

I don't really see the benefit to either series. I don't think that you would see an increase in attendance. Basically, you would force ALMS fans (the same people that show up to see 15 cars) to watch DPs drone around.

Grand-AM has a fanbase as well so it would be very hard for the attendance not to be higher. I agree the DP's aren't the best to look at but with all the passing that would be going on with the extra cars the field the races would be more exciting. I know when I went to the race in St. Pete I would have been very happy to have any extra cars running so thee would have actually been a little bit of action it.

dxk1 · 23 Jul 2009, 19:55 (Ref:2506798)

The biggest thing that Grand-Am has going for it right now is star power. Just off the top of my head, they have Angelelli, Barbosa, Bernard, Bouchut, Dumas, Fogarty, Garcia, Gurney, Henzler, Liddell, Negri, Pruett, Rice, Rojas, Wallace, Werner, and Zonta. Most of these guys are not in ALMS anymore and some of the fans would like to see some of them again. A few combined races could accomplish that. Also, while the DPs are far from beautiful, a nice paint job (come on AIM, you can do better than that) could spruce things up a bit. Also, the DPs are slightly faster than the GT2 so they wouldn't be more of a hindrance that the LMPs already have to deal with.

DK

jhansen · 23 Jul 2009, 20:12 (Ref:2506810)

I don't see how it would increase attendance by any beneficial amount. There's a pretty finite audience when it comes to road racing in america. And there is some cross over in terms of viewership. Maybe a slight jump would be realized, but nothing dramatic IMO. The cost sharing would be the primary benefit. But that would probably get trumped by the perceived failings from the perspective of Grand-AM and ALMS. One series is a better option.

mountainstar · 23 Jul 2009, 20:32 (Ref:2506823)

I don't you could unite the two as they have totally different philosophies about business and the cars.

cmk · 23 Jul 2009, 20:39 (Ref:2506830)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cthib10

Grand-AM has a fanbase as well so it would be very hard for the attendance not to be higher. I agree the DP's aren't the best to look at but with all the passing that would be going on with the extra cars the field the races would be more exciting. I know when I went to the race in St. Pete I would have been very happy to have any extra cars running so thee would have actually been a little bit of action it.

It does have a fanbase, but do they actually show up at the track?! I think that is what the comment was actually getting at. Higher, yes, but the attendance at most GARRA races not bolstered by a bona fide headliner on the same bill would make barely a drop in the bucket at most (though not all) ALMS events.

The issue from sponsor/media perspectives may be somewhat different. Would GARRA force NASCAR sponsors to back ALMS proto teams then?!

TWK · 23 Jul 2009, 21:25 (Ref:2506864)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainstar

I don't you could unite the two as they have totally different philosophies about business and the cars.

The article referenced at the top of this thread does not propose anything that requires "uniting" the two series or either one abandoning its philosophy about either business or cars.

HORNDAWG · 23 Jul 2009, 21:50 (Ref:2506878)

No. I do not think it would be beneficial to either series!

L.P.

ARTRACER1 · 23 Jul 2009, 22:03 (Ref:2506886)

the droning dippies although running nose to tail for most of the race, in a slow speed convoy, only did a little passing. When you consider that ALMS GT2 cars are only a second or so off their pace at most tracks, I really dont see the vast majority of ALMS fans swarming to see this yawner of a series. After 5 years, the cars are as ugly as they ever were. The series has had so much positive input from both fans and designers regarding the look of the cars, that they have no one to blame for themselves. Evry time I look at one, I feel like I am being slapped in the face by a really ugly woman who is trying to convince me that she is Erin Andrews. It's just not true SPORTS CAR racing. A team owner said on TV recently that is was really like NASCAR on a road course (but much slower I think!)
That sums up the mentality for me. It's about as far from the Le Mans idea and ideal of racing as an alumicraft lakeboat running a 12v electric motor is to the Super Cat class in offshore powerboat racing. There just is NO comparison, so why are we trying so hard to compare. ?

TWK · 24 Jul 2009, 00:04 (Ref:2506935)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARTRACER1

There just is NO comparison, so why are we trying so hard to compare. ?

Because there are rumors of talks between the two series; even after denials by ALMS officials.

HORNDAWG · 24 Jul 2009, 00:15 (Ref:2506939)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARTRACER1

There just is NO comparison, so why are we trying so hard to compare. ?

Because some just have to

. Even though the Owner of the series says they are full of it!!!!!

L.P.

trahsub · 24 Jul 2009, 00:59 (Ref:2506943)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARTRACER1

the droning dippies although running nose to tail for most of the race, in a slow speed convoy, only did a little passing. When you consider that ALMS GT2 cars are only a second or so off their pace at most tracks, I really dont see the vast majority of ALMS fans swarming to see this yawner of a series. After 5 years, the cars are as ugly as they ever were. The series has had so much positive input from both fans and designers regarding the look of the cars, that they have no one to blame for themselves. Evry time I look at one, I feel like I am being slapped in the face by a really ugly woman who is trying to convince me that she is Erin Andrews. It's just not true SPORTS CAR racing. A team owner said on TV recently that is was really like NASCAR on a road course (but much slower I think!)
That sums up the mentality for me. It's about as far from the Le Mans idea and ideal of racing as an alumicraft lakeboat running a 12v electric motor is to the Super Cat class in offshore powerboat racing. There just is NO comparison, so why are we trying so hard to compare. ?

I share your sentiments. I have tried hard to appreciate the series, and I try to watch races at Barber Motorsports Park every chance I get since the track looks so beautiful, but these DPs are like the racing equivalent of to how the show 'Cats' is to Broadway.

Subaru_WRX_STi · 24 Jul 2009, 04:54 (Ref:2506971)

can't imagine this, its like hoping for a joint Le Mans Series/FIA GT weekend, impossible to do

Quintin03 · 24 Jul 2009, 08:01 (Ref:2507010)

Great idea but first see what the merger has done to the IRL. And if it is going to be just like the IRL-ChampCar merger it doesn't look good because the "original" series will be merged with the leading "split off" series.

Mal · 24 Jul 2009, 10:03 (Ref:2507057)

Wouldn't more shared weekends and tie ups with IRL make more sense including a race on the road course at IMS? The only problem GA causes for ALMS is the teams it sucks away. It seems clear to me that the majority of fans prefer ALMS if attendances at races is anything to go by.

cthib10 · 24 Jul 2009, 12:35 (Ref:2507126)

Well if the ALMS keeps going down the same path of fielding less than 20 cars I think the series has nowhere to go but down. You will see the attendance fall as well as see the sponsors get out of the series.

Dead-Eye · 24 Jul 2009, 12:54 (Ref:2507139)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mal

Wouldn't more shared weekends and tie ups with IRL make more sense including a race on the road course at IMS?

In May or generally speaking? The first wouldn't be possible as it apparently takes too much time to make the road course usable.

Hugewally · 24 Jul 2009, 14:27 (Ref:2507174)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cthib10

Well if the ALMS keeps going down the same path of fielding less than 20 cars I think the series has nowhere to go but down. You will see the attendance fall as well as see the sponsors get out of the series.

How many races have had less than 20 cars?

cthib10 · 24 Jul 2009, 14:37 (Ref:2507180)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugewally

How many races have had less than 20 cars?

St. Pete 17

Long Beach 21

Utah 18 ALMS cars and 5 challenge cars so the track doesn't look as empty.

Lime Rock 19 ALMS and again 5 challenge cars

I mean if you are giong to add Challenge cars that don't matter to the field why not add the Grand-AM series which also doesn't matter? Either way your filling space for a very low actual car count in the ALMS. The Grand-AM cars would sure bring more of a croud than the Challenge cars..

MrSebring · 24 Jul 2009, 14:46 (Ref:2507185)

I like Kat's idea.

fieldodreams79 · 24 Jul 2009, 15:30 (Ref:2507192)

from article:

Quote:

This is NOT a marriage - this is just “living together” for a couple years to see what happens.

i've done both and it is basically the same thing.....
silly this idea....would only highlight the strengths and weaknesses of both series until it ends up in divorce or someone moving out.

reality is that these (and all other series) or suffering....let's not make beds with each other just yet.

cthib10 · 24 Jul 2009, 17:14 (Ref:2507257)

Quote:

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

from article:
i've done both and it is basically the same thing.....
silly this idea....would only highlight the strengths and weaknesses of both series until it ends up in divorce or someone moving out.

reality is that these (and all other series) or suffering....let's not make beds with each other just yet.

I think that is the point though.. The series are supposed to be able to split it doesn't have to be a permanent thing but for right now in this economy the extra car count and sponsors would be a good thing and in a couple years if things improve then the joint events don't have to happen anymore both series win.

Bob Riebe · 24 Jul 2009, 18:08 (Ref:2507279)

Quote:

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

from article:
i've done both and it is basically the same thing.....
silly this idea....would only highlight the strengths and weaknesses of both series until it ends up in divorce or someone moving out.

reality is that these (and all other series) or suffering....let's not make beds with each other just yet.

When the IMSA and SCCA used to be able to exchange cars between series it did not do any harm to either series.

View Poll Results: Do you think ALMS/Grand-AM shared weekends would be a good idea?
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No	30	69.77%
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