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Old 10 Jun 2022, 12:49 (Ref:4113945)   #1
Ferrari333SP
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Chef GT3: ACO style

I simply don't get these new GT3 rules for 2024 - what is their reasoning for not simply just using the GT3 cars as is? Wouldn't that actually be the cheapest way forward?

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...lass-for-2024/
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 13:01 (Ref:4113950)   #2
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Originally Posted by Ferrari333SP View Post
I simply don't get these new GT3 rules for 2024 - what is their reasoning for not simply just using the GT3 cars as is? Wouldn't that actually be the cheapest way forward?

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...lass-for-2024/
Because ACO?? That's all I can think of, but yeah why make the teams have to source new unique aero only body kits? Unless the ACO is making them in house and more money coming in

Plus who is going to take the hit to develop them at the 50-100k euro price cap. Just gonna guess that will barely cover the manufacturing costs never mind recoup testing and development

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Old 10 Jun 2022, 13:05 (Ref:4113953)   #3
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it reminds me the GT3+ ratel planned to introduce in late 2011 to replace GT1...
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 13:08 (Ref:4113954)   #4
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it reminds me the GT3+ ratel planned to introduce in late 2011 to replace GT1...
GT3+ exterior only, GT3+ wanted engine and other upgrades too. This is just bodywork for aero tuning it seems
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 13:31 (Ref:4113960)   #5
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This makes no sense. Most importantly, there won't be a Pro category anymore or at least I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere. So the ACO and FIA want manufacturers wanting to race to build a hypercar. But since not all of them are interest in prototype racing, after 2022 they can either go to IMSA or stop racing at all. Great


About the GT3 "Premium" thing, I guess they're aiming at gentlemen drivers who want to race in "cooler" looking GT3 cars.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 13:56 (Ref:4113975)   #6
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And Porsche has already publicly asked why?

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...eally-need-it/
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 13:57 (Ref:4113976)   #7
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This makes no sense. Most importantly, there won't be a Pro category anymore or at least I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere. So the ACO and FIA want manufacturers wanting to race to build a hypercar. But since not all of them are interest in prototype racing, after 2022 they can either go to IMSA or stop racing at all. Great


About the GT3 "Premium" thing, I guess they're aiming at gentlemen drivers who want to race in "cooler" looking GT3 cars.

As DTM was asking for more powerful GT3 equipped with a different clutch system to let GT3 having standing start without burning clutch, the gt3 manufacturers answer was a big middle finger. I'm wondering if ACO actually asked manufacturers opinion about this...
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 14:01 (Ref:4113980)   #8
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As DTM was asking for more powerful GT3 equipped with a different clutch system to let GT3 having standing start without burning clutch, the gt3 manufacturers answer was a big middle finger. I'm wondering if ACO actually asked manufacturers opinion about this...
It appears again the answer is no, no they did not
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 15:13 (Ref:4114016)   #9
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This makes no sense. Most importantly, there won't be a Pro category anymore or at least I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere. So the ACO and FIA want manufacturers wanting to race to build a hypercar. But since not all of them are interest in prototype racing, after 2022 they can either go to IMSA or stop racing at all. Great


About the GT3 "Premium" thing, I guess they're aiming at gentlemen drivers who want to race in "cooler" looking GT3 cars.
They have dropped the idea of requiring a Hypercar entry to be eligible for a GT entry.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 17:46 (Ref:4114058)   #10
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GT3 yes, but GT3 premium doesn't make sense. Not for manufacturers, not for teams, not for spectactors, not for WEC/LM24.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 17:59 (Ref:4114065)   #11
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Yep, it's nonsense and solves one problem by creating another. We have GT3s racing in the Road to Le Mans races and they seem just fine to me.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 18:19 (Ref:4114069)   #12
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"The objective is that we’re totally devoted to lower the costs."
and
"According to FIA Endurance Commission President Richard Mille, the kit, which is targeted to provide a “special look” to each GT3 model"
These two just contradict. If you want to lower the costs, why force teams to spend cash on something that is totally not necessary? Each GT3 car has its unique looks anyway, you can't mistake a Lambo GT3 for a Mercedes GT3.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 18:34 (Ref:4114073)   #13
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Yep, it's nonsense and solves one problem by creating another. We have GT3s racing in the Road to Le Mans races and they seem just fine to me.

In my opinion it doesn't solve problems


1) to me a pro-am only class doesn't make any sense in a "supposed" FIA world championship... is it so bad for ACO to possibily have abt, htp, grasser, schubert with pro lineups?
2) evidently aco ignores that gt3 manufacturers follow an already scheduled production and for them will be quite complicated and unecessarily wasteful to produce limited and bespoke parts for only the few teams involved in WEC



as happened for DTM GT3+, I think that this silly idea of GT3premium will last just a couple of months. Not to mention that bespoke parts = more expensive cars for teams = more expensive seats for am drivers which would be a no sense for a pro-am focused class.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 19:39 (Ref:4114083)   #14
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'We want to lower costs so let's introduce something that will increase costs.'
Genius!
Just gives us a pro class you morons, I don't want to lose the Corvettes.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 19:52 (Ref:4114086)   #15
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If it's alright with everybody, I'm just going to put in here what I did in the thread in the general section.

There is no practical justification for this change. It's a token gesture at considerable expense just so the ACO can say the cars are running to their rules.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 20:08 (Ref:4114093)   #16
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'We want to lower costs so let's introduce something that will increase costs.'
Genius!
Just gives us a pro class you morons, I don't want to lose the Corvettes.
I think you'll finally see some Vettes on the market now with the full GT3 car. Think they see the market and know the pricing from the rest, and can only support teams not run them this time around. And I could see them selling everyone a LM aero kit with their Vette to spread the costs across all the cars sold
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 20:15 (Ref:4114095)   #17
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'We want to lower costs so let's introduce something that will increase costs.'
Genius!
Just gives us a pro class you morons, I don't want to lose the Corvettes.
It’s more cost. Not disputing. And probably no point.

But this is a relatively small cost and from what we’ve seen is not a barrier. We have GTE-Am with approximately 600 cars enter this year. People, Bronze people, are so up for racing these kind of cars at Le Mans. The market it there. I don’t think that the ACO are risking anything with this add on.
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 20:29 (Ref:4114098)   #18
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It’s more cost. Not disputing. And probably no point.

But this is a relatively small cost and from what we’ve seen is not a barrier. We have GTE-Am with approximately 600 cars enter this year. People, Bronze people, are so up for racing these kind of cars at Le Mans. The market it there. I don’t think that the ACO are risking anything with this add on.
And how many of the drivers who own/fund the cars own GTE and GT3 versions, or Ferraris and Astons are out there ready to be converted? I'm sure the Ferrari would be pointless as the new car will come online and Aston may not make a kit but Dalla Lana likes an Aston and could find some money if he wanted to.

New (tin foil hat brigade) thought, the ACO knows who is willing to build a kit and the numbers are low. Thus allowing more Hypercar/GTP and LMP2 entries without having everyone cry why not more GT cars. If there are no cars then no one can enter

Of the current GT3 cars who would?

Porsche has already questioned why needed but would if someone funds it
Ferrari has a new car so maybe roll that in to development of it and charge everyone for it
Corvette loves LM and they COULD sell some but the age old, will Vette sell cars
Aston Martin has a GT3 that's around refresh time I think so could build it and has fans who run at LM

Lamborghini has teams who might consider it and could possibly adapt the GT2 body to save costs
Audi seems to be lost in the wilderness and I've seen rumors of the R8 death without replacement so....
MB well LM and MB, and AMG GT is being retired but new car all but assured
McLaren is interesting and again teams who might be interested in funding it
BMW has a new car and a decent following but with the GTP car would they?
Glickenhaus could in theory build one and may have customers who could fund it

Others out there seem to be longer in the tooth and on the way out without replacement
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Old 10 Jun 2022, 20:35 (Ref:4114101)   #19
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As true as that might be, I think the ACO will come around under pressure from the manufacturers, Porsche is a heavy hitter after all. It'll be interesting to hear from Ferrari, Mercedes AMG and Lamborghini as well (I left Audi out on purpose as it looks like their Customer Sport division might be dwindling down soon).



And besides, both objectives can be reached as a common goal: newer models will be made looking more 'premium' when they get introduced so no need for special kits.
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Old 11 Jun 2022, 03:48 (Ref:4114129)   #20
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This is just a stupid decision.
Reason?ACO wants a unique class so it theoretically can exercise a big amount of control and just so they can say it is unique to WEC.
Makes zero sense.Can you imagine a Pro GT3 class at Le Mans and how fantastic that would be.If you look at the 2017 GT Pro race it was in my opinion the best GT race of all time anywhere.From memory after about 14 hours all cars but one were within around 3 minutes of the lead and of course there was that blockbuster finish.
If the ACO thinks manufacturers will make a special WEC kit particularly if the class is only Am they are deluded.
They cannot force manufacturers with no interest in prototype racing to invest in that simply by not having a Pro class.
Would be interested to know the viewpoint of GT3 promoters like Ratel.
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Old 11 Jun 2022, 08:01 (Ref:4114149)   #21
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This is just a stupid decision.
Reason?ACO wants a unique class so it theoretically can exercise a big amount of control and just so they can say it is unique to WEC.
Makes zero sense.Can you imagine a Pro GT3 class at Le Mans and how fantastic that would be.If you look at the 2017 GT Pro race it was in my opinion the best GT race of all time anywhere.From memory after about 14 hours all cars but one were within around 3 minutes of the lead and of course there was that blockbuster finish.
If the ACO thinks manufacturers will make a special WEC kit particularly if the class is only Am they are deluded.
They cannot force manufacturers with no interest in prototype racing to invest in that simply by not having a Pro class.
Would be interested to know the viewpoint of GT3 promoters like Ratel.

The single pro-am class I guess it's born as consequence of porsche and ferrari stepping up in hypercar class, leaving basically none in full season gt-pro. I would however kept a pro class because there are tons of gt3 teams that could be interested in a WEC gt-pro program (audi abt, many mercedes and bmw teams, a backed manthey porsche program, redbull/AF ferraris, grasser or emil frey lambo etc...). The gt3 premium is just stupid, ACO clearly ignores how gt3 market works... I'm sure this madness will last less than 2 months.
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Old 11 Jun 2022, 11:15 (Ref:4114180)   #22
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'ACO president Pierre Fillon explained that there is a desire to create what he dubbed “a premium kit” that would have a negligible effect on performance.'

Ok, buddy.

https://www.motorsport.com/wec/news/...bach/10320145/
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Old 11 Jun 2022, 11:26 (Ref:4114181)   #23
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I can see logic in what they are doing, would make it much more simpler by having a more universal GT class

Great article btw
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Old 11 Jun 2022, 11:34 (Ref:4114182)   #24
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bespoke silhouette body parts for already homologated GT3 road chassis based cars... why don't mandate also neon lights under the floor to be even more distinctive?
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Old 11 Jun 2022, 11:39 (Ref:4114183)   #25
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bespoke silhouette body parts for already homologated GT3 road chassis based cars... why don't mandate also neon lights under the floor to be even more distinctive?
Don't give them ideas
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