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Old 3 Oct 2023, 09:23 (Ref:4179387)   #1
knighty
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knighty should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridknighty should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
gear oil issues

I'm circuit racing a 200bhp mk7 fiesta turbo, the box is fitted with a quaife diff and professionally built, but it appears the boxes are getting uber hot and really burning up the oil, after 1 or 2 race meetings the oil stinks of sulphur.

We are using good grade 75W140 oils......but they still take a beating.

Are there any better gear oils out there that can handle the high temperatures?........or it it time for a gear box oil cooler to be fitted?

I'm not a layman so I dont need an explanation of why the oil stinks, I know why!.........am just after some improved oil recommendation's
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Old 3 Oct 2023, 10:39 (Ref:4179393)   #2
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Tel 911S should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridTel 911S should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by knighty View Post
I'm circuit racing a 200bhp mk7 fiesta turbo, the box is fitted with a quaife diff and professionally built, but it appears the boxes are getting uber hot and really burning up the oil, after 1 or 2 race meetings the oil stinks of sulphur.

We are using good grade 75W140 oils......but they still take a beating.

Are there any better gear oils out there that can handle the high temperatures?........or it it time for a gear box oil cooler to be fitted?

I'm not a layman so I dont need an explanation of why the oil stinks, I know why!.........am just after some improved oil recommendation's
Always used this oil in box for competitions
.https://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-832-sil...-gear-oil.aspx
Bit expensive for road use , but worth it under very hard use
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Old 3 Oct 2023, 10:41 (Ref:4179394)   #3
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GreenMachine should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridGreenMachine should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Following with interest.

I am about to take delivery of my c200rwkw MX5 MSM after a full engine rebuild and turbo upgrade, and this subject has relevance to me, as the boxes are the next weak link.

Are you datalogging the oil temps? It would help to know the temperature you expect the oil to work at, as you can then take that to the oil manufacturers who may have one that will work at that temp.

It doesn't matter what 'good' oils you are using, if you are pushing them over their max operating temperature they won't be good for very long. I would have put a cooler on by now, I presume you have something that has stood in the way of that.
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Old 3 Oct 2023, 10:48 (Ref:4179395)   #4
Tel 911S
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Always used this oil in box for competitions
.https://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-832-sil...-gear-oil.aspx
Bit expensive for road use , but worth it under very hard use
Just remembering , the name might have changed to FUCHS TITAN SRG 75
due to rebranding a few years ago .
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Old 3 Oct 2023, 10:51 (Ref:4179396)   #5
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Have you spoken to Quaife about the problem?
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Old 3 Oct 2023, 10:54 (Ref:4179397)   #6
Tel 911S
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Just remembering , the name might have changed to FUCHS TITAN SRG 75
due to rebranding a few years ago .
Link with new name . But both names still seem to be around .https://aamraceengines.co.uk/fuchs-t...cing-gear-oil/
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Old 3 Oct 2023, 15:07 (Ref:4179466)   #7
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Have you spoken to Quaife about the problem?
+ 1. I think a good rad/pump is mandatory. Racing a Miata too, we drain the gearbox and dif' every meeting, engine every two meetings (including the damn oil filter!). A meeting here is 2/4 times 25 minutes FP, 30 minutes qualy and 2 or 3 races of 35 minutes.
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Old 3 Oct 2023, 21:59 (Ref:4179528)   #8
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GreenMachine should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridGreenMachine should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Link with new name . But both names still seem to be around .https://aamraceengines.co.uk/fuchs-t...cing-gear-oil/
They want my email for the tech specs of that oil, so I said no. Anyone know what the max operating temp for that oil is?

Quaife may have an answer, but if the OP doesn't know what temps he is running that is of limited value. Gerald's MO will be my starting point, fortunately I have just declared my hoist operational, making such chores so much simpler, and therefore more likely to actually get done!
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Old 4 Oct 2023, 09:07 (Ref:4179575)   #9
Tel 911S
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They want my email for the tech specs of that oil, so I said no. Anyone know what the max operating temp for that oil is?

Quaife may have an answer, but if the OP doesn't know what temps he is running that is of limited value. Gerald's MO will be my starting point, fortunately I have just declared my hoist operational, making such chores so much simpler, and therefore more likely to actually get done!
It was a long time ago that I was running it , so I can,t remember details . But a Diahatsu GTTI on International rallies .Could turn boost up for over 200 BHP [ even in Gp N ] .
Was advised by the works team that the only oil to run in the gearbox was the SRG75 . Did about 10 Internationals over 3 or 4 years with no box problems .
Most of those rallies would be about 180 miles competitive and about the same mileage road use .
The car would usually be on the go most of the day , with not a lot of time to cool down , so it did seem ok for standing up to the heat .
A couple of the rallies were Spain and Portugal , so not cool weather either .
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Old 5 Oct 2023, 12:59 (Ref:4179785)   #10
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From expérience (mainly 911 classic) we tried to keep our gearbow oil below 125° and engine at circa 105°. As stated by GreenMachine abve you need to know what is the max temp you reach and for how long together with the average one too.

I think you can find help from real specialists like TotalEnergies or better Red Line directly or through the UK distributor. And if its obvious that viscosity if of importance, going too high doesn't help. In my Capri, I went to W250 for the rear axle with LSD, and the result was not good. In spite of running permanently above 150° C.

You could find help here: https://www.scimed.co.uk/conostan-oi...SAAEgKXxPD_BwE

Last edited by Gerard C; 5 Oct 2023 at 13:05.
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Old 5 Oct 2023, 13:04 (Ref:4179787)   #11
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Or here: https://www.oilsampling.co.uk/engine-oil-analysis After the wreckage of several gearboxes in endurance, we found a lab' in Belgium to analyse our oil. We then changed from M***l to C*****l for good reasons. Bearing in mind that sometimes oil formulation are subject to change due to environemental concern. Was the case for at least one reference for Va******ne engine oil. A new reference appeared in the catalogue, racing use or closed roads only.
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Old 5 Oct 2023, 15:00 (Ref:4179815)   #12
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Should go back to the original question sometimes… The dif' is in the same case as the pinions and so on, yes? Dog box or synchs? Which type of Quaife: typical or plates? Rival Motorsport website: "We use Royal Purple 75W90 Max Gear in our track car, purely because it is one of the best gearbox oils you can use on the market. Under stress and heat it out performs the rest." Users: https://www.fiestastforum.com/thread...you-run.29551/ Obvious: https://www.millersoils.fr/en/shop/m...nsmission-oil/
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Old 10 Oct 2023, 06:18 (Ref:4180814)   #13
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Hi folks - many thanks for the replies, there seems a common theme to try the Fuchs SRG75 or Syn5 75W90, so I will give that a bash.

The Box is a standard Mk7 Fiesta ST180 with a quaife diff and a 4.3 final drive ratio, all professionally built and blue-printed by a well respected gearbox builder, all the gears and synchros are standard ford.

Last edited by knighty; 10 Oct 2023 at 06:46.
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Old 26 Oct 2023, 17:40 (Ref:4183110)   #14
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For what it's worth I used ZX1 in the engine/ gearbox and LSDs in every race that I entered from the early 90s until 2013 and never had one mechanical failure due to lubrication problems. Before that I had quite a few issues that put me out of races.
At places like Spa where I was pulling 10k a lot of the time meant that it was always working hard, and with about 300 class and race wins it must mean something.

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