2/10/05 - Mallory Park - Over-driving?

SZRacer · 3 Oct 2005, 07:38 (Ref:1422505)

Whew! Well, was pleased that I 'survived' the racing yesterday. Some great racing, and close tussles. Was pleased to finish in the top 50% in my race, even if there were eight retirements!

But....there were also some seriously dented cars. I counted at least 15 with serious bodywork damage, including 1 Fiat Abarth that barrel rolled several times, an A35 with no rear (thanks to being tail-ended), a Lotus with no nose, seriously caved-in Alfa Giulia Super and Ford Capri, smashed-up Austin-Healey.

I have to say a significant proportion of these accidents were self-inflicted, even if some of them were due to oil on the track etc., while a few were due to 'cutting things a bit too fine' in corners.

Guess it was that 'end of season' syndrome - i.e. 'let's just go for it, we've got the whole winter to rebuild it'??

On another note entirely, was nice to meet Peter Mallett, and put a face to a name!

Regards,

James W

Ian Sowman · 3 Oct 2005, 07:48 (Ref:1422512)

Yes, it did seem to be "well, I've got all winter to fix it, what the heck" type day. A great shame because the knock-on effect of various incidents and mechanical woes was a poor grid for the Sebring Salute race.

A couple more observations:

- Some short sprint races mixed in with the mini-enduros would be a more attractive package I think.

- A few drivers could perhaps have done more to maintain the train behind the safety car in one or two of the races - there should not be big gaps, and besides anything else this can spoil the race once restarted!

Al Weyman · 3 Oct 2005, 08:24 (Ref:1422527)

Oh dear I don't like to hear that at all, I thought this sort of driving was frowned on in the Top Hat, what went wrong?

paddy · 3 Oct 2005, 08:41 (Ref:1422548)

The Healey went off coming out of Gerards in qualifying. Looked like driver error and the car was badly damaged. The Fiat rolled at Gerards as well although I wonder whether it might have lost a wheel, I couldn't see clearly. All in all great meeting for sights and sounds, particularly the Mk 1 Escort in the 70's saloon race and some good battles. The only criticism I would have is that pitstops break up dices and often make the race hard to follow.

SZRacer · 3 Oct 2005, 09:41 (Ref:1422595)

Well, Al, as I said, I think a lot of the damage was self-inflicted rather than through over-agressive driving. mallory is a circuit that encourages this, I think, as there are only two useful places for overtaking, so one tends to put the pressure on oneself to go round ever quicker, particularly at Gerrards!

James W

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

Oh dear I don't like to hear that at all, I thought this sort of driving was frowned on in the Top Hat, what went wrong?

zefarelly · 3 Oct 2005, 09:45 (Ref:1422600)

if it turned into a banger race I'm quite glad I didn't go !

still finding out if I'm elligible fot the Walter Hayes meeting next Month at Solverstone

PaulSands · 3 Oct 2005, 10:13 (Ref:1422614)

I was wondering if there was going to be a post about this..I think there were some "words" being exchanged in the pits during the "Groovy Baby" race

Al Weyman · 3 Oct 2005, 11:14 (Ref:1422657)

Sorry ZF from the title of the thread I misread or more accurately misinterpretated 'over' as over agressive, my mistake.

Maybe you are right Zaf, I mean we all want to race but these things cost money and some are irreplaceable. I am not a lover of Mallory as I have seen some nasty moments there. Overtaking opportunities or the lack of should not effect the qualifying session though.

zefarelly · 3 Oct 2005, 11:19 (Ref:1422666)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaulSands

I was wondering if there was going to be a post about this..I think there were some "words" being exchanged in the pits during the "Groovy Baby" race

something along the lines of ' that was like totally not cosmic driving man '

PaulSands · 3 Oct 2005, 11:35 (Ref:1422690)

PaulSands · 3 Oct 2005, 11:37 (Ref:1422693)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

Overtaking opportunities or the lack of ....

I thought the whole short lap was one big overtaking opportunity...I cant think of one spot on the track I havent seen people passing

Gerry Taylor · 3 Oct 2005, 11:47 (Ref:1422701)

OK so I'm an old racer from the seventies. But, having been watching this sort of thing for some time now, makes me wonder how we ever survived back when I was behind the wheel? I suppose a certain driving discipline, and I would maybe suggest stronger adherance to the rules by the stewards/judges, et al. Once at Silverstone I was shunted in the side by another driver, someone saw it, made a decision and he was black flagged! End of his day. The racing was just as good, just as fast and just as exciting in those days. I honestly cannot remember EVER Gerry Marshall, Mick Hill, Tony Strawson, me or any of us doing this sort of thing. We played it fair and square. I'm not saying that accidents didn't happen, they did, and they happened to me too, but when the Clerk 0f the Course gave us our brief, we understood just too well what would happen, if we brought stock car racing to the circuit. We would be off! Maybe, they will learn before they have That Big One! Comments please? GERRY TAYLOR SWISH TEAM ANGLIA.

zefarelly · 3 Oct 2005, 11:48 (Ref:1422703)

I've only been to Mallory testing, and it looks like you can have a go pretty much anywhere, but judging by the reports not everywhere is a sensible place to try !!!

Alan · 3 Oct 2005, 12:14 (Ref:1422728)

Quote:

Originally Posted by paddy

The Fiat rolled at Gerards as well although I wonder whether it might have lost a wheel, I couldn't see clearly.

The Fiat lost control early entering Gerrards and certainly lost a wheel as it rolled. What surprised me was how far it went, finally coming to rest partly on the tyre wall.
Overall I thought it was a very good competitive meeting and I didn't see too much wrong from where I was watching.

Fay · 3 Oct 2005, 12:19 (Ref:1422733)

Alan and I were marshalling at the Hairpin. So yes, it was silly me standing in the track trying to get some of you to slow down behind the pace car and not get tangled up with the wreckage at the elbow. Talking of which it is some time since we had a big hit at the elbow like that.

The poor A35 was innocent and was hit up the rear end by another car which had lost his breaks. At least both drivers didn't get out and start having an argument, as some drivers are known to do!!

One point for a certain driver, I will not mention who, if you have a problem with the car then if you try and accelerate hard out of the hairpin you are going to spin and get hit by yet another innocent car!

All in all there was some very good racing and I think the majority of accidents were caused by genuine mistakes. As stated above a few short races would have made the day.

Hopefully I will see some of you at the HSCC meeting on 15th October.

Alan · 3 Oct 2005, 12:28 (Ref:1422739)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fay

Alan and I were marshalling at the Hairpin.

I must point out, a different Alan which is why I was at Gerrards.

MGDavid · 3 Oct 2005, 13:20 (Ref:1422801)

Zef, you'll be pleased to know it's still possible to take part and stay out of trouble - I popped my Top Hat cherry yesterday sharing the FIA Anglia with a very kind owner. We were just about slowest of the pack, yet with discipline and use of mirrors managed to enjoy ourselves without duly inconveniencing too many others I hope. Fay may disagree as I backed off a bit too much under yellows and caused another car to overtake me at the hairpin - sorry. A great day all round for us, and thanks to all the marshals.

Dave Brand · 3 Oct 2005, 13:23 (Ref:1422807)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fay

Talking of which it is some time since we had a big hit at the elbow like that.

.....and I wanted a quiet day!

Quote:

One point for a certain driver, I will not mention who, if you have a problem with the car then if you try and accelerate hard out of the hairpin you are going to spin and get hit by yet another innocent car!

Any relation to the driver who was coming out of the hairpin sideways under waved yellows?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan

I must point out, a different Alan which is why I was at Gerrards.

No, definitely the same Alan!

Al Weyman · 3 Oct 2005, 14:20 (Ref:1422868)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaulSands

I thought the whole short lap was one big overtaking opportunity...I cant think of one spot on the track I havent seen people passing

Paul I was basically quoting ZF's comments, I must admit I never thought of the track quite like that myself.

Quote:

I think, as there are only two useful places for overtaking, so one tends to put the pressure on oneself to go round ever quicker, particularly at Gerrards!

SZRacer · 3 Oct 2005, 15:02 (Ref:1422906)

Oops!

Never meant to open a can of worms!

Just my response after watching (and taking part in) the races yesterday.

I think in general it was a good meeting with some superb races. Many drivers coped with the close racing and even oil in a controlled way, as they should. there just seemed to be a higher than usual casualty rate.

Should say that, onm the flip-side since I'm (somewhat indirectly) linked to Top Hat, I try to stay on the right side of Julius!! :-)

My inference was not that people were driving carelessly with regard to others, merely with regards to themselves!! Still, it's their bodywork. Or perhaps i'm just soft.

Yes, there is a lot of Mallory it's possible to overtake on, IN THEORY. In practice, perhaps not, at least with my meagre driving standards...

Talking of which I did spin once at the hairpin...

It wasn't me you were referring to, was it?

James W

**Peter Mallett** · 3 Oct 2005, 18:42 (Ref:1423078)

I'd like to clarify a few of the points raised here, which actually come on the back of a comment I made in connection with standards in the Spa 2005 thread:

Firstly there were a lot of cars in a damaged condition but the list wasn't as bad as we might think: The Healey spun out after Gerrards and slid into the tyre wall. Definitely driver error. The Fiat rolled and thus was either driver error or mechanical failure. The 70's saloons was a bit fraught but three retirements, that of the Pepper Mustang, the Imp and that of mine were mechanical, in Pepper's case it looked like he blew his radiator (avoidable?) in my case we think the main shaft in the gearbox failed (unsurprising considering the hammering my gearbox took due to clutch problems).

The carnage at Devil's Elbow was IMO avoidable. It appears that the Alfa was being lapped and the RS 2000 didn't take the advice given in the briefing - "the slower driver keeps to his line whilst the faster driver goes past as he can". It seems that the Escort nudged the Alfa into a spin which in turn collected Daffin's Capri. The latter two received the most damage.

As to driving standards in general, I thought it was ok if not exceptional.

Personally I was involved in a great tussle with Daffin for a while and when I finally got past him into the hairpin (very greasy) and inside the Escort, I stayed ahead of the Escort but Daffin came down the inside and then got baulked through Gerrards by a car we were lapping (again it was up to us to find a way round). That assisted me and I passed him into the Esses for the last time.

However the point is that we had to give each other space and we did.

My race was great after a good start, but passed by those who got a better one, I was around 14th into the first corner, back to 11th after two laps then it was a long dice with Daffin but finally I got up to 7th when I lost my gears. Most scary part of the race was being behind Pepper when his radiator blew. (This was the guy who bent my front wing at Donington in May when I was waving him past).

Good to meet James (SZ racer) and a few of the marshals.

zefarelly · 3 Oct 2005, 21:20 (Ref:1423191)

that sounds like a well reasoned explanation Peter.

broken mainshaft eh . . .you'd never catch me doing that

**Woolley** · 3 Oct 2005, 23:17 (Ref:1423265)

There was also some stuning driving by the Mustang, the Cortina and the Mini. Shame about the pit stops breaking it up. Not only were they racing hard, but the back markers did an excellent job of staying out of the way as far as possible, and were clearly taking notice of the blues. Proabaly the best dice of the season.

MGDavid · 4 Oct 2005, 09:24 (Ref:1423499)

>>>>the back markers did an excellent job of staying out of the way as far as possible, and were clearly taking notice of the blues.
==== blues are for those who don't use their mirrors sufficiently - biut I'll be the first to admit they are a useful backup :-)

Fannymagnette · 4 Oct 2005, 12:04 (Ref:1423612)

Agreed on the back markers. I was one of them in the Blue Magnette and managed to have fantastic races with the middle of the field as well as getting out of the way of the faster cars. Must say that all the cars I was chasing also stayed well clear and were well aware of the faster cars. I just wished I could have snuck in behind the overtaking cars to pass my competition. All in all a great end to the season.

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