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Old 23 Feb 2004, 00:36 (Ref:882304)   #51
Kirk
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Kirk has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
I must conclude that Ralf's sudden found assertiveness has an underlying theme. IE... he has either signed with Toyota for 2005 or has an agreement to do so. Otherwise someone should tell Ralf, preferably Weber, that F1 (and ones presence therein) can be very fleeting.
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 01:16 (Ref:882323)   #52
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Do not forget that BMW wants him there. They love the guy and that is a fact. Weber plays hardball with Frank and at the end he will win. Maybe he will go a little bit lower, but I am sure that in 2006 Ralf will be the second highest paid driver after his brother. Assuming that Michael does not retire :-).

BMW like Ralf, but by NO MEANS do they love him.

Quote from Mario Theissen regarding Ralf's possible move in 2005:

"As far as preference of nationality is concerned, we just want the best possible drivers available to us. If one of them happens to be a German, then that is a bonus. (F1Racing Feb 2004)"

I think you'll see Webber Williams bound in 2004, especially if Jag are happy with Klien this year.

Button might be harder to buy out - as BAR Honda's demands will be much higher than those demanded by Jag for Webber. But Frank and Patrick still (privately) kick themselves everyday that they let Button go.

Pizzonia - has a great chance, but has a tendancy to be bullet quick only when the grandstands are empty.

Ralf - will go to Toyota on whatever price he wants, IMHO.
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 08:47 (Ref:882529)   #53
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He's just trying to strengthen his bargaining position. But to be honest he doesn't really HAVE a bargaining position.

Interesting point Kirk! I can't help but suspect something.
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 09:48 (Ref:882586)   #54
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Redblurr should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Ralf is good, just needs to work on consistency
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 09:53 (Ref:882590)   #55
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i find it stupid to put yourself it that situation, i dont think anyone in F1 would pay him thaqt kind of money, not even Toyota.

I think he's getting envious of brothers wealth.
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 10:36 (Ref:882637)   #56
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Sounds like FW may be pushing him towards the door hoping we will jump ship.... take a look at www.f1live.com/en today.

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Old 23 Feb 2004, 13:31 (Ref:882769)   #57
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I wonder how much of this is Ralf talking and how much is Weber... with Michael's driving career coming towards it's end now and noone comparable of German origin on the horizon getting Ralf tied into a big money contract would be a big priority. Shame, because Frank doesn't do those all to often - especially when he's not gotten the sort of return to justify Ralf's current contract, let alone an improved one.

Either way, it's gross overestimation from the Schumacher camp. When push comes to shove, Mercedes seem to be happy to challenge for titles with non-German drivers than simply stick with Germans who won't win it, and you'd have to say BMW would probably be the same (especially when car sales for both in German aren't exactly poor.

Likewise, I'm sure Williams could get both Button and Webber into the team for the same amount as Ralf wants with change to spare and a good chance of the pair of them getting better results, too - not to mention blooding some of their youngsters by farming them out to teams in the inevitable lower order reshuffle.
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 13:54 (Ref:882806)   #58
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Super Tourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSuper Tourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSuper Tourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSuper Tourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
William's are in a great position. The season is but a few weeks away, hence they can't be bothered to talk money with Ralf and Weber any longer.

If the car is very strong and dominant, then Ralf will look a fool trying to price himself out of a deal, and plenty of drivers will throw their hat into the ring.

John Watson (IIRC) tried a similar negotiating ploy with Ron Dennis at the end of 1983, no doubt suitably aggrieved at the deal Niki Lauda had negotiated, JW hung out for an improved deal himself. Unbeknown to him, Alain Prost fell out with Renault and unexpectedly came onto the market, RD swooped on the chance to sign Prost (for a tiny sum) and was able to tell JW - 'sorry we simply can't afford you...'

You don't tend to win the number of titles that William's have, through a mix of decades and engine suppliers, without putting the team first - which is one of the reasons William's are still in F1.

FW and PH always mainain that no driver is bigger than the team, and have no qualms about releasing drivers (WDC or not).

Possibly Ralf as verbally agreed something at Toyota or they have led him and Weber to believe that they are close to a deal, which has in turn led Weber and Ralf to puff their chest out. But, playing hardball with FW usually only see's one winner, and it's not the driver.

Last edited by Super Tourer; 23 Feb 2004 at 13:55.
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 15:18 (Ref:882860)   #59
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Why would Toyota want to pay Ralf so much? That's something I don't understand. Just because they can doesn't seem to make sense. Why throw good money away? Ralf is not more than 10 million to the better of da Matta or Panis.

I think it's hot air personally, just as the Ralf to McLaren rumours in 2001 - there were no talks, it was just a bargaining tool to speed up negotiations during Ralf's on-track purple patch.

Toyota might be interested in Ralf and may end up signing him, but they shouldn't be dead set on having him at the price he names because he's simply not worth it.
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 15:51 (Ref:882887)   #60
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gttouring should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Ralf want 13 million, so do I.
but he's crackers he hasn't delivered a challenge as JPM has
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Old 23 Feb 2004, 20:45 (Ref:883222)   #61
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Ron Dennis used to do that. Paid his drivers very little (in F1 terms) but gave big win bonuses - £600,000 a win etc

Got Mikka 2 World Champs!!
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Old 24 Feb 2004, 00:11 (Ref:883448)   #62
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"He knows that I would accept to cut my current salary in half."

Seems to fly in the face of this entire thread. Ralf seems to have painted himself into a corner from which it is probably too late to escape. Looks good on him. This should improve Toyotas' position, or that of any other team who decides to negotiate with him.
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Old 24 Feb 2004, 04:14 (Ref:883562)   #63
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Ralf denies the reports suggesting that he had threatened to leave Williams at the end of the F1 season in a row over money.

http://www.reuters.com/locales/newsA...toryID=4418714
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Old 24 Feb 2004, 04:45 (Ref:883578)   #64
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Alan Henry, senior F1 journalist, reports mentions in his reports that "It is believed that the world champion's younger brother is already in negotiations with Toyota."

http://sport.guardian.co.uk/formulao...153902,00.html
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Old 24 Feb 2004, 15:42 (Ref:884117)   #65
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It is hard to believe that this close to the first race of the season there is (rumoured) unhappiness at BMW, it certainly does not seem like the professional way they usually go about things.

Having said that there is nothing in the way of hard facts coming out of any of the camps, Ralf has apparently told a German newspaper that he was fed up with Frank Williams tactics, but hasn’t Frank always been known as a bit of a meanie as far as wages were concerned – so why choose this close to the start of the season to gripe about a situation that he must surely have been familiar with long before now.

I think that it is his man Willi Weber, just hanging out a price tag on Ralf for anyone that is interested because his contract is up at the end of the year, although at that kind of money it is hard to see just who would be, he’s too old for Toyota, and possibly too expensive.

With his brother out of the picture I think that he would be a different driver, probably show a bit more nerve as a finisher – so maybe all those millions would not be so far out there as to be unrealistic, but that would be with his brother out of the picture and so far there is no sign of that.

It all makes for more excitement as the start draws near though, so roll up roll up and roll on Australia.
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Old 24 Feb 2004, 17:37 (Ref:884221)   #66
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Rennen should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridRennen should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridRennen should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridRennen should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Hes got Willy Weber to support!
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Old 26 Feb 2004, 13:02 (Ref:886231)   #67
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Well his new tactic (although it was arranged in Decemeber) is to test for BMW! While Williams were pounding round Imola, Ralf was having a play in a M3 GTR at Monza.

To be fair, I don't wish to read to much into it, I think he just wanted a go - for fun.
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Old 26 Feb 2004, 16:33 (Ref:886429)   #68
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According to reports, when Lord Michael signed his new deal, he did not receive a raise, his salary remained the same, albeit a very tidy sum.

What was it about Ralfs performaces relative to his brothers, that he should see any substantial increase in his pay? Nothing special from my point of view.
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Old 27 Feb 2004, 04:36 (Ref:886969)   #69
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With that logic mate, 21 drivers should get a drop in pay
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Old 27 Feb 2004, 07:14 (Ref:887012)   #70
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No, just those making 3 times their teammates salary, yet finishing 24 points behind in the drivers championship.
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Old 28 Feb 2004, 10:17 (Ref:888100)   #71
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With that logic mate, 21 drivers should get a drop in pay
What grid are you watching Wrex? Surely you mean 19
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Old 29 Feb 2004, 18:21 (Ref:889295)   #72
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"sack him" sir frank send him to toyota where MR 10% OR MR 20%(WHICH ONE DO THEY CALL WILLI WEBBER)can collect his pay hire FISI and prote a yong gun.put the rst of the money into the car
"SACK HIM"
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Old 1 Mar 2004, 02:32 (Ref:889676)   #73
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Well, Ralf obviously will leave Williams.

Patrick Head said on Sunday he hoped the team would not have to replace two drivers in 2005, but said they were under pressure to cut costs.

"Thus, we've got to cut costs. Nevertheless, a slot in a Williams car is an attractive place to work for many drivers."

http://www.reuters.com/locales/newsA...toryID=4463941
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Old 1 Mar 2004, 12:29 (Ref:890002)   #74
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Originally posted by Led ZeppF1
"Thus, we've got to cut costs. Nevertheless, a slot in a Williams car is an attractive place to work for many drivers."

http://www.reuters.com/locales/newsA...toryID=4463941
Oh my... There'll be a big queue in front of Williams garage, and I'll bet Fisi is the first in line !
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Old 1 Mar 2004, 12:40 (Ref:890022)   #75
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I reckon FW & PH have already made up their minds and preliminary contracts in place with other drivers management. Also, if Ralf doesnt perform in the first part of the year he will throw his toys out of his pram and quit under pressure.
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