Modified cars

[nickyf1]

what do you think about moded cars?

[beau1]

I think the amount of money they spent on them is stupid. they might as well buy something already powerful,fast and stylish instead of trying to turn a Fiesta or something like that in to something that it should'nt be!

[Bluebottle]

Modded cars, hmmm....

well first of all forget any argument about individuality- modders all put the same stuff on the same cars. There's not much in the way of engineering in the modding scene like there was (still is?) in the custom car scene. I've seen one or two but they are the exeption.
Modders make me laugh on several levels- first there's the big wings and body kits, I presume they're not worried about straight line speed?
Second- big bore exhausts, not much good by themselves, they'll slow you down unless the engine, carbs/injection etc are worked on as well.
third, big alloys shod with rubber bands- forget it unless it's just for circuit use.
Then there's what I call the 'Doof-Doof' brigade. Anyone who knows anything about acoustics will know that it's pointless putting a pair of 15" 'subs' in a space as small as a Saxo, you end up with more sound on the outside, or is that the idea?
A well known car parts company issues two different catalogues, one full of everything you need for a race or rally car and another for modders with loads of bits, in their words, 'to give your car that 'race car' look..'

[redshoes]

Assume you mean the 'Max Power' style.

Take a popular small hatchback, usually a Saxo, Nova or Corsa. 1.1L base model if possible.
Add some badly fitting aftermarket bumpers and sideskirts, paying special attention to make sure the panel gaps are big enough.
Fit a 1960's Lucas number plate light because the replacement rear bumper means the plate no longer fits in the same place. Don't forget you'll 2 sets of plates, one legal for when the car is being MOT'ed and another in an unreadable script font.
Add an enormous rear wing, because your FWD car doesn't have enough rear downforce.
If the new front bumper isn't low enough adjust the springs so that the car catches on every speed bump.
Fit some cheap aftermarket alloys, the fewer spokes the better.
With the rear brakes now clearly visible through the alloys paint the drums a bright colour to highlight that this is started as a poverty spec model.
Fit clear lens 'Lexus' rear lights
Paint the car a lurid shade of yellow/green, ideally with glitter paint. If possible drive around with the car still partly in primer for a few months.
Install an oversized twin- or quad-exhaust, the more pipes the better, ideally at least one per cylinder.
Install a substancial ICE system, filling as much of the boot space as possible with amps and bass speakers.
Whatever you do don't tell your insurance company about the mods.
If you're really good, remove the 1.1 engine and fit a 2.0 litre. No need to upgrade the brakes or suspension as I'm sure they will be up to the job. Again don't tell the DVLA or insurance.

Then 12 months later put your 'one off not like any other modified Saxo' on eBay and wonder why you get no bids, before realising that not only is it not worth what you spent on modifying it, it's actually worth less than if you kept the car standard, and that for the £10K you've just wasted on your shopping trolley you could have brought a decent car in the first place.

[redshoes]

That'll teach me for stopping for dinner half way through replying to a thread. Should have guessed Bluebottle would get in first.

Originally Posted by Bluebottle

A well known car parts company issues two different catalogues, one full of everything you need for a race or rally car and another for modders with loads of bits, in their words, 'to give your car that 'race car' look..'

Thought I'd seen it all until a couple of weeks ago. STICK ON fake bonnet pins

[Bluebottle]

Originally Posted by redshoes

STICK ON fake bonnet pins

That beats the more common fake 'aero style' filler cap!

[lj79]

Originally Posted by nickyf1

what do you think about moded cars?

Crap. Driven by ******s. Cant really expand on that

[Bluebottle]

Some predictable responses from us lot so far. Any modders out there like to balance the thread a bit?

[Tim Wilkinson]

I'd love to play..... some wonderfully predictable and stereotypical responses above!

First, I agree that modding is a mug's game, throwing good money after bad. But so is buying a new car, going on a round the world cruise etc etc UNLESS you enjoy those things. "Modders" enjoy creating something with their car, for themself and other people within their scene to appreciate. It might not be to everyone's taste, but a lot of things aren't!
One reason for modding is that insurance costs are crippling for anything above base level small hatches that are several years old - one reason Saxo's got so popular with "modders" is that the insurance was free from Citroen for a couple of years from new. Yes, it makes sense to save up what you spend on eggbox bodykits and get a better car in a few years, but today's culture isn't like that - it's here and now that counts.

Also everyone is making the assumption that modding is purely visual - it's not, that's just the part that gets most press as it's the gaudy show-off section. I know people with very standard-looking cars that have rather better than standard performance. I find it rather narrow-minded of people to just focus on one section of a past-time and criticise not only the creations as a generalistaion but also the people who do it.
If you're not causing a nuisance (and the cruising scene, both legal and not so legal, are very different from modding) then what's the harm?

I now wait for the assumption that i'm 17 and own several speakers bigger than my head......

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by teej

One reason for modding is that insurance costs are crippling for anything above base level small hatches that are several years old - one reason Saxo's got so popular with "modders" is that the insurance was free from Citroen for a couple of years from new.

As mentioned above any modifications to standard, whether it's a body kit, uprated engine or major ICE installation, should be declared to the insurance broker. That will inevitable mean higher premiums, which negates the cheap insurance arguement. That is of course assumes the mods are actually declared, which more often that not they aren't

Also everyone is making the assumption that modding is purely visual - it's not, that's just the part that gets most press as it's the gaudy show-off section. I know people with very standard-looking cars that have rather better than standard performance. I find it rather narrow-minded of people to just focus on one section of a past-time and criticise not only the creations as a generalistaion but also the people who do it.

I've got no problem with genuine performance and handling mods. Take something like Retro Cars mag, most of the stuff in there has bigger or more tuned engine, better brakes, better handling, etc. All perfectly acceptable. It's the pointless bodykits, big 'zorts, neon lights, etc that I object to.

[DKGandBH]

I used to have a modified vehicle (but not a riced version as described above)

1988 EA GL Falcon
5 Speed Manual and 3.9 MPFI (most powerful factory option)
These two options in combination were as rare as hens teeth in the base model car

Modification I added
Mag Wheels (lattice type, 16" tall and 6.5" wide) with 45 series tyres
XR6 spec rebuilt motor (when the head gasket blew, I spent a few extra $)
LSD
Extractors and a 2 1/2 " exhaust
EB GT Falcon Rear Wing and Bumpers
Two tone paint job (Original Beige and subtle Black highlights)

This made it a nice cheap reliable fast car !

The brakes and suspension were next - then the car was stolen (but that can be read elsewhere)

DKGandBH

[imull]

why on earth would anyone want to have a 1ltr sazo that has been isiously assualted by a tupperware tub. I suspect that the motorsport community would not be half as scathing of these 'modders' if they didnt drive like a bunch of complete ar$eholes on congested roads in the middle of cities. eg Kingsway in Swansea

Personally I would rather modify my car to be something unique and of better performance rather than something that looks like an 80's sc-fi prop. The insurance on my fully declared comp car is half that of my diesel estate road car! this also negates the cheap insurance quotes. Perhaps most of the problem is that these kids dont seem to go to the specialist brokers...

[Bluebottle]

Originally Posted by imull

Personally I would rather modify my car to be something unique and of better performance.....

A good example here, this is the best way to make a Fiesta look better, perform better and handle better.... http://www.mageefam.freeserve.co.uk/ (....although I'm not too sure about the stripes ) and the insurance will be less than a 'modded' car!

[Truckosaurus]

Originally Posted by Bluebottle

Some predictable responses from us lot so far. Any modders out there like to balance the thread a bit?

Fair Play to the Max Power boys if they enjoy their cars, it's not usually to my taste, and sometimes can be very amusing (like the p.o.s. Toyota Corolla I saw the other week with very bad fake chrome 'spinners' that were in fact plastic wheel trims stuck on steel wheels).

I've fitted lowered suspension and louder exhausts on many of my cars, but it was all done very subtlely and wouldn't have got any of the cars a second look in McDonalds' car park.

I've even modified my current diesel Volvo.

[Tim Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by redshoes

As mentioned above any modifications to standard, whether it's a body kit, uprated engine or major ICE installation, should be declared to the insurance broker. That will inevitable mean higher premiums, which negates the cheap insurance arguement. That is of course assumes the mods are actually declared, which more often that not they aren't

It's true in some cases that the insurance will be a lot higher, but in others it won't. Historically insurers have been against performance mods, so visual stuff has been relatively cheap, hence the proliferation of low-spec cars with silly kits on. It's also worth noting that insurance is based upon the base model, and mods added on top of that; as an example my track nova with a 2l engine cost roughly 25% less to insure than my track astra with a similarly powered engine and other mods (and value). Despite the "reputation" of the Nova (some insurers refuse to cover them), that it was a 1.4 before the conversion as opposed to the 1.8 Astra made all the difference.
I'd be interested to see the statistics you have on declaration of mods, although I totally agree that not declaring them to the insurers, or engine changes to the DVLA, is wrong.

There are also running costs to consider - an Evo or similar might be great fun even as standard, but when the service intervals are so regular and routinely crippling it doesn't always make sense to get a car like that when a lesser car can be improved and retain the lower running costs.

I've got no problem with genuine performance and handling mods. Take something like Retro Cars mag, most of the stuff in there has bigger or more tuned engine, better brakes, better handling, etc. All perfectly acceptable. It's the pointless bodykits, big 'zorts, neon lights, etc that I object to.

That's fine, I find a lot of visual mods objectionable too. Isn't it possible to tolerate or even ignore them, tho? Obviously the people who modify their cars in this way see a point to it all, and I'm sure they'd not see a point to many things you or I enjoy doing. I often get stick for standing up for modders, but all my point is is that it's "horses for courses" - if they aren't doing any harm then let them be.

[BertMk2]

Modding is fine if done in moderation, I've seen a mk2 Fiesta with an Escort Cosworth whale tail spoiler - that's just plain wrong. Some cars look good with kits attached but it's always the subtle changes that look best. Engine mods I don't have a problem with provided the rest of the car is able to handle the extra power - brakes, suspension, gearbox, wheels - everything needs looking at.

Ridiculous thudding bass - NO

[garcon]

I'm old and mature and everything these days, so I don't go in for modded cars myself. I would go for the odd performance modification if it wasn't for the fact I've been crucified on insurance premiums in the recent past (admittedly that was on an Impreza, but an extra £100 pa for a Prodrive backbox & tailpipe?!?!).

Being a generation older, you can probably appreciate I don't go in for the heavily Max Powered Corsas and Saxos. They do nothing for me. And I am convinced that the majority of them have not declared their mods on their insurance, which means there are herds of 17 year old boy racers chugging round colliding into things who are not insured. If I was a traffic cop I'd stop every single one and give them a producer, on that basis alone.

There are, however, a minority of truly great modified cars out there, from Saxos upwards, that are relatively original, expertly done and a credit to their owners. It's not my scene, but I appreciate a job well done by a dedicated and conscientious owner.

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by teej

I'd be interested to see the statistics you have on declaration of mods, although I totally agree that not declaring them to the insurers, or engine changes to the DVLA, is wrong.

More experience than statistics.
Pick any modified car with an engine swap and check the details on DVLA or RAC website. I recon you'll have a better than evens chance that the details will not show the increased cc.

[StuiE]

Engine, suspension and brake mods I like, bodykits, clear taillights, general useless **** I don't like


my project involves a car looking like it did from the factory, it will just go alot harder, engine bay will look factory too, I plan to scare many of the above stereotypes...with the stereos :P

[BertMk2]

Our rally car started out as a tweaked road car (it's a mk2 Escort), eventually it got to the point where my mate decided that he might as well go all the way and do it properly, get the car sorted for competition use then get out there I got the job of co-driving because I weigh less than air

The amount people spend on modding a 1 litre shopping cart they could probably go racing in stock hatch for the same amount.

[Tim Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by redshoes

More experience than statistics.
Pick any modified car with an engine swap and check the details on DVLA or RAC website. I recon you'll have a better than evens chance that the details will not show the increased cc.

Maybe i'm being naive, then. Both the cars i've owned with engine swaps were declared before I bought them, maybe that's because I bought them from older chaps rather than young 'uns. The few other people I know who've transplanted something a little pokier in have also declared it - i'd give them an earful if they didn't!

Garcon - re: stopping everyone with a modified car - you'd have no time to do anyrhing else! Luckily the police don't have as much time on their hands (and aren't quite that draconian), and i've never been stopped in any of my "modified" cars - however knowing i'd be an easy target in them makes me drive more sensibly and take extra care.

[DKGandBH]

All the mods for my car were declared... This resulted in refusal of insurance from most, increaste premiums from others, and nary a twitch from the chosen insurer...

I rebuilt the original engine to avoid having to change the details everywhere, this is also why I kept the color standard (mostly)

Some of the reasons why the car was knocked back for insurance...
Lowered
Extractors
Wheels wider than factory
Tyres wider than Factory
Body Kit

even though all these modifications were within the legal requirements for registration, and most of them were within factory specs for other models in the range...

DKGandBH

[johnh875]

Once I was looking at buying a car with an engine swap (it had all been done legally not to mention very well), it was interesting though, just imagine ringing insurance companies though and saying the car now had a 7.5L V8…

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by teej

Maybe i'm being naive, then. Both the cars i've owned with engine swaps were declared before I bought them, maybe that's because I bought them from older chaps rather than young 'uns. The few other people I know who've transplanted something a little pokier in have also declared it - i'd give them an earful if they didn't!

Earlier you refered to one of your cars as a 'track astra'. Can I assume from that that you've got a track-day modified car rather than the ICE and bodykit modified variety? If that's the case I'm not surprised that your engine swaps were legal. I suspect that track-day drivers tend to be more enthusiasts with some mechanical knowledge that your average Max Power reader.

As I said earlier if we are talking about sensible power, braking and handling mods (for example building a track-day weapon) then I don't have a problem with that.

[Kicking-back]

The ones who fill the boot with a massive amp are hilarious when they stall at traffic lights and don't realise, because they can't hear the engine over the BOOM BOOM BOOM.

***** the lot of them!