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31 Aug 2012, 20:36 (Ref:3128023) | #1 | ||
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Open Regulation Formula One - What Would it Look Like?
So there's been a lot of discussion on the topic of freedom within the technical regulations - whether or not it would be feasible seems to be the main point of contention. But what I haven't seen explored is what a car built under these open regulations would look like, what technologies it would employ, and just how fast it'd be. So, let's speculate.
We'd need to establish the limits we're working with. What I've seen suggested are limits on budget, limits on energy, safety requirements, and size limits. I'm not sure what these should be set at, unfortunately, so I would like to ask for your suggestions on that front. I recognize that any limits we set will be of minimal use, as we're not F1 designers, but I still think this'd be a fun bit of speculating. So, shall we have at it? |
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31 Aug 2012, 21:21 (Ref:3128033) | #2 | ||
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My guess would be it would be pretty close to this:
That's pretty darn big, so it would need to be scaled down to meet reasonable overall dimensional limits. Ben Bowlby discovered a new direction with the narrow front track, strong rear weight/downforce bias, so I would expect the X1 concept would be revised more in that direction. With energy limits, streamlining would be more important than it has been in the past. |
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31 Aug 2012, 22:02 (Ref:3128047) | #3 | ||
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The X1 assumes closed cockpits and enclosed wheels - is that what we would want to use, for this little game? I figured on open cockpit and open wheels being required. Besides, if regulations were open, wouldn't we see wildly different approaches?
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31 Aug 2012, 22:41 (Ref:3128058) | #4 | |||
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Quote:
I agree, there would likely be wildly different approaches, which would be a big part of the appeal. X1 would be one potential flavor. |
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31 Aug 2012, 23:19 (Ref:3128071) | #5 | ||
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Technical freedom, yes, but if it's Formula One, then it's for Formula Cars, isn't it? And aren't the features which typify a Formula Car open wheels and an open cockpit? Technical freedom is the point of the exercise, but technical freedom within the context of a Formula Car series.
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1 Sep 2012, 00:15 (Ref:3128083) | #6 | |||
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Quote:
This would seem to answer the question of open wheels as 'not necessarily'. Open cockpits are currently being debated as well. |
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1 Sep 2012, 01:04 (Ref:3128089) | #7 | ||
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this looks like fun so here goes:
aerodynamically it would probably look like the x2011 concept but imagine a different style of power-plant. on the one hand their are turbines they are powerful ,light and mean that you won't need a separate fan but they have issues with accelerating from a standstill and if we used them as a fan down force would be dependent on engine speed then their are electric motors which are light weight and compact compared to similarly powerful ICEs and have awesome torque curves but need very large and heavy energy storage systems like batteries, if however we go for a series hybrid both can be exploited for their strengths and their weaknesses mitigated. If we have active suspension then we could see a move away from wish bone suspension as body roll could simply be dialed out and retaining camber at all ride heights and when going over bumps would take on more importance and trailing arm systems might become the choice. |
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1 Sep 2012, 01:30 (Ref:3128094) | #8 | ||||
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Quote:
As far as open cockpits go, while it may become a necessity due to safety, let's assume that it won't. Quote:
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1 Sep 2012, 03:21 (Ref:3128099) | #9 | |
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No driver, fully automated or more likely real time remote from garage (why put all of that heavy processing power on board), extremely light weight, exotic fuel and materials. Basically toss in every banned idea from the past few decades. Cost? Don't ask.
Richard |
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1 Sep 2012, 03:47 (Ref:3128106) | #10 | |||
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And if we really wanted to advance technology and science that is what we would have instead of this sort of celebrity obsessed, contrived formula we call F1. But I still like watching it even if the wrong people are making all the money for the wrong reasons. |
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1 Sep 2012, 15:20 (Ref:3128261) | #11 | |
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F1 should be about technology and making advances in new technology. One way to do that is give them a rule that limits the liquid fuel pumped in as petrol or whatever they use these days to an amount that makes it impossible to finish a race. Then we would see some thinking based an alternative methods of propelling the thing as fast as possible. The rest should be run what ya brung.
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2 Sep 2012, 21:04 (Ref:3129369) | #12 | |||||
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Quote:
Quote:
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2 Sep 2012, 22:10 (Ref:3129425) | #13 | ||
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We have had a thread on this some while ago and I said, the car must fit in a certain measurement/any type of body/ any type and cc of engine but the same type of fuel must be used and limited. Now that would bring out some innovations !!
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2 Sep 2012, 22:35 (Ref:3129445) | #14 | |||
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Quote:
What sort of technology do we think we'd actually see with more open regulations? Would diesel rise, like cream, to the top at the peak of motorsport (or what at least purports to be the peak of motorsport)? Would petrol be able to maintain dominance? Would single malt prove the answer for the world's renewable fuel problems? What sort of technological advancement can we expect if everyone must use spec fuel? /snark Seriously though, I was hoping to hear speculation or what sort of technologies might be used, in specific. Just saying "all the banned stuff from over the years" doesn't really ignite the imagination (at least for me, being unfamiliar with much of it). |
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2 Sep 2012, 22:45 (Ref:3129451) | #15 | ||
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If you limit what type of fuel can be used that gives a starting point, I think that nuclear fuel would be ruled out because of the safety aspect.
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Balls of steel (knob of butter) They're Asking For Larkins. ( Proper beer) not you're Eurofizz crap. Hace más calor en España. Me han conocido a hablar un montón cojones! Send any cheques and cash to PO box 1 Lagos Nigeria Africa ! |
2 Sep 2012, 23:04 (Ref:3129466) | #16 | |
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Think of all the things that have been banned in F1 over the years and then look at how they might have been developed.
I can imagine having powerful cars with fans for downforce producing so many G's that the cars will be able to drive flatout all race, no brakes required. The drivers will need G suits but will they save them from blackouts? Otherwise the cars can be driven remotely in simulators. |
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2 Sep 2012, 23:04 (Ref:3129467) | #17 | ||||
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Quote:
And let us assume that equivalent amounts of our four fuels would be available to each car. Edit: Quote:
As far as G Suits and fan cars go, I wonder how much lateral G the tires can take before they start letting go. Particularly if that number is higher or lower than 9g, which seems to be the current limit before G-LOC. Last edited by S14; 2 Sep 2012 at 23:10. |
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2 Sep 2012, 23:12 (Ref:3129472) | #18 | |||
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After the first year everybody would just copy the winners anyway |
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Balls of steel (knob of butter) They're Asking For Larkins. ( Proper beer) not you're Eurofizz crap. Hace más calor en España. Me han conocido a hablar un montón cojones! Send any cheques and cash to PO box 1 Lagos Nigeria Africa ! |
2 Sep 2012, 23:21 (Ref:3129481) | #19 | ||
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I'm not sure what you mean. I meant equivalent amounts of fuel would be determined, so if you're running petrol then the volume of petrol you are allowed has about the same amount of energy in the fuel as the energy in the volume of someone else's Jet A.
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3 Sep 2012, 00:58 (Ref:3129518) | #20 | ||
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Anything to get away from the F1 that has turned into something resembling Formula Vee on steroids. |
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3 Sep 2012, 04:26 (Ref:3129583) | #21 | |||
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Quote:
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3 Sep 2012, 17:33 (Ref:3130038) | #22 | |
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This would indeed be true. After all, it's teams trying to beat one another and not teams trying to find the craziest way of doing it. If it turns out that a 1,000cc four cylinder diesel turbo engine coupled to super quiet electric motors with CVT are the best way forward, then that'll be the death of F1.
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