Should we go Chase system for V8's

[fomoco]

Craig said in in article, in the Courier Mail, Speed cafe picked it up, V8 Supercars has knocked it back before.

Would it add spice to the taxi rank racing?
Are our tracks good enough to handle go for it racing?


Would this intice more fans to come out and watch?

Should the last three meetings be 9 sprint races , no pit stops, go for it racing to recieve the crown?

Top ten plus to two wild cards?

has merit when you look at it, might get more bums on seats, good for sponsors to get their product highlighted.

[Carsandmotorracing]

That's the stupidest idea i've ever heard.

[peckstar]

I think its a goof idea. unfortunately the time to start it was after Bathurst, but the current Gold coast roiund has made it difficult.

The championship this year is virtually decided (well a two horse race between team mates).

In most sports we have a similar thing, a final system where is all starts again and any of the final contenders can win, it re-ignites interest

[GTRMagic]

But what are the benefits of it?

I get the marketing position of telling a sponsor that you made the top 12 in the series, and are now battling it out for the championship title... but that was going to happen anyway with the existing system

Is there any benefit for the 13-28 cars to attend the rest of the year? They could be like an HRT, outside the 12 by enduro time, and win everything till year's end... but wouldnt reflect their championship position because the selected Chase group was always going to have more points after they are reset

[peckstar]

hang on i will just check with the AFL why they have a finals system, im sure they have a good reason

[revhead05]

Nope, wouldn't work here for a number of reasons.

Firstly, Nascar have 36 rounds to their championship, 10 of which make up the chase. 10 races is enough to make the best driver (nearly) always win the championship, even if they have an off week.
This is unlike the V8s. In order to have 10 races (or a number that is reasonable enough to form a championship) you would need to have multiple rounds per race week-end, and a major off in the first race of a "chase" round ends your week-end, and your championship, there and then, as it would potentially adversely affect a driver for more than one race.

Secondly, there are many more drivers in Nascar who realistically can win the title, whereas in V8s there are only a handful. How would you determine who qualifies for the chase? 12 drivers, only half of whom (at most) should realistically be there on overall performance? Ridiculous.

Thirdly, towards the end of the non-chase part of the championship, why would a driver who has already qualified to be in the chase race any harder than they need to, with the risk of tearing up their equipment, a situation that doesn't exist in Nascar with the number of spare cars available to them. You could end up with some rather staid racing.

A dumb idea I reckon.

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by peckstar

hang on i will just check with the AFL why they have a finals system, im sure they have a good reason

Because the AFL have 24 games in their main season, each of 4 lots of 20 minutes, each with 18 players on the ground, and 4 interchange replacements on the bench.

Each game is scored identically, a win, draw or loss the only results possible.

Doesnt sound like V8Supercar to me...

[peckstar]

revhead let me argue you against your points

first we have a 28 race series of which 8 occur after bathurst, therefore i would suggest that it meets your criteria almost perfectly. plus the series is expanding so will meet it even more.

secondly you have about 8 drivers who have won this year in v8s and a number who have some excellent results leaving them in the top ten in the championship, this is similar to the NASCAR system, so does not really create an issue, apart from being different to before

third COTF is coming, the liklihood is teams will have more cars, but people said that about bathurst , why would they try hen it might ruin their championship, but only one year (99) have i seen them not try, besides the chase rewards those who win, so that is a reason to try

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Because the AFL have 24 games in their main season, each of 4 lots of 20 minutes, each with 18 players on the ground, and 4 interchange replacements on the bench.

Each game is scored identically, a win, draw or loss the only results possible.

Doesnt sound like V8Supercar to me...

well under a chase scenarion, the v8s would have 20-22 rounds each with 28 cars on the grid

each race is scored reasonabloy identically with a win or a loss being the only option.

they would then have an 8 to ten race finals system, with the best driver in the finals series being awarded the championship

all the other teams would still be able to race and even win races, thus giving their sponsors heaps of coverage.

I really dont see any issues, except it is different and the championship has been different every year nearly anyway

[bortall]

Originally Posted by peckstar

hang on i will just check with the AFL why they have a finals system, im sure they have a good reason

To suck money out of gullible supporters & TV networks

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by bortall

To suck money out of gullible supporters & TV networks

so no change then

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by Carsandmotorracing

That's the stupidest idea i've ever heard.

So you are happy with a system that allows a driver never to win but come 2,3,4, an acumulate enough points to win a Championship, even thow he never won a race?

Just seeking options to make racing a bit more interesting.
As other have said look a football, top teams go for it, some win some loose.

F1, we should hand Vetel the trophy now, and not do the last races.
( save a lot of money by the punters and teams not having to travel)

as they say in Davis Cup tennis, a DEAD RUBBER

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Because the AFL have 24 games in their main season, each of 4 lots of 20 minutes, each with 18 players on the ground, and 4 interchange replacements on the bench.

Each game is scored identically, a win, draw or loss the only results possible.

Doesnt sound like V8Supercar to me...

This is true, but wouldn't it spice up the racing and give the punters something else. Or we could be like F1, winner is already known, no need to do more races, who came second without googling it, in the 1999 ATTC/V8Supercars, and more to the point, who was third, fourth, fifth?

Hasn't a online betting agency introduced a who will not win bet.

They would loose on V8 supercars.

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

But what are the benefits of it?

I get the marketing position of telling a sponsor that you made the top 12 in the series, and are now battling it out for the championship title... but that was going to happen anyway with the existing system

Is there any benefit for the 13-28 cars to attend the rest of the year? They could be like an HRT, outside the 12 by enduro time, and win everything till year's end... but wouldnt reflect their championship position because the selected Chase group was always going to have more points after they are reset

You have a valid comment , I will counter with I can ran second and third all year, not win a race but get the Trophy.

A bit like like Crickets World ranking, haven't won every thing, but we are Number One test team.


Hasn't this occured before?

[revhead05]

Originally Posted by peckstar

revhead let me argue you against your points

first we have a 28 race series of which 8 occur after bathurst, therefore i would suggest that it meets your criteria almost perfectly. plus the series is expanding so will meet it even more.

secondly you have about 8 drivers who have won this year in v8s and a number who have some excellent results leaving them in the top ten in the championship, this is similar to the NASCAR system, so does not really create an issue, apart from being different to before

third COTF is coming, the liklihood is teams will have more cars, but people said that about bathurst , why would they try hen it might ruin their championship, but only one year (99) have i seen them not try, besides the chase rewards those who win, so that is a reason to try

OK, here we go.
Firstly, of those 8 races after Bathurst, all are at multiple race week-ends. As I said, a major problem in the first of those races could put a driver out for all of the others for that week-end (think Whincup at Hamilton a couple of years ago). A dominant driver for the non-chase portion could then be out of the championship altogether at the first chase week-end. At least the way things are now, a dud week-end is damaging but not necessarily fatal for a championship.

Second, 8 winners in V8s - what does this mean? Just because you win a race makes you eligible for a chase berth? Courtney has won one race, but sits 20th of 28 in the current standings. Would he therefore be eligible? This would make a complete mockery of it all.

Third, COTF has yet to prove anything. Will it really reduce costs enough for teams to have a transporter full of spare cars? We don't know yet, so it's hard to argue one way or the other, but my opinion is that it will not. Its costs are already rising according to all reports, and we all know that teams will just find another way to throw money at the cars looking for that poofteenth of a milllitre of performance.

I know that we are unavoidably now in the entertainment game, but at the very least the best driver over the ENTIRE year should win the title.

[racer69]

Originally Posted by fomoco

Are our tracks good enough to handle go for it racing?

Are you saying our tracks have never had 'go for it racing' before??

You would not get any 'harder' racing just because there is a chase, or are you insinuating that the drivers don't try nowadays?




You can't compare a 'chase' with Finals Football. Does the AFL allow the teams who didn't qualify for the finals to keep competing?

A championship is surely the culmination of a years work, not 8 months of 'buying a ticket to the end game' and then having a crack for the last few races when you a gifted the chance to catch up to the points leaders....

[Paradise City]

They should scrap the chase from NASCAR and quit the baseball gimmicks.

and

Aussie V8's > NASCAR [on ovals]

[peckstar]

first , if collingwood or melbourne lost on the weekend, they were in trouble, thats how a final series works. its a risk, bad luck. same in v8's, when the pressure is on, you have to step up, it also happens in our current system.

second, what i am saying if we can have 8 drivers who win races, it means we have at least 8 drivers who can in theory win the championship, plus we have others who are also competitive and get podiums, relate that back to your original point, a top ten is probably enough

thirdly you didnt really comment on my point

[NaBUru38]

The Argentine Turismo carretera has a playoffs system. The regular season lasts 11 rounds. The top 12 in the standings advance to the playoffs, which last 5 rounds. The driver with most playoffs points that has won a feature race gets crowned. (Each round consists of three 30km heat races with a third of the grid in each and a final 25 lap feature race.) It's rather crappy: since top finishers get ballast, drivers don't want to win more than once in a season. But season finales do get exciting.

The Argentine Top Race has an insanely complicated championship system. There are four 3-round stages and a final 2-round final stage. In each stage, points start from zero and the top 5 drivers get final stage points. All drivers with final stage points plus all feature race winners get to the final stage to fight for the championship. The result is that nobody understands the system, not drivers, teams, journalists or fans, so everybody focuses on race fights, wins and controversies. Very Nascarizing, very Vesian.

The point is: do you prefer to focus on a champinship fight or on race fights? The answer will tell you what championship system is the best.

[chavez]

Originally Posted by revhead05

Secondly, there are many more drivers in Nascar who realistically can win the title, whereas in V8s there are only a handful.

Hasn't a bloke named Jimmy Johnson won the last five straight Sprint Cup titles, whereas V8 Supercars have had four different champions over the same period?

That might suggest there are more V8 Supercar contenders than Sprint Cup contenders.

[Carsandmotorracing]

Originally Posted by fomoco

So you are happy with a system that allows a driver never to win but come 2,3,4, an acumulate enough points to win a Championship, even thow he never won a race?

Just seeking options to make racing a bit more interesting.
As other have said look a football, top teams go for it, some win some loose.

F1, we should hand Vetel the trophy now, and not do the last races.
( save a lot of money by the punters and teams not having to travel)

as they say in Davis Cup tennis, a DEAD RUBBER

Listen motorsports in not entertainment, it's serious and proffessional. Not some reality TV show. So no, I don't think we should have it, if Whincup wins, then that shows how good he and 888 are.

[mountainstar]

I never liked the Chase system nascar started and still don't. I think it's a dumb idea.

[dsg]

I don't think the series needs a chase system but is does need to do something to address the disjointed calendar of events that currently make up the series. At the moment the series calendar is so widely spaced that it lacks any sort of continuity. By the time the next race comes around very little is remembered from the previous race and all momentum is lost. Each race almost seems more like a one off event. Promoting the final race as some sort of Grand Final seems a fairly hollow marketing ploy.

I feel the series should be shorter (time wise), have the races spaces closer together and held at regular (predictable) intervals.

Possible options could be 12 events held every 2 weeks. May to October with Bathurst as the final race. Maybe a summer series from October to March with the season starting at Bathurst and the final in Adelaide. Other options could be splitting the series in half with 2 championships, one sprint series for drivers and an endurance series for teams.

There will always be a problem with scheduling because our weekends are dominated by the much more popular AFL and to a lesser extent NRL but there are opportunities to work with digital channels and pay TV.

Let me know what you think as this may just be my opinion and widely despised by the fans to which the series organisers should be catering to.

[Just Do It!]

Wasn't the Chase system what you all see on Shannon's Supercar Showdown where all the boys chased Hayley Swanson?

That kind of failed as well so perhaps the current system isn't too bad.

....Or have I missed something?

[DV_08]

Pass on this one. Winning the championship is reward for a whole years work. I don't see how you can compare it to say AFL. Without a final series in the AFL most the matches wouldn't count for anything there is no real incentive but in any form of motorsport you can still play for race wins and podiums plus in V8supercars there are the enduros. Various pro soccer leagues don't have finals systems but they have the threat of relegation plus they can qualify for various european competitions. I would hate to see a driver dominate the first half of the season and then loose the championship just because of a bit of bad luck in the last few rounds. More often then not the championship seems to go down to the last round anyway.