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Old 17 Sep 2020, 04:10 (Ref:4002915)   #16
Alan52
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Originally Posted by Adam43 View Post
Are they double file restarts?
No.Also the Bathurst 12 Hour which is an international race bans weaving after safety car lights go out.Multiple international drivers cop drive throughs every year.
No weaving definitely makes it safer because all cars are pointed straight ahead and in a straight line when it is green to go.Maybe the theory is the high standard of F1 drivers negates the risk.
In a pre weaving ban era I remember a national Formula Ford race at Eastern Creek about 15 years ago where the whole field was weaving about coming up to the restart,a bunch of cars got tangled up and crashed and most of the field was out before they reached the restart at the start/finish line.
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Old 17 Sep 2020, 09:55 (Ref:4002968)   #17
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We need to look at things carefully. I can see why other series have banned weaving after SC goes in, it seems like quite common sense to me. Maybe F1 should look at it. Bottas did nothing wrong, but it didn't make things easier for those behind. Or maybe as I said earlier they should be allowed to overtake at the first SC line like the old days.

The other problem with this weaving is that it can filter down to lower formula where standards can be bad enough at times. Just need to keep a close eye on things to make sure the incident we saw doesn't happen too often
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Old 17 Sep 2020, 14:13 (Ref:4003055)   #18
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steve_r should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridsteve_r should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridsteve_r should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridsteve_r should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
If you ban weaving, then we are going to end up with freeze frame video stills being posted in internet forums all over the world with fans trying to prove that a driver was or was not weaving, and F1 would probably have to setup a weaving committee to define what constitutes an unacceptable weave.

I assume speeding up or slowing down would similarly be banned.

You could take the whole thing out of the drivers hands - set them at pit limiter speeds until a green flag waves, and then go go go, overtake if you can.
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Old 17 Sep 2020, 14:56 (Ref:4003092)   #19
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I assume speeding up or slowing down would similarly be banned.

Y
It already is.
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Old 17 Sep 2020, 15:53 (Ref:4003117)   #20
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It already is.
So, hows that going?
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Old 17 Sep 2020, 16:55 (Ref:4003154)   #21
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The sudden and abrupt change in speed was banned, the driver at the front can slow if he wants but can't brake check.

90% of the problem was drivers in the mid pack thinking THEY controlled the race. Russell sped up and slowed a couple times as did others, that's why they were called in.

I don't get the need to make a new rule because drivers can't behave. They wrecked, their race was over and teams don't forget, none of them were Hamilton so overlooking binning the car being stupid won't happen often. They are supposed to be the best drivers and we're adding for rules like they're children. That's utter nonsense and frankly and insult to anyone who can think. More rules ALWAYS creates more loopholes and arguments, always. If you think a no weaving rule would do a damn thing I've got a beautiful bridge in NYC to sell you.
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Old 17 Sep 2020, 17:25 (Ref:4003160)   #22
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I don't get the need to make a new rule because drivers can't behave. They wrecked, their race was over and teams don't forget, none of them were Hamilton so overlooking binning the car being stupid won't happen often. They are supposed to be the best drivers and we're adding for rules like they're children. That's utter nonsense and frankly and insult to anyone who can think. More rules ALWAYS creates more loopholes and arguments, always. If you think a no weaving rule would do a damn thing I've got a beautiful bridge in NYC to sell you.
well i dont know if it is an insult to anyone who can think but that is a really fair point.

i get the need for rules to be proactive in order to prevent a possible future injury or worse, but on some level we should let the drivers learn from their mistakes and sort it themselves.

too many quick rule changes may also create more confusion and result in more incidents...unintended consequences and all that.
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Old 17 Sep 2020, 23:56 (Ref:4003306)   #23
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Based on this one incident, I'm not convinced that making changes to the SC rules is needed, as essentially the drivers stuffed it up and most likely would now treat it as a learning experience.

The driver's view that the SC lights went off later in the lap at Mugello has already been shot down by the race director, so that wasn't a cause, weaving didn't appear to cause the actual shunt, moving the line from where they can "go" would simply move the location of this shunt, large gaps and accelerating too early then having to slow due to misjudgement did cause the shunt though.

All of the drivers would be better served by keeping the gaps small and therefore clearly seeing when the leader goes and knowing that they can go themselves - no doubt they'll understand that the "clever" trick of hanging back to accelerate early and be running at higher speed is a vast gamble and not worth the risk, even for such competitive people.

Hopefully lessons taken on board and off we go!
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Old 18 Sep 2020, 01:54 (Ref:4003321)   #24
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Based on this one incident, I'm not convinced that making changes to the SC rules is needed, as essentially the drivers stuffed it up and most likely would now treat it as a learning experience.
If there was to be a significant and previously not exposed safety issue, then I am all for fixing those ASAP. But I don't think this fits into that category. So I very much agree that lets see if the learning experience is the method to fix this. I don't think this needs a knee jerk rule change.

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Old 18 Sep 2020, 03:50 (Ref:4003337)   #25
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The funny thing about this is the Michael Masi is ex Supercars and he banned it there but not in F1! Very contradictory indeed.
Michael Masi was never the race director for Supercars, he was only the deputy to Tim Schenken so he did not ban weaving in supercars, the rule is supercars is that once the safety car lights go there is no weaving allowed and all cars must maintain a speed which is supercars is 80kph. The lead driver can then choose when to go one the safety car is in pit lane but once he goes he can not then change his mind and slow down.

The other thing with the safety car restart is that we did not have any problems with the safety car restarts in the F2 and F3 races on the main start and the lead driver did not take off until he got to the start line the same as Bottas, also the commentators were saying that due to the length if the straight that the drivers will not go until the last minute so the drivers at the back in F1 should of known that Bottas would not be going early
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Old 18 Sep 2020, 04:05 (Ref:4003340)   #26
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The other thing with the safety car restart is that we did not have any problems with the safety car restarts in the F2 and F3 races on the main start and the lead driver did not take off until he got to the start line the same as Bottas, also the commentators were saying that due to the length if the straight that the drivers will not go until the last minute so the drivers at the back in F1 should of known that Bottas would not be going early
Is this not the very idea of what inspired the likes of Russell to hang back.... knowing that they could make their break a little before Bottas and have speed onboard already to more than bridge the gap they created by dropping back.
Those that did that ie Russell created the whole issue with their action.

I think that those who tried that idea are now away / educated into the ramifications of that thought and wont try it again. Maybe the last line is a bit simplistic.... in which case mandate a maximum gap and penalise violations
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Old 18 Sep 2020, 04:54 (Ref:4003349)   #27
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Michael Masi was never the race director for Supercars, he was only the deputy to Tim Schenken so he did not ban weaving in supercars
Michael worked for TEGA and then AVESCO though, back when many of the existing rules came in so he was probably part of the group that came up with that rule. The race director doesn't make the rules for Supercars, they enforce the rules that Supercars writes.
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Old 18 Sep 2020, 21:54 (Ref:4003666)   #28
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But when does the 20th placed driver go full throttle? If the green flags / lights are not it, then what?
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Old 18 Sep 2020, 22:10 (Ref:4003675)   #29
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But when does the 20th placed driver go full throttle? If the green flags / lights are not it, then what?
Well in this case, not when another car is in front of you and not out of your path. Basically the same as in a corner, it's not a hard point to figure out. You can't go where the other guy is regardless of flagging condition. It wasn't a matter of guys accelerating early but rather accelerating into other cars. Can't be a top driver if you can't not hit others. Only Pastor gets that crown.
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Old 18 Sep 2020, 23:22 (Ref:4003688)   #30
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But when does the 20th placed driver go full throttle? If the green flags / lights are not it, then what?
Green flags / lights don't signal the actual restart - they simply indicate that the restart can happen. The actual point of the restart is set by the race leader - when the leader goes, all the others can commence racing again (broadly speaking).
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