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Old 18 Oct 2012, 06:53 (Ref:3153704)   #1
Asa
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Asa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Susie Wolff/women competing in motorsport (Merged)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19981625

Susie Wolff (nee Stoddart)'s test was to familiarise her with driving an F1 car - she has spent several sessions in the team's simulator preparing for it. Wolff's driving was restricted to 100km in total because of F1's testing restrictions.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 10:54 (Ref:3153783)   #2
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19981625

Susie Wolff (nee Stoddart)'s test was to familiarise her with driving an F1 car - she has spent several sessions in the team's simulator preparing for it. Wolff's driving was restricted to 100km in total because of F1's testing restrictions.
Well her husband owns part of the team so I guess that's fair enough.

I do wonder though, where this is all going? Km towards a Superlicense perhaps?

I'd be delighted to see females competing in F1 but I'd rather they'd won a motor race or two first. I can think of at least one contender working her way up, so I wonder how this will all pan out?
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 11:07 (Ref:3153788)   #3
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i'm split on these sorts of things. on the one hand, i think it's good that women taking part in very high level activities in motorsport is publicised, to show young girls that it IS possible and they're perfectly entitled to aspire to the same things as the male competitors and workers.

on the other hand i think it's almost negative to be making a special case of high achieving women (however they've got there) because it makes it seem special and amazing that a woman dares to or can even manage to haul herself up to compete with a man. and that's the wrong impression to be giving everyone, men and women.

i don't really care about how or why she's doing the work in the car - all of everything in life is about who you know. especially employment, and even more especially motorsport. but it's still pretty cool when a driver of any gender or race gets to achieve one of their lifes ambitions. so congratulations to her in that respect.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 11:18 (Ref:3153794)   #4
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Personally, i think if a girl came along that blew the doors off her competitors (not a euphemism) through the junior ranks and arrived on the scene in F1 and was truly competitive, the gender issue would soon evaporate.

Trouble is, the more merely 'competent' girls you shove in F1 cars, the more people are going to point out the differences between men and women.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 12:12 (Ref:3153823)   #5
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Personally, i think if a girl came along that blew the doors off her competitors (not a euphemism) through the junior ranks and arrived on the scene in F1 and was truly competitive, the gender issue would soon evaporate.

Trouble is, the more merely 'competent' girls you shove in F1 cars, the more people are going to point out the differences between men and women.
Desire Wilson who won an Aurora F1 race, was that good, sadly the barriers did not evaporate!
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 12:23 (Ref:3153829)   #6
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Desire Wilson who won an Aurora F1 race, was that good, sadly the barriers did not evaporate!
Different world now. I await a mandated requirement for the number of female drivers to be included in professional racing series ...

On the other hand ... is it as much a case of having the required budget to bid to do the work? Or maybe in some cases the right contacts?
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 12:43 (Ref:3153840)   #7
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Different world now. I await a mandated requirement for the number of female drivers to be included in professional racing series ...

On the other hand ... is it as much a case of having the required budget to bid to do the work? Or maybe in some cases marrying the right contact?
fixed that for you
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 13:15 (Ref:3153859)   #8
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fixed that for you
Yes, in this case, but I assume that marriage may not be absolutely necessary to obtain the same result.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 13:21 (Ref:3153865)   #9
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dam shes hot, but will she be quick enough? no..
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 13:58 (Ref:3153874)   #10
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Different world now. I await a mandated requirement for the number of female drivers to be included in professional racing series ...

On the other hand ... is it as much a case of having the required budget to bid to do the work? Or maybe in some cases the right contacts?
Well, Simona De Silvestro won a few races in Formula Atlantic, as did Bia Figuereido (Ana Beatriz) in Indy Lights. Then, they both progressed to IndyCar where they have gotten into reasonably priced but not necessarily reasonably paced cars. There was a rumor a while ago of De Silvestro having scored a Sauber F1 test. What has become of that? She always has seemed to drive much better on road circuits than on ovals so she probably would be a good addition to a road course centric series.

Ellen Lohr's post-DTM career seemed rather like that of a journeywoman, as most drivers careers do. She would have deserved a lot of better rides after DTM but the impression she made on the sport has been strong enough for the teams in the series to keep hiring women to drive one of their cars. I wonder if BMW will join in on this next year.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 15:56 (Ref:3153908)   #11
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The fact that someone like Susie can always buy her way in thanks to daddy or hubby, I mean great for her to drive an F1 car, but it doesn't do anything for me or just blows me away in wonderment. Clearly she is not going to get a race drive in F1, ever.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 16:11 (Ref:3153913)   #12
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I've never really looked to sports people for attractiveness, because that's really secondary to why I'm watching them in the first place. If they have a distinct personality then I like that, but I can't say I've ever gotten much of an impression from Susie.

As long as people remember why she's doing the test - because she's connected to shedloads of money - there's no issue. Susie, Maria de Villota, Rodolfo Gonzalez, Jan Charouz, Fairuz Fauzy, none of them were ever F1 material but one way or another they paid for their tests (and probably had a good time). I know many people want to see a female F1 pilot but a back of the grid DTM driver is just never going to cut it.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 16:15 (Ref:3153915)   #13
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I wonder if BMW will join in on this next year.
They won't. Marquardt hasn't made any indication that points towards a female BMW driver for next year.

Regarding Wolff, I can only shake my head in disapproval. Her performance in seven (!) years of competing in DTM doesn't even justify this short, promotional test. But being married to a shareholder of a F1 team surely helps. By the way, doesn't that tell a great message to all little girls, who aspire to do something in auto racing? "Just marry someone, who own shares in a F1 team. The rest will come from itself." As I'm reminded of Giovanna Amati (Who once had an affair with Flavio Briatore), didn't she have a test drive with Benetton, before or after her tenure with Brabham?
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 16:23 (Ref:3153917)   #14
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i'm split on these sorts of things. on the one hand, i think it's good that women taking part in very high level activities in motorsport is publicised, to show young girls that it IS possible and they're perfectly entitled to aspire to the same things as the male competitors and workers.

on the other hand i think it's almost negative to be making a special case of high achieving women (however they've got there) because it makes it seem special and amazing that a woman dares to or can even manage to haul herself up to compete with a man. and that's the wrong impression to be giving everyone, men and women.

i don't really care about how or why she's doing the work in the car - all of everything in life is about who you know. especially employment, and even more especially motorsport. but it's still pretty cool when a driver of any gender or race gets to achieve one of their lifes ambitions. so congratulations to her in that respect.
I find it funny that the politically correct crowd out there in society on one hand mouths that we are a sexless society where everyone is completely equal, yet they are the most obsessed with making a big drama pointing out all of the differences between sexes.

In my politically incorrect opinion, men and women are built differently, for different reasons. We are not the same and never will be. Other than a small percentile of each sex, we don't act the same, communicate the same, think the same or have similar physical characteristics. I don't believe on the whole that there will ever be as many women interested in motorsports, cars or driving, compared to men. Nor are there many women who could ever reach the fitness and strength required to be winners in motorsport.

So the numbers are never going to be there when it comes to motorsport, but I think everyone should compete on their own merits and abilities, regardless of sex, race, physical issues, etc.

All this stuff about how we should put Susie on a pedestal for girls so that girls can aspire to have daddy or hubby to write a big check so they can flog around at the back of the DTM field, is nonsense. "Yes girls, you too can get your team owner husband to get you an F1 test drive. All it takes is a little bit of manipulation and drama and marrying the right rich guy and it will all be yours as well."

So let women out there if they want to compete and make it happen, let em have it without offering special considerations, programs, idols or to try to drive women to do things just because men do them, as though that makes it all equal.

You know one driver I do appreciate is Kat Legge. She didn't make a big drama about her sex, she went out there and knocked on doors and then did the best she could with the opportunities she developed. She didn't splay herself on a car in a bikini for the lads mags or hook onto a man to pay for her ambitions.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 16:26 (Ref:3153918)   #15
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13 seasons

134 races

ZERO wins ever

4 podiums

Clearly F1 material!
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 19:23 (Ref:3153984)   #16
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people open doors for their loved ones any way they can and if you have money that opens a lot of doors. should they feel shame for doing that? if the answer is yes then there are a lot of world champions who should feel a lot of shame. F1 fans should never complain about not liking those that have access to money.

from what i have read Toto Wolff was himself a racer (im guessing he came from money), made a lot of money during the tech bubble, bought part of an F1 team, married a race car driver who has now tested an F1 car. they are living the dream....how are these not the people you want involved one of the most storied F1 teams of all time?

as for being a women, you guys are probably right in that the test wont change a thing for women. but if these two are going to be the face of Williams for the foreseeable future then she will really be in a position to make a real difference for women in motorsports and thats a positive imo.

she's not the only one btw, she wont be the last one and each time someone new comes around there will be less people saying how silly or impossible it is. you see lots of women on TV walking around fully clothed and working in the pitlane these days so its not a stretch for me to imagine more of them behind the wheel in all categories as well.

brilliant stuff if you ask me!
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:18 (Ref:3154020)   #17
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people open doors for their loved ones any way they can and if you have money that opens a lot of doors. should they feel shame for doing that? if the answer is yes then there are a lot of world champions who should feel a lot of shame. F1 fans should never complain about not liking those that have access to money.

from what i have read Toto Wolff was himself a racer (im guessing he came from money), made a lot of money during the tech bubble, bought part of an F1 team, married a race car driver who has now tested an F1 car. they are living the dream....how are these not the people you want involved one of the most storied F1 teams of all time?

as for being a women, you guys are probably right in that the test wont change a thing for women. but if these two are going to be the face of Williams for the foreseeable future then she will really be in a position to make a real difference for women in motorsports and thats a positive imo.

she's not the only one btw, she wont be the last one and each time someone new comes around there will be less people saying how silly or impossible it is. you see lots of women on TV walking around fully clothed and working in the pitlane these days so its not a stretch for me to imagine more of them behind the wheel in all categories as well.

brilliant stuff if you ask me!
Very well put sir!
If the Wolffs were the next owners of Williams then Susie would be in a great place to help female drivers as much as they could be helped. Mercedes love her, so she'd have some sway with them to maybe put some money into some sort of driver scheme, along with Williams, and of course Toto.

Regardless of gender, I think pay drivers get an awful amount of stick for what is essentially 'living the dream', from people who know that if they had the money they'd do it too.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:24 (Ref:3154021)   #18
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Regardless of gender, I think pay drivers get an awful amount of stick for what is essentially 'living the dream', from people who know that if they had the money they'd do it too.
Ha Ha that's a fair point.

Personally though, if I just wanted to watch a load of rich and privileged drivers "living the dream" I'd go to the Goodwood Revival or virtually any FIA GT race.

This is Formula One we're talking about, it really does have to be based on talent, even if it's just rich or well backed talent.....the very thought of drivers who have never won a race taking part is appalling.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:32 (Ref:3154028)   #19
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Ha Ha that's a fair point.

Personally though, if I just wanted to watch a load of rich and privileged drivers "living the dream" I'd go to the Goodwood Revival or virtually any FIA GT race.

This is Formula One we're talking about, it really does have to be based on talent, even if it's just rich or well backed talent.....the very thought of drivers who have never won a race taking part is appalling.
Yes that is true, as long as the money is backed up by some talent then there's no problem.
It just annoys me when people critisise (sp? oh dear I've forgotten how to spell) Karthikeyan for example (and it is always him) for being '****' and 'the worst driver in F1' and 'keeping xxx driver out of a seat'... so what?
Narain isn't ****, he does have talent. He may be the worst driver in F1 right now, but that's hardly an insult when you think about it. Someone has to be the worst, no matter which 24 drivers were racing one of them would be the worst.
As for keeping whoever out of a drive, unless they got fired and then Narain took their seat he isn't actually denying anyone a drive. He got offered the drive and said what anyone would say: "YES!"
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:36 (Ref:3154030)   #20
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13 seasons

134 races

ZERO wins ever

4 podiums

Clearly F1 material!
Incidently, how does that compare to Ma Qing Hua (whom HRT are rumoured to be considering for next year)?
Just wondered because no-one seemed to kick up any sort of fuss when they gave him a couple of GP weekend practice sessions.
Actual proper practice sessions, not some mess about.
Was it because his was for HRT and her's is for Williams?
Or was it because he's a man and Wolff's a woman?
Or maybe some other reason entirely...
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:39 (Ref:3154034)   #21
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Ma Qing Hua was Chinese 1600cc Touring Car Champion last year and won 4 races! Not exactly GP2 champ but at least he won races!
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:46 (Ref:3154039)   #22
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Incidently, how does that compare to Ma Qing Hua (whom HRT are rumoured to be considering for next year)?
Just wondered because no-one seemed to kick up any sort of fuss when they gave him a couple of GP weekend practice sessions.
Actual proper practice sessions, not some mess about.
Was it because his was for HRT and her's is for Williams?
Or was it because he's a man and Wolff's a woman?
Or maybe some other reason entirely...
Personally speaking, it is so preposterous that he has been granted a superlicence I just wouldn't be bothered to waste my time commenting.

It's not a gender issue either, it's a Williams we are talking about here, not an HRT who actually need the money, so yes, for me, that makes all the difference.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:47 (Ref:3154040)   #23
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Ma Qing Hua was Chinese 1600cc Touring Car Champion last year and won 4 races! Not exactly GP2 champ but at least he won races!
Really? Fair enough, I must've completely blanked that about him, my bad.
So, anyone caught any Chinese 1600cc Touring Cars recently?
Quite a strange route to F1, even stranger than Petrov starting out racing Ladas
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 20:52 (Ref:3154047)   #24
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A1GP
to F3000
to F3
to Aussie Racing Cars
to Chinese Touring Cars

It's like an upside down career until F1!

Good luck to him though.
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Old 18 Oct 2012, 21:00 (Ref:3154054)   #25
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A1GP
to F3000
to F3
to Aussie Racing Cars
to Chinese Touring Cars

It's like an upside down career until F1!

Good luck to him though.
I remember his A1GP days because the team gave him the name Martin as it was close to Ma Qing, just struck me all those years ago as quite amusing.
Only raced once or twice though IIRC, Ho-Pin Tung had the seat for the majority of races.
His route is upside down, but it's good to see someone not just following the F3-->GP3-->FR3.5-->GP2 ladder.

He actually didn't do too badly in Monza. He was a second and a half off Super Pedro, but whereas de la Rosa had a low downforce set-up, Ma had a very high downforce set-up.

Last edited by Hawkwood; 18 Oct 2012 at 21:00. Reason: dodgy spelling (again) :(
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