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Old 12 Oct 2011, 18:23 (Ref:2970050)   #1
aland
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aland should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
upgrading to experienced

upgrading from track to experienced

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as this forum has such a wealth of knowlege and experience I thought I'd ask for opinions

I have been at track grade for over 2 years now and at the start of the season I tried flagging to get the required signatures, I have a major problem, I am dyslexic and it affects my handwriting badly so much so that writing the number 8 is very problematic, this waving a flag in the usual figure of 8 is tough in the calm but near as dammit impossible in the wind so I have basically given up on flagging, I know what the flags mean etc but I just cant wave one of the blooming things. I partially gave up getting signatures but now I feel this isnt very fair as fellow marshals and post chiefs have said i am a good incident marshal and a lot of them are poor at flagging anyway. Is there any way that the MSA might look upon my disability favorably and allow me to upgrade without the flagging sigs. I never want to be a post cheif anyway due to the handwriting issue but i would like to make it to IO... TIA
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Old 12 Oct 2011, 18:56 (Ref:2970072)   #2
Nighthawk
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Nighthawk has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
I am a XPC and i am Dyslexic.. It never stopped me.. we find ways of getting round this problem..
I dont think the fact you say you have a problem with flag waving will have any effect on upgrading..again you will find a solution to flags if Required...
Having a good understanding of flag meanings helps...
My advice is go for upgrade dont let these little hiccups get in your way
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Old 12 Oct 2011, 19:29 (Ref:2970093)   #3
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It's your club that controls the upgrade, (it's only administerd by the MSA) so I'd say the SMMC/Knockhill guys should know you well enough to decide about an exemption due to your disability.
Additionally MSA is supposed to make allowances for disabilities when it comes to marshalling roles.
Speak to your local grading officer in the first instance.
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Old 12 Oct 2011, 19:36 (Ref:2970095)   #4
Chris Hobson
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Chris Hobson should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
If any marshal has a genuine medical problem that prevents them from performing any of the usual duties all they have to do is to state this when they apply for their upgrade. The MSA will then look at each case on an individual basis.

So if you cannot physically wave a flag do all the days at incident then, when you apply for your end of grade assessment tell the chief marshal and examining post chief, also please make sure you put full details in with your PRC

Any other questions please give me a call
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Old 13 Oct 2011, 09:54 (Ref:2970375)   #5
aland
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aland should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
thanks Chris, will speak to the gaffer (will be next season now), it is annoying though but I have tried flagging a few times now and with putting so much effort in it blooming hurts, think i am best suited to wading about in the mud shoving errant cars, plus I can weild a broom better than the missus
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Old 13 Oct 2011, 12:09 (Ref:2970454)   #6
NewYankee01
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Originally Posted by aland View Post
thanks Chris, will speak to the gaffer (will be next season now), it is annoying though but I have tried flagging a few times now and with putting so much effort in it blooming hurts, think i am best suited to wading about in the mud shoving errant cars, plus I can weild a broom better than the missus
are you one of those flaggers that waves the flags round at 100mph! i dont know what cars you like to play with but they must be as light as a feather, flagging to me is less strenuous on the old arms and body than pushing 500kg+ race cars... but yeah its better "trying" flags and doing FULL days than doing what some people do and do the bare minimum or get a pc on friendly terms to sign them off as flags when they shouldnt
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Old 13 Oct 2011, 12:17 (Ref:2970460)   #7
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are you one of those flaggers that waves the flags round at 100mph!
Interesting observation from one who advocated 'hanging off the fencing' in order to wave flags... I think the poster was quite clear in explaining that it was the motion that ws the problem, not how physically strenuous it was.
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Old 13 Oct 2011, 15:22 (Ref:2970550)   #8
Mark Mitchell
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Mark Mitchell should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMark Mitchell should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMark Mitchell should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMark Mitchell should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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or get a pc on friendly terms to sign them off as flags when they shouldnt
Not on my post they won't! Everything above board!
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Old 13 Oct 2011, 15:38 (Ref:2970558)   #9
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Aland - I wouldn't give up flagging ambitions just because of fear of the 'figure-of-8'.
Having spent many years attempting to help aspirant flag marshals to achieve their aims I have met many who have suffered from that fear but not many who it has not been possible to help.

Try the following -

Lesson 1
Stand upright with arms by your side.
Move the forearm of your preferred flagging arm up so that it is horizontal in front of you, palm downwards with the hand out straight.
Clench the fist as if holding a flag pole.
Rotate the wrist until the thumb is vertical, keeping the forearm horizontal, then rotate the wrist back to its starting position.
Keep repeating this action at a gentle pace - with luck you should find that you can rotate the wrist through an angle of about 150 degrees.
Once you are comfortable doing this relax the wrist so that the hand takes a natural postion as you continue rotating the wrist backwards and forwards.
With luck you should see that your thumbnail is tracing a rough horizontal figure-of-8 path.
Here endeth the first lesson - and you have not even touched a flag yet.

Lesson 2
The main secret to waving a flag successfully is to hold it correctly.
Every flag I have ever used has had a natural balance point about which it is easiest to use the flag - It is definately not are the end of the flag pole as so many flag wavers seem to think.
Pick up a flag - ideally one that is not too heavy or too big and hold it roughy where the flag-pole meets the flag.
Now repeat lesson one whilst holding the flag.
With luck you should find that the flag is being waved in an approximation to a figure-of-8. If not then adjust the position of holding the flag until you get the hang of it.

After that it's just a question of practice, practice, practice.

Make yourself a flag, go out in the garden a try it - Ok so the neigbours might think you look a prat, but they probably think that already having seen you leave home at silly o'clock on a weekend wearing Guantanamo style attire.

I hope this has been useful - its probably easier to show someone than it is to describe!

Remember the secret is 'where you hold it and how you move it' - ooh matron
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Old 13 Oct 2011, 22:12 (Ref:2970748)   #10
Richard Duvall
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Originally Posted by aland View Post
I am dyslexic and it affects my handwriting badly so much so that writing the number 8 is very problematic, this waving a flag in the usual figure of 8 is tough in the calm but near as dammit impossible in the wind
Flag waving isn't rocket science and whilst the figure 8 method is preferred there are many ways to generate movement in a flag. In some windy conditions it is best to avoid the standard figure 8 and just move the flag up and down and let the wind wave it for you. If the concept of a figure 8 is a problem to you with your dislexia, experiment and find the best way for YOU to wave a flag!
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Old 14 Oct 2011, 07:52 (Ref:2970886)   #11
juliet
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juliet should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
[QUOTE/]Ok so the neigbours might think you look a prat, but they probably think that already having seen you leave home at silly o'clock on a weekend wearing Guantanamo style attire.[/QUOTE]


I certainly got a few strange looks when my brother wouldnt let me back into the flat last weekend!
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Old 14 Oct 2011, 11:03 (Ref:2971006)   #12
Norbert
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Norbert should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
[/QUOTE] [this waving a flag in the usual figure of 8 is tough in the calm but near as dammit impossible in the wind so I have basically given up on flagging, [/QUOTE]

As long as the flag can been seen to be waved (as opposed to stationery), this can be done in an up and down motion, the 'normal' figure of 8 motion does not have to apply.
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