Brock

[Crash Test]

What do you think made Peter Brock the legend he is today?

What it superior skill?
Superior cars?
Superior funds?
Luck?
Making the right decisions at the right time?
His 'guru'?
All of the above?

[Ray Bell]

Being the man to beat at Bathurst, also being personable and promotable. In Melbourne, his record in the 500 at Sandown was another attraction, and the deals are done in Melbourne.

[Emfa]

Crash, I would have said "All of the Above" if you hadn't put in that BS about the guru!

Generally though, I think he was an all-round package. Initially it was probably his skill and daring that got him noticed, then for a long time he had the weight of HDT behind him so he managed to go from strength to strength. Like they say: "Success breeds success."

[Ray Bell]

At times he also carried the HDT. Some of his performances in the late seventies were staggeringly good.

[marcus]

I think brocky had everything.

he was fast (and probably still would be) he had amazing charisma (no..not the mitzubishi thingy )
and the average punter felt that they had something in common with him by being a bit oif a battler.

obviously everyone knows how peter started off on a farm and had to make do with what was around him and managed to do very well for himself.

at first i liked brocky because he was winning..but then i looked deeper and saw a man that i came to admire for not only his racing exploits ..but his off track stuff as well....got to meet him once at Winton fot a ST meeting when he was in the Volvo..like the biggest fool ..all i said was .."G'day brocky"
he replied "Hello , are you enjoying the racing ?"
"Yes"
with that he signed a poster and I was bundled out of the way by the next autograph seeker

but he must have signed 500 posters that day and right down to the last one he was smiling and only to happy to talk to people..just the way i found Craig lowndes last year when i managed to walk straight into him

Brocky was and always will be a Legend..the country loved him..to this day I am still trying to pin point what exactly it is about him that makes him so special...I dont have a clue ..but he is one heck of a Human being.

[philneast]

The answer: Allan Moffat

Every hero needs a villain, Allan was perfect. A foreigner and unfortunately very intense.

He did win a lot of fans with his intensity, they appreciated how hard he was working. One of his favourite quotes " the harder you work the luckier you get" sums up the man.

[Ray Bell]

Moffat provided the villainry to help a few along, Pete Geoghegan, Bob Jane and more. His most intense rivalries were with Jim McKeown, Jane and John Harvey, who spent much of one race at Oran Park moving to the left as he entered the straight and waving Moff past, well knowing he was down about fifty horsepower and didn't stand a chance!

[Accee]

Brocky had everything it takes,
Talent,
Good Cars,
Marketable personality,
and got out while he was still a hero!!

[Crash Test]

Bringing back the topic of his guru for a second, () that whole affair with leaving Holden for such a period of time really didn't seem to have any effect on how people view him today. Was the power of Brock greater than that of Holden, and what was the general feeling towards Brock during the wilderness years from 87 through to the early 90s??

Put it this way, if I started fitting plastic boxes of alfoil, cyrstals and wax to cars, and come out with whacko claims that could not be proven, I would get wrapped up in a straight jacket and taken far far away to catch butterflies in my new net...

[RaceTime]

Brocks popularity was Brocks - not Holdens. Sure he lost s few fans when he went to the Sierra for a while (sound a bit like Lowndes here???) but his popularity never diminished one bit.
And not that many people really said too much when Moffat drove the Commodore at Spa (??) did they?

[Crash Test]

Moffat was probably in a bit of a differnt ship before he started driving with Brock in the au. and international enduros. Remember he had been driving RX7s for a number of years, so he probably wouldn't have been seen to be defecting from Ford.

Sorry to be stuck on the guru () but when was the last time Dr Eric was seen at a race track?

[Ray Bell]

Dowker? Wouldn't know him from a bar of soap...

Brock came up against and trounced Moffat at Bathurst in 1972, that race was the one that put the stamp of 'great' on him, though 1973 and several others should have done so... it was the one where he beat Moffat, however.

The real Brock/Moffat tussle was one race only, when it boils down to it, and it was with Moffat in his second string Dealer Team car... remember that one, Sandown 500, 1980?

Will Hagon, calling it on television, as Brock passed Moffat down the esses the last lap (which he didn't have to do, Moffat was several laps down and had given notice that going by would be made very difficult over several laps...) he ranged round the outside and simply went past him... Hagon: "Well, I never, that Peter Brock should do that on the last lap!"

He was right, but so was Brock.

[DAVID PATERSON]

PB never liked the nickname "Peter Perfect", but it fitted him well. He had it all, he was the hero, the good guy, enormously talented, to the point of making it look easy. On top of this, he was the star driver for the works team of THE manufacturer most committed to Australian racing. In addition, he had the charisma, the Mr Nice Guy personality, the looks and all the success. As was stated earlier, every hero needs a villain, and whether he liked it or not, that role fell to Allan Moffat.

Moff, never was one to actively seek fame or public adoration, he spoke his mind and if he thought you were a fool, he would say so. Of course, this didn't get him far with the Aussie fans. Brocky however, was always willing to meet and greet the fans and be friendly to all even to the point of telling people what they want to hear, whether he believed it or not.

When Johnson usurped Moffat in the early '80s as the Ford hero and more importantly, Brock's arch rival, he became a hybrid of the two. The laid back, down to earth, friendliness and approachability of Brock, with the determination, single mindedness and uncompromising candour of Moffat.

[Airhead]

David a very interesting synposis.

As others have stated, Moffat was intense plus he was really the only Ford stalwart who had a hope of winning through the seventies and early eighties. That made a fan out of me.

Brock was for me the villian. Most money, best team, most supporters etc etc. Notice I didn't say best car

Johnson was a bit of an enigma. I didn't like him much till I met him face to face. Then the strength of his down home personality won me over I guess. But he certainly usurped Moffat as Fords number one. As Lowndes will now do to Seton, mores the pity.

[Ray Bell]

I would hardly say Brock had the best team and most money a lot of that time. The HDT spread themselves a bit, while Moffat principally had just his own effort to support, with some big wheels in Ford helping out more than just significantly.

Don't think so? Okay, remember when John Goss drove the Laurie O'Neil Porsche at Oran Park (c. 1973)?

At that time Ford told Goss that if he wanted to continue to receive Ford help, he should race a Ford Sports Sedan. Goss asked for a body to build the car into, they gave him one of the special shells that were awaiting such needs at Broadmeadow.

Moffat went off his brain, apparently. He subsequently rolled his car at Phillip Id and wanted that last shell for the rebuild... seems these were built with a lot of wafer-thin panels especially for him and a select few others. Moff didn't miss out on much!

I don't think those HDT days saw extraordinary preparation, either, under Harry. Things were different under Sheppard, but by that time Moffat was becoming a spent force.

But beyond all else, it was his knack for pushing cars out of the way that won him the villain title. He did it so often early on that Pete Geoghegan fixed him up big time to ensure he stayed clear of him in future. Just ask Jim McKeown what it was like to race against Moffat, or read the report on the ATCC round at Mallala... was that 1969?

And Bob Jane got biffed twice in two different cars at the Farm one day, lectured Moffat that night... still it happened again and again.

Brock stayed clear of this stuff.

[Airhead]

Well Ray I must say I have never heard this line of argument before. That is:

1. Moffat was rolling in factory backing through the years after say 1974.
2. Brock was doing it tough in the semi works HDT.
3. Moffat won by punting people off.

Very interesting.

[Ray Bell]

Brock wasn't in the semi-works HDT from Dec 74 to Jan 78, and Moffat always had some factory backing, even when the cars were carrying livery from Brut and other sponsors.

You don't recall his biffing cars out of the way? Some classics with him and Jane at Warwick Farm, stewards meeting late into the night, that sort of thing... more than once at Calder, too.

Then 77 and 78 Moff had plenty of backing, drifted away after that and went to Mazdas when, 1981? Brock then had the upper hand, but Moffat was really out of the running by then.

[Airhead]

Originally posted by Ray Bell

Then 77 and 78 Moff had plenty of backing, drifted away after that and went to Mazdas when, 1981? Brock then had the upper hand, but Moffat was really out of the running by then.

Yes and no Ray,

Didn't Moffat nearly win the Australian Touring Car Championship in that Mazda? Didn't he nearly win Bathurst in the same car. Remember all the peripheral port debacle. I thought that was because the car was a contender and the Holden and Ford crowd were worried.

I was too yougn for Warwick Farm and Bob Jane, although I have bought tyres off the guy.

[DAVID PATERSON]

I bought a poster off Bob Jane, he was at the motor show one year, with a large collection of posters of all his race cars. I chatted to him for a while, about Historic Touring cars of course, he was very interested in my Motorsport Qld life member's shirt and asked me all about that. Then I bought a poster of his HQ Monaro and he signed it for me. Way Cool!

[Ray Bell]

Moffat dropped back in the Fords after 78, but came on strong again in the Mazdas, yes, you're right there. My thrust was about the Falcons, after all he still had one at Bathurst just a couple of years ago, didn't he... Chris Economaki (sp?) bleating about the carburettor instead of injection... and he had Sierras, but didn't run them seriously through the year.

[Airhead]

Yes the Vitamin fed car. My motor doesn't care if it's fuel comes from a Holley four barrell or fuel injection. Something like that.

He did well in the Sierra at Bathurst though, giving it a real shake for a couple of years with another all time fav. of mine - the Late Greg Hansford. The bikies friend. He (Moffat)had given away the driving by then of cause.

At the risk of highjacking the thread, my all time villian was Alan Grice. Then he joined the Nationals in Qld. Some guys are just rotten to the core.

[Alan Jones]

I grew up in a Ford loving familyand as a kid , never really hated Brock till I think I saw him use more than 1 car to win at Bathurst. Does my memory serve me correctly or do I need to see a doctor? Please, someone ferfresh my memory

[Crash Test]

Remember the Sierra days were Eggenberger cars, often with Ruddi calling the shots.

The V8 went ok for a once a year warrior, a pair of top 10s really wasn't too bad an effort.

[Ray Bell]

The opposition and outcry over Brock and Perkins taking over the Brock/Harvey car was amazing. Many drivers cross-entered in their two team cars so the lead drivers could take over the second car should the need arise... it just never arose with a front-runner before that race in 1981.. think it was 1981, anyway.

Moffat, in fact, was going to do it in 1977, so that he and Bond could both win the race, just swap their drives part way through the race...

In some cases, it was almost the whole reason for running the second car in a team.

[Alan Jones]

Thanks Ray, your Knowledge is most appreciated