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Old 6 Jul 2019, 06:39 (Ref:3916089)   #1
one five five
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2020 Liqui-Moly Bathurst 12 Hour (Jan 31 - Feb 2)

Back to a three day program in 2020 from a one-off four day program in 2019. Hopefully this will plug some of the empty gaps, particularly on the Saturday

Talk on socials that the Invitation class has been canned for 2020...... Does this mean a further move towards ultimately a GT3 only race which will please some and dis enchant others further?

Will the race being a part of the IGTC attract good numbers of overseas entries?

Will there be increase in the number of local GT3 cars entered, as they have dropped in recent years?

Will GT4 numbers increase assuming they are included as a class? What about the Porsche Cup Car class?

Will the new GT2 class from SRO feature in the race?

Will a TCR class feature, particularly if ARG are unsuccessful in their bid for the fifth Bathurst event slot?

What support events? Can we have Improved Production back please?
A Super2 round?

Will the crowds continue to grow?

Plenty to talk about
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Old 6 Jul 2019, 09:01 (Ref:3916102)   #2
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well already got my camp site booked and tickets
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Old 8 Jul 2019, 06:39 (Ref:3916453)   #3
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Can’t say a Super2 round is that motivating.

Keep FFord, combined sedans, Group S and maybe throw in TCR.
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Old 18 Jul 2019, 23:29 (Ref:3918411)   #4
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one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridone five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
The 2019 winner has been bought by Paul Tressider, but looks like it won't be seen at the 12hr next year.

Camp site sales seem to be very strong for next year at this early stage
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Old 7 Aug 2019, 23:25 (Ref:3921873)   #5
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
And the slide continues

https://www.speedcafe.com/2019/08/08...hurst-12-hour/
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Old 8 Aug 2019, 10:12 (Ref:3921934)   #6
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That's SRO gaining power and enforcing their rules.
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Old 8 Aug 2019, 12:27 (Ref:3921943)   #7
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Struggle to see how the pit stop rules help the event, it’s has lost so much in one rule change.
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Old 8 Aug 2019, 21:30 (Ref:3921997)   #8
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Struggle to see how the pit stop rules help the event, it’s has lost so much in one rule change.
The SRO rationale for the minimum pit stop times is to prevent costly and unbalancing investment in expensive kit. I am willing to buy that.

The 65-min stints I don’t get. It removes all strategy from the race. Maybe that’s the point.
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Old 9 Aug 2019, 04:26 (Ref:3922023)   #9
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The SRO rationale for the minimum pit stop times is to prevent costly and unbalancing investment in expensive kit. I am willing to buy that..
Might as well set a minimum lap time as well, so that you can't buy your way to the front with a better car or driver.
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Old 9 Aug 2019, 07:59 (Ref:3922042)   #10
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one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridone five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
We're these rule changes required by SRO to stay as part of the IGTC?
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Old 9 Aug 2019, 08:49 (Ref:3922046)   #11
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Could be. Judging from the statement in the linked article, it was either "suggested" or mandatory for the event from SRO - apparently all of the changes have been used at other SRO events.

Tbh the 4 minute stop feels OTT until you think it through and with so many SC periods in previous years, its likely that competitors will be able to deal with that one.

The stint length restriction and reducing a driver's maximum time to 2 hours 10 minutes instead of the traditntal 2 hours 30 minutes seems strange and commentating the "Joker" pit stops and who has and hasn't taken one in the relevant half of the race won't be the work of a moment.
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Old 9 Aug 2019, 08:53 (Ref:3922047)   #12
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They were in use at the Spa 24 hours too.
* max stint length
* min pit stop time
* 1 mandatory 'technical' stop: you're not obliged to do something technical, just put the car in the pits for 5 minutes and you're OK. (Grasser did that at Spa)

Spa is also part of the IGTC, so that may be the reason. Let's see what happens at Suzuka later this year?

SRO also has the much hated Safety-Car-after-Full-Course-Yellow-procedure which they use in all of there races (Sprint and endurance) in Europe.
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Old 9 Aug 2019, 17:07 (Ref:3922107)   #13
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Might as well set a minimum lap time as well, so that you can't buy your way to the front with a better car or driver.
BOP and driver ratings take care of that.

These are the exact same rules SRO uses in Blancpain. They were also in force for the Laguna Seca 8 Hours.

I get the minimum pits stops. It stops teams investing hundreds of thousands of [currency] in fancy gear to speed up refueling. This is in keeping with SRO's strong and correct policy of managing costs for the customers on whom their business depends. VLN/N24 does the same thing for the same reason.

It's the stint length stuff which sucks because stint and pitstop strategy is such a core part of endurance racing. They do it (and the FCY->SC idiocy) simply to ensure that the field stays bunched and they can spend the next year after the race posting clips of amazing last-10 min battles and boasting about how exciting the racing is, even it's almost entirely fake.
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Old 10 Aug 2019, 14:43 (Ref:3922192)   #14
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one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridone five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
IGTC has been around for a few years and the B12 hasn't had these sorts of rules forced upon it....why does it have to fall in line with the others in 2020?


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BOP and driver ratings take care of that.

These are the exact same rules SRO uses in Blancpain. They were also in force for the Laguna Seca 8 Hours.

I get the minimum pits stops. It stops teams investing hundreds of thousands of [currency] in fancy gear to speed up refueling. This is in keeping with SRO's strong and correct policy of managing costs for the customers on whom their business depends. VLN/N24 does the same thing for the same reason.

It's the stint length stuff which sucks because stint and pitstop strategy is such a core part of endurance racing. They do it (and the FCY->SC idiocy) simply to ensure that the field stays bunched and they can spend the next year after the race posting clips of amazing last-10 min battles and boasting about how exciting the racing is, even it's almost entirely fake.
So they don't want teams spending money on pit gear..... but they seem OK with GT3 costs spiralling year on year when it comes to the actual cars?
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Old 10 Aug 2019, 16:26 (Ref:3922202)   #15
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The SRO rationale for the minimum pit stop times is to prevent costly and unbalancing investment in expensive kit. I am willing to buy that.

The 65-min stints I don’t get. It removes all strategy from the race. Maybe that’s the point.
The 65 minute stint length is to make it easier to BoP the cars. That way you don't need to take into account the fuel flow rate (in car), the fuel fill rate (from the rig), and the fuel tank size.
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Old 10 Aug 2019, 20:31 (Ref:3922236)   #16
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IGTC has been around for a few years and the B12 hasn't had these sorts of rules forced upon it....why does it have to fall in line with the others in 2020?
Because the IGTC is gradually being established as a de facto world makes championship for GT3s. SRO are very clever here - they start small, build it each year. It started as a few existing races loosely linked together, now it's becoming a proper series, which means setting common rules.

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So they don't want teams spending money on pit gear..... but they seem OK with GT3 costs spiralling year on year when it comes to the actual cars?
I'm sure they are not OK with that, which is why they have GT4 and GT2 waiting to take over if GT3 implodes (which, btw, it shows absolutely no sign of doing despite the rise in the costs of the cars)

But while there is little SRO can do to control the price the manufacturers charge for their cars, they can control the costs of racing them at SRO events. That includes preventing richer teams from causing an expensive arms race on pit equipment which would ultimately drive customers away.
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Old 12 Aug 2019, 04:14 (Ref:3922370)   #17
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They do it (and the FCY->SC idiocy) simply to ensure that the field stays bunched and they can spend the next year after the race posting clips of amazing last-10 min battles and boasting about how exciting the racing is, even it's almost entirely fake.
Not exactly an issue for Bathurst, which already consists of endless safety car restarts and 10 minute shootouts anyways.
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Old 14 Aug 2019, 06:55 (Ref:3922651)   #18
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racer69 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridracer69 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quick pit work has always been an essential element to success in endurance racing, these changes eliminate that element, while the driver time limit rules also take another bit away.

If they are that worried about an arms race with pit equipment, why not mandate what rattle guns must be used by everyone?

Don't compromise the race, racing needs less rules, not more.
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Old 15 Aug 2019, 19:52 (Ref:3922889)   #19
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Not exactly an issue for Bathurst, which already consists of endless safety car restarts and 10 minute shootouts anyways.
Every time I rotated onto blue flag, the SC came out (2018). I think I only used the blue about 5 times.
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Old 19 Aug 2019, 10:35 (Ref:3923376)   #20
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old fart should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridold fart should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
This year a record 312 laps were completed with only 8 safety car periods for a total of 22 laps.
Shows what can occur when drivers do the right thing, respect each other and stay on the black stuff !
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Old 21 Aug 2019, 08:49 (Ref:3923605)   #21
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Changes to pit stop rules and stint lengths for 2020 rescinded: Steady as you go lads - let's run it like we're used to.

Good move I reckon, all felt a bit too contrived - clearly works at some of the races in Europe but not convinced that it would have worked that well for the 12 hour.
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Old 21 Aug 2019, 09:42 (Ref:3923609)   #22
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Good move. Well done to the organisers for this announcement

What does it mean for the future of the 12hr as part of the IGTC though given Anyopenroads comment about about SRO wanting to establish common rules for all IGTC events?
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Old 21 Aug 2019, 09:48 (Ref:3923610)   #23
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Excellent. Now get rid of this garbage for the other races.
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Old 21 Aug 2019, 15:03 (Ref:3923637)   #24
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whew!
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Old 21 Aug 2019, 22:03 (Ref:3923681)   #25
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Good move. Well done to the organisers for this announcement

What does it mean for the future of the 12hr as part of the IGTC though given Anyopenroads comment about about SRO wanting to establish common rules for all IGTC events?
Guess we won't know that for a while but there are sometimes differences in what is accepted in European racing and what is accepted in other parts of the world. Success ballast for drivers for example has been part of a number of different euro series over the years and barely seems to raise an eyebrow but has been rejected in a number of other countries (including here). The IGTC stint time restrictions, pit stop time requirements seem to be rolling on OK in Europe too (at least from what we can see from so far away) but weren't accepted by competitors here (don't know how many of those spoken to were from Europe though but you'd have to think that some were).

Might mean that IGTC may accept that some practices wouldn't be accepted in all markets and tailor the series accordingly, or Bathurst could be considered as a "thought leader" and by not going with the restrictions, convince IGTC that the idea isn't needed to "spice up" the racing and is maybe a step too far.

Good news to not have the contrived restrictions for 2020 and we'll find out about the future later.
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