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Old 21 Oct 2010, 08:43 (Ref:2777815)   #1
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CRS Racing/McLaren tie-up for MP4-12C GT3/GT2

Autosport magazine reports this morning that CRS Racing are set to link up with McLaren to make a racing version of the MP4-12C a reality.

The timeframe looks like being a GT3 coming out for 2012 with the possibility of a debut at the end of next year. A year later the team plans to bring out a GTE and FIA GT2-spec car.

Looks like the two companies are setting up some sort of joint ventures company, with McLaren tester Chris Goodwin heavily involved.

All in all, good news. Just a shame we will have a wait a while for it.

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Old 21 Oct 2010, 09:02 (Ref:2777820)   #2
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FIA GT2? Is that class even around? I'd go for GT3 or GT1, GT3 offers competition like the SLS, the GT1 would offer competition like the GTR.
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Old 21 Oct 2010, 09:14 (Ref:2777827)   #3
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FIA GT2? Is that class even around? I'd go for GT3 or GT1, GT3 offers competition like the SLS, the GT1 would offer competition like the GTR.
The article says the 2013 car will be developed to Le Mans GT Endurance and FIA GT2 rules. So I have no idea.

By 2013 will there even by an FIA GT1 championship! (kidding).
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Old 21 Oct 2010, 09:27 (Ref:2777833)   #4
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FIA GT2? Is that class even around? I'd go for GT3 or GT1, GT3 offers competition like the SLS, the GT1 would offer competition like the GTR.
Same can be said of FIA GT3 and FIA GT1
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Old 21 Oct 2010, 09:52 (Ref:2777843)   #5
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Simple, build a LMGT MP4-12C and then hand it over to a constructor simliar to Matech or Rieter for a GT1 conversion. Couldn't be too hard? Could it?
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Old 21 Oct 2010, 10:05 (Ref:2777851)   #6
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I thinl the reason they are thinking GT2 is the american market and the ALMS where GT2 is the class to be in
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Old 21 Oct 2010, 11:01 (Ref:2777880)   #7
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I thinl the reason they are thinking GT2 is the american market and the ALMS where GT2 is the class to be in
And equally as likely the opportunity to return to Le Mans and compete in the ILMC/LMS with customers. Literally none of which you can do with a GT1 car.

The article says that the production run will be small for the GT2 at first so they aren't exactly going to be churning the things out.



Not sure why it is that people have to try and make an announcement that has nothing to do with GT1, about GT1.
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 03:03 (Ref:2778205)   #8
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Good news about the McLaren. CRS sound like they're up to the task, I cant see Mclaren doing a joint venture with a team that wasnt.

Hopefully we see a works team in ALMS.
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 03:22 (Ref:2778209)   #9
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The simple statement was COMPETITION, not to bring up GT1. I'm not on that 'side of the fence' deal where some like one series better than another. To me racing is racing. But the MP4 makes a good 600HP, not 485HP. I just don't see the point in decreasing HP so much in GT2 class. And FIA GT2 is what was brought up in the original article. Not ALMS.
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 09:02 (Ref:2778304)   #10
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Probably worth stifling the engine a bit if it means you get to compete with rivals such as Ferrari and Porsche. It makes far more commercial sense to compete with road car rivals, and to take part in iconic races, with good racing.

GTE gives you the chance to run in three championships (ILMC/ALMS/LMS) versus just one, so as beastly as a GT1-spec McLaren would sound, it would be a waste.
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 12:00 (Ref:2778369)   #11
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Also if McLaren and CRS have got any ambition to sell customer cars in the future, then GT2/GTE and GT3 would be the way to go over GT1- don't the GT1 rules restrict each manufacturer to a maximum of 4 cars spread over 2 teams?
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 12:15 (Ref:2778378)   #12
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Very true, but then if it's easy to do, it will be done. Matech's GT1 from GT3 seemed relatively painless, after all...
Then there's Aston's DBR/DBRS9 combination.
I suspect it's more expensive to develop a GT2 AND a GT1, against a mild tune GT3 and a wacky racer GT1...
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 13:02 (Ref:2778399)   #13
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I think Ratel would hardly complain if someone showed up with a GT2 to race in GT1 - put the double-decker wing on and off you go... GT1-sized tire seem to be standart in GT2 nowadays anyway...
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 14:44 (Ref:2778427)   #14
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Also if McLaren and CRS have got any ambition to sell customer cars in the future, then GT2/GTE and GT3 would be the way to go over GT1- don't the GT1 rules restrict each manufacturer to a maximum of 4 cars spread over 2 teams?
The long term plan is to have 11 teams, each with different manufacters and 2 cars each.

It makes better sense to develop the car as a GT2, and then if someone does want to GT1, buy and convert two GT2's.

Anyway, based on the road car how competitive do you think the car will be?
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 15:26 (Ref:2778442)   #15
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The simple statement was COMPETITION, not to bring up GT1. I'm not on that 'side of the fence' deal where some like one series better than another. To me racing is racing. But the MP4 makes a good 600HP, not 485HP. I just don't see the point in decreasing HP so much in GT2 class. And FIA GT2 is what was brought up in the original article. Not ALMS.
GTE won't have any such arbitary Bhp limit precisely because a new generation of cars are coming through and the GT1 glass cealing has been removed.

Given manufacturers are talking about 2011 and beyond GTE regulations the performance benchmarks for these cars will be one of the hot talking points
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 22:59 (Ref:2778571)   #16
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So you saying they could potentially be stronger in terms of hp? Wouldn't that be great? I don't see it happening. They'll be on par with LMP2 cars soon. Maybe not through the turns, but if they increase the tire size, and the power output i can't see there being too much of a difference. What do you think? If McLaren do enter competition with a customer car, I would say GTE is their best option. I just hope GTE does open up some. As you said JAG, without GT1 in LeMans any longer there's no reason to keep GT2 at what it is, at least in my mind.
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 23:39 (Ref:2778585)   #17
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GTE won't have any such arbitary Bhp limit precisely because a new generation of cars are coming through and the GT1 glass cealing has been removed.
And been replaced by the new LMP2 ceiling... Just look at ALMS, there still isn't much leeway for making GT2/E faster since they soon run into the LMPC/2-field
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Old 22 Oct 2010, 23:41 (Ref:2778587)   #18
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And been replaced by the new LMP2 ceiling... Just look at ALMS, there still isn't much leeway for making GT2/E faster since they soon run into the LMPC/2-field
That's what I was getting at. Improve them anymore and they'll be what LMP2 is, since LMP2 is being cut back in terms of power. The only thing they can hope for is better cornering. It'll technically be like it is now with GT2 and LMP-C in my opinion.
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Old 23 Oct 2010, 03:35 (Ref:2778664)   #19
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http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-new...g-ar84449.html

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Old 23 Oct 2010, 08:02 (Ref:2778771)   #20
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Close, but the rear wing is too big. I'd take mine in the GULF livery, or the Yellow and Green!
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Old 23 Oct 2010, 17:36 (Ref:2779002)   #21
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And been replaced by the new LMP2 ceiling... Just look at ALMS, there still isn't much leeway for making GT2/E faster since they soon run into the LMPC/2-field
A 2011 P2 will be 300kg lighter than a GTE, have similar power and all the aero benefits of a current prototype.

The Libre car has been off the pace since day one, likewise LMPC's won't be anywhere near P2 pace.
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Old 23 Oct 2010, 17:47 (Ref:2779004)   #22
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So you saying they could potentially be stronger in terms of hp? Wouldn't that be great? I don't see it happening. They'll be on par with LMP2 cars soon. Maybe not through the turns, but if they increase the tire size, and the power output i can't see there being too much of a difference. What do you think? If McLaren do enter competition with a customer car, I would say GTE is their best option. I just hope GTE does open up some. As you said JAG, without GT1 in LeMans any longer there's no reason to keep GT2 at what it is, at least in my mind.
Many of the top GTE cars already put out over 500bhp, only RSR quote anything like a genuine figure at 520bhp.

Aero and low weight will always overcome power but the ACO don't want GTE's re-passing P2's on the Le Mans straights, thats why top speed limiters are being introduced.

As you imply manufacturers will not want to race GTE versions of their cars that produce 150bhp less than the road car so limiters are the way forward.
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Old 23 Oct 2010, 17:55 (Ref:2779008)   #23
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A 2011 P2 will be 300kg lighter than a GTE, have similar power and all the aero benefits of a current prototype.
Look at it this way: The prototype-chassis are built on a budget with privateer teams in mind, whereas the GTEs are factory built race cars developed on a much higer budget. We all know that there is quite a difference between the customer chassis and works-cars from Porsche and Acura in LMP2 (I'm leaving out LMP1 because of the Diesel controversy).
And I think this will negate much of the LMP2s theoretical advantages...
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Old 23 Oct 2010, 21:15 (Ref:2779074)   #24
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Autosport magazine reports this morning that CRS Racing are set to link up with McLaren to make a racing version of the MP4-12C a reality.
Any quotes/comments from CRS in the article? No, don't answer that........I'll assume this is another Watkins scoop along the lines of the Rebellion/Toyota revelation, published before the team is ready to go public regarding their programme.
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Old 23 Oct 2010, 23:01 (Ref:2779107)   #25
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I don't see other sports having such tight control over the press.

IMO the sportscar press needs to be more outspoken on a whole range of issues.

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