A question for AOWR fans

[dubby99]

I was once a big fan of AOWR back in the CART days, i started following the series from 97 to now what is called Champcar. In some ways nothing has really changed from back then when you think about it, only for the fact that they don't race on ovals anymore but i think that will change in a couple of years thats for sure.

I don't mind the IRL only if they stayed an all oval series, but it fustrates me when i hear they are going to a road or street course, like they are loosing a superspeedway (MIS) and adding Detroit (you could never guess that was part of the vision) and hear is the thing it really looks like it's becoming CART all over again.

Sorry the question: if in a couple of years down the road we see IRL adopt more road and street tracks and loose a few more ovals would this make the long term of the IRL's existance and it's vision pointless??

beacause all it doing is evolving to becoming CART again which it was trying to eliminate along with the engine leases and forign drivers racing in the series.

Then again i am not so fanaticaly educated with all the facts relating to the split, i don't know every single detail, but i think i know enough and i would want the 2 series to be 1 as soon as possible.

IMHO the split is just destroying what AOWR should be not what TG and KK want it to be. IMHO

[Dutton]

I wonder whether this would have been better in the CC forum?

********

Indeedy.

I have, however, worked myself into more of a pragmatic mindset. I have given up on the hope of a merger (we have what we have until one collapses): this means I now want both the IRL and CC to embrace road, oval, and street.

That way whenever one or the other goes down, which is an inevitability, we will have the bases covered.

It is a sad state of affairs.

[NAC]

That's about the most sense I have read out of you Dutton and I feel you are on the money.

I personally don't like ovals but having said that feel that we shouldn't loose them all together 3 to 4 for the season would be enough IMO.

Back to your question dubby99. Your question sound to me like another reason to bring on the whole Cart / IRL debate. I don't know if you have noticed but they don't like that around these here parts. IMO it's not going to happen.

[tanalised]

a merger will never happen. Never.
IMO one or both will die, due to lack of interest from "fans"

[tanalised]

Originally Posted by tanalised

a merger will never happen. Never.
IMO one or both will die, due to lack of interest from "fans"

or a lack of interest from sponsers more likely

[Dutton]

At which point NASCAR will probably create their rumoured OW series.

I would watch it, but another brick in the mansion of NASCAR hegemony is ultimately depressing.

[indycool]

IMO, I think true open-wheel fans want "one series," whether it's by one or the other going down the tubes, who's running it, "X" percentage of road courses and ovals or whatever. Hardcores don't want what they don't want regardless...hate TG, hate KK, hate ovals, hate road courses, etc.

[Knowlesy]

If NASCAR could build a good OW series it could only be a good thing.

However, I don't see it coming to that.

I am happy for IRL to have it's mix of road, street and ovals. I think they are getting a good balance.

Champcar will never return to ovals, so IRL is the series to follow. They just need more teams and drivers, but whilst two series exist this won't happen.

[Jonerz]

I noticed in YNHL's website (Yates/Newman/Haas/Lanigan) that they have specification for oval-specific tires (presumably) for the DP01 (as they have no information on the Lola's anymore). This leads me to believe perhaps Milwaukee (though since the IRL planted themselves on CART's post-Indy date it wouldn't feel right going back), Las Vegas, or a non-IRL 1.5 mile-er is in the cards...

Chris

[indycool]

Why wouldn't a website with Yates' participation involved in it have oval spec tires when NASCAR runs ovals?

[Jonerz]

Nope. Because this particular YNHL site was for the open-wheel team.

Chris

[nycuk]

Originally Posted by tanalised

a merger will never happen. Never.
IMO one or both will die, due to lack of interest from "fans"

Or teams. Penske and Ganassi both defected to the IRL, say NHL were to move across as well..?

As more and more road courses appear on the IRL calender it seems likely that CC team may consider the move, if nothing else to take part in the Indy 500, something that their sponsors, as you point out Tanalised, would obviously be very keen to buy into.

[drdisque]

The "vision" has been constantly misconstrued.

What the league was in 1997 was not the Vision.

The vision is merely a stable league where the focal point of the season is the Indy 500. CART was not guaranteeing that and that's why the IRL was created.

Oval/Road Course mix and "accessibility" were not integral parts of the vision. The league was just built as all oval with a focus on low costs at the beginning in order to get it off the ground.

CART had fantastic revenue streams from 1993 to 1998 or so and there's nothing wrong with running your league that way. When CART eventually began to sputter out of control it was because of a general void in leadership at the top and a series of bad business decisions.

[2112]

Everybody has a different view of the "vision".

IMO it was to control CART. Not being able to, a new series is born.

How simple is that?

[The Saint]

Originally Posted by Dutton

I wonder whether this would have been better in the CC forum?

********

Indeedy.

I have, however, worked myself into more of a pragmatic mindset. I have given up on the hope of a merger (we have what we have until one collapses): this means I now want both the IRL and CC to embrace road, oval, and street.

That way whenever one or the other goes down, which is an inevitability, we will have the bases covered.

It is a sad state of affairs.

Tony George and Kevin Kalkhoven have too huge ego's....ego's bigger than Robert Ku-beak-a's nose in fact!

No merger there, champ car will not survive and IRL will probably be the one that carries the American Open wheel racing flag....

[Purist]

I'd have to lean toward Tony George wanting control. After all, no other CART race had any realistic chance of eclipsing the Indy 500.

There is, however, something to be said for not primarily relying on one event. Obviously, the more strong races you have the better shape the series will be in.

Regardless of what the "vision" is/was, one of the major selling points for CART was definitely the mix of ovals, road courses, and street circuits. Oh well, could we just lock TG and KK in a room until they come to an agreement (no catering allowed)?

[sr2307]

does anyone really care outside of the u.s

[dubby99]

Originally Posted by sr2307

does anyone really care outside of the u.s

Welcome to 10 tenths sr

If done properly racing (long term) in europe would be a good thing, just take a look at japan or australia regardless of which series, there both really good events and well attended.

[NAC]

Originally Posted by sr2307

does anyone really care outside of the u.s

Welcome sr2307 (that sounds like a serial number)

The answer to your question is yes. Many different countries here with some of the more vocal ones coming from UK, Australia and New Zealand, plus some not even on this planet.

It could also have something to do with who's driving in the series

Enjoy

[indycool]

Indeed, there are more countries represented on this board than any other I've found.

[PharoahChromium]

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