NEW MSA TYRE LIST FOR 2016

[Mike Bell]

We have 1a and 1b tyres, now for 2016 we have 1c as well!

Those with the next edition of the blue book can read from page 196, others who like me haven't received it yet can read via the MSA website.

From what I was told by a competitor who races in a championship that allows 1b Yokos, that tyre (AO48) is now on 1c as not E marked any more. Looking at the DT catalogue (other suppliers are available!) for that tyre, it's suggests that there is still some stock of the E marked version, but only limited supply. The MSA quote EU regulation 1222/2009, and an exemption for cars first registered before 1st Oct 1990.......

Guess it only affects championships using E marked 1b tyres, But who can decipher what it all means please, I can't!

[Lancsbreaker]

Thankfully the CSCC series I run in allows 1C.......so no dramas with the two race old tyres......

[Mike Bell]

Richard, perhaps your current tyres are E marked and comply anyway? Think it is only new manufacture/ stock that is losing the marking...

Just checking, using HSCC Road Sports as an example, regs specify 1a or 1b tyres. So presumably any tyre, such as those from the manufacturer mentioned in my original post, now won't be allowed if new non E marked manufacture.

I guess series / championship regs can be re-written, but don't think that is a five minute job. So anyone racing on list 1a or 1b tyres needs to make sure any new tyres bought are on the lists.....

[JasperClan]

At 70's Roadsports meeting at Silverstone this was discussed and it was agreed that tyres transferred to List 1c would be allowable for 2016 with further discussion before 2017.

As I'd just bought a new set of Yoko A048R I was relieved although I think they were still 'E' marked. Wording in Blue Book is still confusing as Clan is pre 1990 and I read it that I'd still be able to use A048R's even if not 'E' marked. I could be wrong!

Pete Richards

[Simon Hadfield]

All of this is caused by various tyres failing to meet the latest road use homologation criteria and there will probably more. This is a real life issue, nothing to do with motorsport.
I suspect that eventually motorsport will have to rethink the way it approaches what were E marked tyres and the way they are regulated for sporting use

[Mike Bell]

Are you suggesting motorsport isn't real life Simon? Is there more?

Yes, an EEC homologation issue, probably noise level or something. It's already having repercussions in motorsport, but sounds like clubs are already taking action to get over them. Still not sure about the 'Pre 1990' thing, need to do bit more research on that......

[andy97]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Yes, an EEC homologation issue, probably noise level or something.

..

I think it's to do with their wet weather grip performance, or lack of.

[midgetman]

Yes I've always wondered how long the loophole that allowed the List B tyres would last. I used them on my Turbo driving to speed events and they were blooming horrible on the road. They tramlines, there was no grip in the wet or the cold, and the handling of the Monty was bad enough anyway!

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by andy97

I think it's to do with their wet weather grip performance, or lack of.

That would make sense in the case of the Yokos!

Max, OT but can't believe your criticism of the Montego handling! Didn't the suspension owe something to VW Golfs? I had a Maestro when car first came out and seem to remember some reference to the fact......

[Simon Hadfield]

Actually Mike was right, it was about noise. The wet performance cannot be an issue, can it, if I remember correctly the trick tyres that came on the lightweight M3 a few years ago actually came with a wet weather use warning.

[midgetman]

Mike

It may have had some relation to a golf. ....CART! The car had an enormous amount of power but the boot behind the rear wheels was like a pendulum. I greatly preferred my Maestro except it was only a 2.0 litre not a Turbo.

[Mike Bell]

Taking up Simon's point regarding special 'track' tyres that are fitted or can be optioned on some road cars nowadays, these must be E marked to allow this. Big problem however for our old historics would be the aspect ratio, which would probably be 35% or something daft like that. Oh, and at least 19" diameter.....

Does anyone know if it just tyres from one manufacturer that are affected, or are some of the similar Dunlops, Khumos and Toyos also to be removed from 1B?

[MGDavid]

Mike the lists were published a while ago, there's a download link here:
https://www.msauk.org/MSA-issues-2016-Tyre-Lists-1A-C

[Mike Bell]

Thanks David, the answer for AO48 users seems to be to swap to 888s if championship regs allow! Interesting that two similar style tyres either do or don't comply with EEC regs. Maybe down to any manufacturer spending the dosh to get a tyre tested?

Looking at Avon Motorsport's website, it shows the CR6ZZ pre 1990 'exemption' label here- http://www.avonmotorsport.com/sites/...-TW1022-EU.jpg

Starting to make a bit more sense, I think......

[andy97]

I think I'm right in saying that Toyo have redesigned their 888 tyre to comply with the new 1b regs. How it performs compared to the previous version, I don't know.

[Mike Bell]

Perhaps they're quieter! Just what you need in a race car..... That makes it sound as if one or some tyre manufacturers have not bothered to modify there tyres to comply.

I'm now curious as to what makes a tyre 'designed to be fitted only to vehicles registered for the first time before 1st October 1990'.

Construction? Profile?

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by andy97

I think I'm right in saying that Toyo have redesigned their 888 tyre to comply with the new 1b regs. How it performs compared to the previous version, I don't know.

I think 888s are now amazingly good in the rain. We took a brand new set of them to the RoR at Anglesey last month, along with a set of Kumho KU39s for wets. As Saturday was only showery we started on the 888s; the rules didn't permit any changes overnight so we were apprehensive when Sunday's rain turned into a Biblical downpour. However we weren't losing places and when I did the sums I realised we could lose time overall by stopping to change them so left them on for the remaining 5 hours.
The rain was that bad it caused the race to be red-flagged an hour early - but the tyres were fine.

[andy97]

I think that this is the consultation paper that led to the new rules

http://webarchive.nationalarchives.g...onpaper?page=4

[Mike Bell]

Interesting find, Andy. Mentions the exemption for 'tyres intended only for pre-1990 vehicles'! No definition though....