Button to stay

[Tucky]

If anything it's going to be based more on Button since he's had input on next year's car whereas Alonso hasn't.

[chillibowl]

it depends on how soon they knew Alonso was coming over and mid season, based on the public criticisms he received from Ron, it didnt sound like Button was going to be retained at all.

given that if Button left and stayed in F1 he would have gone to a team with a rival engine so there is the possibility that they didnt let him near the 2015 stuff at all. thats just speculation on my part of course

in all likelihood though i would imagine the priority rested in matching the chassis to the new engine as opposed to matching to any one driver.

[wolfhound]

I would say the chassis will be more to Button's taste as he has been there for a number of seasons and his likes will be in the minds of the design team even without them thinking about it.

[Biscuits In A Red Bull]

Thought I'd put my opinion on it.

The most genuine bloke in F1 partners the most devious man in recent years at a team headed by a man who wants to recover lost glory as soon as is possible - too soon.

Will Button's niceness succumb to Alonso's incredible fearlessness?

If Button can retain his form from the end of 2014, there's no doubting Alonso will have trouble keeping JB behind him. With the right car a championship 1-2, in either order, is possible.

I'm prepared for Alonso to wipe the floor with JB (although I doubt it will happen) but am also prepared for the opposite. JB is vastly underrated as a driver - he just does not make mistakes and a by far the best driver in the rain. His drive at Suzuka 2014 was nothing short of heroic, as was 2012 Brazil, 2011 Canada, etc, so for people to say it is an uninspiring choice is ludicrous. Yes KM may have a better future but that is the future not the present. It also makes sense from a marketing point of view as JB has worked with both for many years in the past and could act as a very important bridge this season.

Alonso and Hamilton have been regarded as the best 2 drivers on the grid for the last few years. JB outscored Hamilton over 3 years together (and it happened, I don't care how, it happened, in the same way Hamilton outscored Alonso as a rookie, and that Hulkenberg led 35 laps at Sao Paolo in 2012. It happened). He's not going to be written off easily.

Plus, he cares, unlike Kimi

2015 will be a fun one...

[wnut]

Originally Posted by bella

is it not a little bit too far down the design process to be defining how the car is going to handle when that can be based on decisions that happen very early on?

Correct Bella, remember the problems Schumacher had with the Merc's handling when he arrived at the team, and they just couldn't change it for the first year. I don't think they ever got the balance Schumacher liked because of the rules they are stuck with, unresponsive understeering boat.

[Paradise City]

I don't think Alonso is very devious. I think he's clumsy and has a tendency to act out impulsively at critical moments out of the car. Whenever he tries to play politics he bungles it. He had high ideas about being picked up by Merc and RBR. As it was, he's lucky to be at Mclaren at all. He could've well been sitting out next year if circumstances had of been just a little different - and even landing at Mclaren he still could wind up with mud on his face. There's no doubting the man's high talent but his career has been badly marred by off-track misjudgements of various sorts.

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by Paradise City

I don't think Alonso is very devious. I think he's clumsy and has a tendency to act out impulsively at critical moments out of the car. Whenever he tries to play politics he bungles it. He had high ideas about being picked up by Merc and RBR. As it was, he's lucky to be at Mclaren at all. He could've well been sitting out next year if circumstances had of been just a little different - and even landing at Mclaren he still could wind up with mud on his face. There's no doubting the man's high talent but his career has been badly marred by off-track misjudgements of various sorts.

Does Briatore still manage him?
He managed Webber during his stint at Red Bull and had done so since his Minardi days. Briatore managed them both so he's probably done well out it financially too, not that the man actually needs a lot.....

[Paradise City]

Originally Posted by Teretonga

Does Briatore still manage him?
He managed Webber during his stint at Red Bull and had done so since his Minardi days. Briatore managed them both so he's probably done well out it financially too, not that the man actually needs a lot.....

I don't know if he's still formally his manager but he has acted as Alonso's intermediary this year.

[bella]

alonso has someone else too, wasn't there a load of flapping earlier in the year because alonso's manager was seen somewhere (at red bull in the paddock?), when in fact he's also carlos sainz jnr's manager too? or am i thinking of someone else?

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by wnut

Correct Bella, remember the problems Schumacher had with the Merc's handling when he arrived at the team, and they just couldn't change it for the first year. I don't think they ever got the balance Schumacher liked because of the rules they are stuck with, unresponsive understeering boat.

I'm not sure Alonso will have many problems even if the car isn't bespoke for him.

He's more than capable of finding time in any car. He will find a set ip that works for him.

[m355y]

I dont think many people in the paddock would argue againt the view that Alonso can be a pain in the arse. In 05, when he was on the verge of winning the championship and flying high, he launched an attack on the team saying that they hadn't supported him etc, which Pat Symonds said took the gloss off their title massively. I think in a respect that's even worse than 2007 albeit lesser known. He's not a nice guy. He rubs people up the wrong way, he's massively egotistical (even for an F1 driver) and not a team player. He gets hired because despite this, he's bloody brilliant. And that intensity is probably a big part of his success.

I think Button will run him close, but expect Fernando to beat him, being honest.

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by m355y

I dont think many people in the paddock would argue againt the view that Alonso can be a pain in the arse. In 05, when he was on the verge of winning the championship and flying high, he launched an attack on the team saying that they hadn't supported him etc, which Pat Symonds said took the gloss off their title massively. I think in a respect that's even worse than 2007 albeit lesser known. He's not a nice guy. He rubs people up the wrong way, he's massively egotistical (even for an F1 driver) and not a team player. He gets hired because despite this, he's bloody brilliant. And that intensity is probably a big part of his success.

I think Button will run him close, but expect Fernando to beat him, being honest.

I'm not doubting the accuracy of what you are saying but I wonder if we could see a few good podium results and an occasional win, but I'd be amused if it was Button who did the winning.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by m355y

I dont think many people in the paddock would argue againt the view that Alonso can be a pain in the arse. In 05, when he was on the verge of winning the championship and flying high, he launched an attack on the team saying that they hadn't supported him etc, which Pat Symonds said took the gloss off their title massively. I think in a respect that's even worse than 2007 albeit lesser known. He's not a nice guy. He rubs people up the wrong way, he's massively egotistical (even for an F1 driver) and not a team player. He gets hired because despite this, he's bloody brilliant. And that intensity is probably a big part of his success.

I think Button will run him close, but expect Fernando to beat him, being honest.

Agreed, I would not employ Alonso as a driver due to his personality faults!

Go Jenson!

[p-matt]

Alonso's personality issues definitely faded after his year at McLaren when he grew up a bit. And both Renault and McLaren, whom he had handbag moments with, welcomed him back with open arms. He can't be that toxic personality wise

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by p-matt

Alonso's personality issues definitely faded after his year at McLaren when he grew up a bit. And both Renault and McLaren, whom he had handbag moments with, welcomed him back with open arms. He can't be that toxic personality wise

Absolutely... and based on what he's done in those Ferrari you would just have to sign him if there was any chance at all wouldn't you?

Merc never said they don't want him, with their package advantage they just didn't need him!

Red bull make their own strange decisions on drivers as we know. I think Horner wod get found out quite quickly with Alonso in board as well.

[Paradise City]

If things get political and the storm moves within his proximity, he'll have problems handling that. He never really renounced that trait. The Ferrari exit bears that out - even though bailing on them was ultimately smart, it was all still quite messy.

If his team gives him a supportive space though; he'll deliver.

[JeremySmith]

Originally Posted by chunterer

Red bull make their own strange decisions on drivers as we know. I think Horner wod get found out quite quickly with Alonso in board as well.

This is an interesting statement Chunty, care to elaborate ?

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

This is an interesting statement Chunty, care to elaborate ?

Well we all know about the hiring and firing of talent all the way to F1. Facts are that Vettel, Ricciardo have bern successful but other's have been cast aside and unless they have been lucky enough to find alternative backing haven't been able to 'get their own back' by proving them wrong in another team...

Re Horner: isn't he just a spokesman for the team in reality? What real authority does he actually have?

An Alonso, Hamilton or Raikkonen (any top driver who is outside the Red Bull straitjacket) would cause him significant headaches that I'm not convinced he's equipped to deal with which is why none of them have been signed in recent years.

I accept that some will scoff at some of this but to me it's obvious...

[John Turner]

Originally Posted by wnut

Agreed, I would not employ Alonso as a driver due to his personality faults!

Go Jenson!

Well, we all have personality faults, I guess, and in Alonso's case can't help feeling that has been exaggerated by the British press. Not sure that Alonso's are any worse than some of the great racers in the past, and better than some. I am no expert but if I was asked to select two current drivers to make up an F1 team, I'd struggle not to pick these two!