A little bir concerned...

Snips1 · 1 Mar 2005, 10:16 (Ref:1238824)

Am I the only one who is little bit concerned about the future of the IRL??

Helio yesterday on wind tunnel said that there will be more street races next year and that they will replace some of the excisting tracks.

Plus the fact that all 3 engine mafufactures could be gone within 2 years.....

Kicking-back · 1 Mar 2005, 11:36 (Ref:1238914)

Sounds like they're moving closer to getting back together with ChampCar.

enemy-ace · 1 Mar 2005, 12:15 (Ref:1238957)

While it could be possible, I imagine Helio is only speculating. I doubt he is on the need to know list.

mac · 1 Mar 2005, 21:37 (Ref:1239428)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

Sounds like they're moving closer to getting back together with ChampCar.

God, we can only hope!!!!!!!!!

GP Racer · 1 Mar 2005, 21:51 (Ref:1239439)

Quote:

Originally Posted by enemy-ace

While it could be possible, I imagine Helio is only speculating. I doubt he is on the need to know list.

And he pretty much said that to.

Snips, I think we're all concerned about the future of the IRL, but that comes with the territory I think. Has there been any years since its existence, where there wasn't something to worry about? I don't think so. Every year there are people that scream the sky is falling on the IRL, but we're still here, and not likely to go away anytime soon.

I will say though, that I don't like some of the changes I see going on here.

1 - Two or three road/street races are OK, to change things up, but add anymore and we will alienate the IRL fanbase. This series is about the ovals, thats why we watch.

2 - Will American fans lose interest if there are to many foreign drivers against to few American drivers, as they did with CART? You bet they will.

3 - The IRL is not ready for Mexican/Canadian races. They still have alot of work to do here at home growing this series. NASCAR waited until this market was saturated before they took the leap.

4 - Manufacturers now have to much influence on League matters, and if we lose both Toyota and Honda, it may become a blessing in the long term. If we want to grow this series, stock block is the way to go.

trow · 1 Mar 2005, 23:33 (Ref:1239552)

We'll know in May where it's headed, or perhaps, before that.

dubby99 · 2 Mar 2005, 00:00 (Ref:1239571)

IMHO we can have to seperate OW series in north america.

The IRL should be an all oval based series(like it once was) and CC can be a road and street based series, so that way both series will be strong in there own markets.

Be honest guys IRL going to st pete and other road courses does no good for OW racing in NA IMHO.

A quote from GP racer:

The IRL is not ready for Mexican/Canadian races. They still have alot of work to do here at home growing this series. NASCAR waited until this market was saturated before they took the leap.

I don't really think they should ever go there because CC put in a big effort to make those races succesfull so the IRL going there would IMHO would dilute the fan base the same way it has in North America(not putting all the blame on the IRL).

BootsOntheSide · 2 Mar 2005, 12:22 (Ref:1239988)

While there are 2 championships it'd be pointless for the IRL to consider Mexico or Canada, as both are such strong ChampCar markets with an extreme of fan loyalty that way. Mexico has the Busch race this year and F1 next year to compete with as well.

I'd agree with everything GP Racer says - history seems to be repeating itself, which is frustrating for an onlooker like myself.

Snips1 · 2 Mar 2005, 13:15 (Ref:1240030)

It's fine with me if they add 3 more road courses, Long Beach being one of them.

Just as long as they don't replace these new tracks with ovals, 20 races, 14 ovals 6 road/street races are fine with me.

But I'm more concerned with T & H and the rising cost etc etc....

But time well tell I'm an IRL fan, but most of all I just want to see one strong OW series, whether that will be CART or IRL is irrelevant to me.

Good luck Sam!!!!

BootsOntheSide · 2 Mar 2005, 14:19 (Ref:1240097)

20 races might be too expensive a schedule though, especially if the worst-case scenario of Honda and/or Toyota leaving happens. I'd agree with GP Racer agreeing with Eddie, that 3-4 should be the non-oval maximum while there are 2 championships.

GP Racer · 2 Mar 2005, 21:27 (Ref:1240484)

Thanks Boots, we're on the same sheet of music here.

Snips, why would you want the IRL to become what CART was? They went out-of-business! We watch this series because we like oval racing, period. Isn't that what drew you in? There are plenty of road racing series out there you can watch, but what the IRL does is unique, and it should stay that way. I don't mind two road races a season like NASCAR has, or like the old CART, and USAC had. They are/were very successful with that formula. Add to many road/street parades, with to many foreign drivers, in foreign countries, and the IRL will be doomed here, just like CART.

TG's original vision was spot on, but we're beginning to drift into dangerous waters...

Snips1 · 2 Mar 2005, 21:41 (Ref:1240506)

Well that's correct, ovals are cool and produce GREAT racing!!

But in today's IRL most drivers and teams come from road racing background, therefore I think it would be a good idea to have some road courses, and you don't say no to LB anyway, there is a lot of money there...

IRL officials have always said around 5-6 road courses/street, and 14 ovals I suspect...

I don't mind adding 1-2 more road courses to the schedule, as long as they don't replace an excisting oval... (or any othe for that matter)

But so far, I haven't heard any driver or team owner (except Foyt, but who really cares??) about IndyCar and MIPS going road/steet racing this year, not even from short trackers like Drake, Chesson, Gregg and Carpente all have been very optimistic.

GP Racer · 2 Mar 2005, 22:05 (Ref:1240533)

Yes, the drivers may want to do it, but we're not here to please the drivers, there here to please us, and the vast majority of IRL fans want to see open wheel cars racing on ovals.

I don't recall IRL officials ever saying that they wanted 5 or 6 road races. As a matter of fact, many will argue that the original vision never included any road racing.

St. Petersburg is a much better street course than LB, and if done right, it has the potential to become what LB is to OWRS. One street race is quite enough IMO...

BootsOntheSide · 2 Mar 2005, 22:48 (Ref:1240575)

We'll have a better idea of popularity once this year's 3 races have happened. If those races are dull, or poorky-attended, or produce a lot of criticism from observers or drivers, things might need a rethink, perhaps on a technical level first.

macdaddy · 2 Mar 2005, 22:51 (Ref:1240577)

Quote:

GP Racer:

we're not here to please the drivers.

Spot-on.

Snrub · 3 Mar 2005, 00:31 (Ref:1240632)

Darn, I didn't realize Helio was on wind tunnel. Could you guys elaborate a bit on what he said, etc?

The IRL is actually not doing that badly in building US races, something CC has had a lot of trouble with and I'm convinced there is are enough people interested in motorsports for someone other than Nascar to be successful in the US.

Losing the manufacturers may be a real kick in the pants, but if the series builds enough that enough non-manufacturer funding can be found in the next couple of years it may indeed be the best course.

GP Racer · 3 Mar 2005, 00:52 (Ref:1240647)

Helio is a great interview, and a good ambassador for the IRL. Always happy, and always smiling. He did say he was looking forward to road racing and was more than pleased with the Dallara's performance on them. He also said the Toyota does seem down on power, but they are working hard on it. He said that AGR will be very tough once again, along with Rahal, Ganassi, and Fernadez. He said the competition will be very close with many cars in position to win races. That was the gist of it, nothing to earth shattering that I can remember.

Like I said in another thread, the IRL has a great product, and they are making all the right moves to market and get it out there in full view of the public, so I'm with you Snrub, there has to be some room for somebody else besides NASCAR, and I think (my negative ramblings aside) that it can be the IRL...

trow · 3 Mar 2005, 01:05 (Ref:1240657)

What courses provide the best racing? I've been as strong an IRL fan as anyone I know of, but some races on Ovals suck. JMHO. Some races on road courses are exciting to watch, like Laguna Seca, and Elkhart Lake.

What matters to sponsors is that they get into certain markets. What matters most to the series is that they make their sponsors happy. What matters most to fans is that the races are exciting to watch in those markets. One big economic circle.

Maybe the IRL will figure it out, and maybe they won't?!?!?!

Snips1 · 3 Mar 2005, 16:54 (Ref:1241315)

A VERY good article on this subject written by Jeff Olsen...

http://www.speedtv.com/commentary/15454/

You should read it....

This man is right....

jock25 · 3 Mar 2005, 20:28 (Ref:1241573)

Quote from Jeff Olsen article "This Silence Isn't Golden":

"Nobody is clearly wrong and nobody is clearly right in this standoff"

Probably not the best article to quote on a discussion forum but... Snips 1 is correct - it is pretty much spot on.

Both series' must combine to one old style Indy series with ovals and road/street circuits. The IRL can't survive as either all-oval (because oval means NASCAR to the masses whether we like it or not) or combined (because it clashes with the hardcore CCWS fanbase). IMO (they a combined IRL/CCWS organisation) would need to strike a balance between manufacturer involvement and privateer-only. Let's all be honest, the presence of a big name manufacturer or three get us all excited, even if we know it will inevitably lead to disaster.

On the issue of US drivers - it is not quantity that is the issue but quality - the IRL would have received much greater coverage this season alone if Rice had won the championship as well as the 500 (especially if he had done it in the same style as Kanaan). As long as US fans have a competitive driver to cheer on I don't think a relatively high number of non-US drivers would matter.

N I Tram · 4 Mar 2005, 13:35 (Ref:1242349)

Trow, whereas some races on ovals suck, there aren't any oval tracks which are inherently incapable of producing exciting races with the right regulations. Some of the mooted street circuits are a differnet matter, completely ill-suited to any kind of single-seater. St Pete's is one of the best, and the sheer commercial potential of Long Beach makes it a good catch, but otherwise leave it at that. A few road courses are good as well - any merged series should have 8-10 of those along with 8 or so ovals and those 2 streets.

GP Racer · 4 Mar 2005, 23:28 (Ref:1242750)

Thats my biggest problem with a merger, to many road courses.

I like road course racing, but there are plenty of series that already do that, and if your a real IRL fan, why would you want your series to go to more road courses than ovals? Whats in it for us? Four is the max that I want to see. Thats the way the old USAC did it, back in their hayday, and the almost all oval theme certainly works for NASCAR.

On the driver issue, I think quantity does matter. Having only one competitive American driver will not turn on the masses here...

Jordi · 5 Mar 2005, 00:17 (Ref:1242786)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GP Racer

, and if your a real IRL fan,

Tee hee.. that's the quid, I'm not...

The thing is, I loved what CART provided 1996-2001, eg. around 7 or 8 ovals, 6 or 7 road courses and 4 or 5 street tracks. And my problem now is that neither Champ Cars nor IndyCar is offering this.

trow · 5 Mar 2005, 04:11 (Ref:1242885)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordi

Tee hee.. that's the quid, I'm not...

The thing is, I loved what CART provided 1996-2001, eg. around 7 or 8 ovals, 6 or 7 road courses and 4 or 5 street tracks. And my problem now is that neither Champ Cars nor IndyCar is offering this.

Why didn't that schedule work for CART 1996-2001?

Teretonga · 5 Mar 2005, 05:16 (Ref:1242945)

It did. It wasn't the schedule that was the problem...

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
FIA concerned with dearth of passing?	paul-collins	Formula One	40	4 Sep 2002 12:42
Manufacturers concerned about future WRC budgets	SJ Spode	Rallying & Rallycross	8	10 Jul 2002 11:11