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14 Sep 2004, 08:20 (Ref:1096007) | #76 | ||
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TGF = That German Fellow
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Ten reasons why I procrastinate: 1) |
14 Sep 2004, 08:57 (Ref:1096034) | #77 | ||
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Do away with gravel traps and just dig a big pit around the track edges,if you spin off and fall into the pit your out!.
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14 Sep 2004, 10:17 (Ref:1096122) | #78 | |
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Great idea! They could fill the run-off pits with custard or something, for comedy value and humiliation.
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14 Sep 2004, 12:53 (Ref:1096291) | #79 | ||
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I haven't read much of this thread, but a precedent was set when TGF was push-started at the Nurburgring in what was essentially the same sort of position Alonso was in on Sunday. Therefore, Alonso should have received a push-start as well.
However, what the FIA need to do is clarify the rules. Their stupid rule-book is full of rules that are open to all different sorts of interpretation. |
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Sunderland Til I Die! |
14 Sep 2004, 13:13 (Ref:1096315) | #80 | ||
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14 Sep 2004, 14:29 (Ref:1096367) | #81 | ||
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14 Sep 2004, 15:07 (Ref:1096389) | #82 | |||
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Oh yes, and it is gravel (we all know that) not sand. This stuff is hard to walk in let alone push in. In both cases mentioned here I am now convinced the Marhsals did the right thing. In the 2003 incident it was the race stewards that didn't have the 'balls' to enforce their own rules that was the problem. (I think) :P |
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14 Sep 2004, 16:03 (Ref:1096431) | #83 | |||
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14 Sep 2004, 18:03 (Ref:1096532) | #84 | ||
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err... why are you calling Alonso "sour-brains"? Did he say it wasn't fair that TGF got a push and he didnt? It was just pure frustration on his part. and for goodness sake, no one is saying it wasn;t fair TGF got a push and ALonso didn't, I couldnt care less for that matter, what i care about is the clarification of the rules... i.e. if you get beached, turn off the engine, get out, go home, and let the marshalls clear your car. Your constant sensitivity and whining about how other members of this board are targeting Ferrari and TGF is really getting annoying...you're just getting riled up all for nothing... |
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14 Sep 2004, 18:15 (Ref:1096541) | #85 | ||
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Let me clear up something.... at the beginning i wasnt implying that the marshalls are MS supporters or such...
all i said was situation was the same.. car beached,engine running... MS recieved a push.. Alonso didnt... and did he deserved to get one under the circumstances My personal opinion is that in light of what happened in 2003 Alonso should have recieved a push start... they could have allowed him to continue and then the stewards could have Disqualified Alonso if there was something wrong with the incident (ie if he actually was not in a dangerous position) Like the above poster id like the Fia to be consistent in their rules and be clear... but then this is the Fia |
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14 Sep 2004, 18:30 (Ref:1096552) | #86 | |||
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Ten reasons why I procrastinate: 1) |
14 Sep 2004, 19:59 (Ref:1096670) | #87 | ||
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should alonso have received apush start
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14 Sep 2004, 20:03 (Ref:1096676) | #88 | |
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Turgid Jamaican Lavatory
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14 Sep 2004, 20:06 (Ref:1096678) | #89 | ||
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I doubt dispensing of TGF can just be done. People will more than likely continue to use it anyway.
It isn't THAT hard to explain it. Alternately: when you registered with the site, why not just have a page that comes up telling you what TGF stands for? Hell all mighty.....craziness. |
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"The world is my country, and science is my religion." - Christian Huygens: 17th century Dutch astronomer. |
14 Sep 2004, 20:07 (Ref:1096679) | #90 | ||
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14 Sep 2004, 23:35 (Ref:1096857) | #91 | |||
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a) for the marshals, and only then b) for the drivers We'll clear them, couldn't care less whether they're DQ or not afterwards. As long as they're out of my way and I'm not putting myself at risk, I'm happy! |
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15 Sep 2004, 01:37 (Ref:1096902) | #92 | ||
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F40-LM..sensitivity is good aint it? Of course one whines after reading posts and posts of threads with similar agenda..but if i'm wanna whine, i won't
A trace back to post-Nurburgring and the "general" consensus then, in a clearly less complicated situation, was that it isn't fair that MS recieve a push from the marshals. Now, in a more tricky and difficult situation, Alonso is cheated by a marshal who refuses to push, and the marshal recieves a earful for doing his job. The excuse given is that "Michael sets an example". But it's contradictory that if both situations are similar, how Alonso SHOULD be pushed but MS shouldn't (back then). To make matters more laughable, Alonso is clearly in a more difficult position than MS. I'm no marshal, but i do see a difference in situation which i had explained in my first few replies.Subsequently, informed people have come up with very good explaination about the "difference" of situation, and why Alonso shouldn't be pushed. I'm quite neutral about whether or not Alonso is back on track or not. Ferrari isn't going to be affected. And while i think it is a PITY that Alonso, after performing quite brilliantly in the race, couldnt bring some points home (as i've stated in earlier replies), my opinion is that it is dangerous/difficult to push Alonso from that position. As for Alonso "sour-brain", yes, you've said it too, he's frustrated..and hence he made senseless remarks out of anger. That's why i suggest a "washing". clear his mind before he really speak. Check the video tapes, think about it before making allegations. It isn't fair for Ferrari, and even less so for the marshal. You realise in subsequent interviews, he's less critical. |
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Alonso: "McLaren and Williams are also great racing teams, but Ferrari is the biggest one that you can go to." |
15 Sep 2004, 03:19 (Ref:1096935) | #93 | ||
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I would question whether marshalls should be pushing anyone while the race is only under yellows. If one driver has spum off then surely another may, and as stated before, it is doubtful any slowing down occurs...
And on topic, I think if the car is able to continue after being removed from the gravel then it should do so - few enough cars finish races as it is, and the time spent in the gravel is enough "penalty" imho! |
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15 Sep 2004, 04:39 (Ref:1096950) | #94 | ||
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I too would just like a clarification of rules from next season onwards, just like the introduction of TC and such, just for the sake of removing all these controversy and unnecessary arguments.
Anyway, IF the marshal did it out of favouritism, i'd be sorely disappointed with his professionalism. But right now, i'm just looking at the incident in itself. |
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Alonso: "McLaren and Williams are also great racing teams, but Ferrari is the biggest one that you can go to." |
15 Sep 2004, 09:35 (Ref:1097066) | #95 | |
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I don't see what needs to be clarified - if it is safe to do so Marshalls will push a car out of a dangerous position. It wasn't safe - they didn't push. End of. Not unclear. Not inconsistent. Not difficult to understand.
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15 Sep 2004, 11:50 (Ref:1097168) | #96 | ||
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I think we can all agree that the rules say that Alonso could have legally got a push, and had the marshals been able to they should have. But from a marshals point of view it didn't look physically possible to get him out, so what were they supposed to do? Call for back up and spend half an hour pushing? Wouldn't have helped Alonso.
There's no confusion about the rule, just a case of whether the conditions allow it to be executed, and in this case they didn't. Fair enough if you don't agree with the rule, but don't have ago at the marshals just so you can bash TGF. How many of you have actually pushed a car out of a gravel trap on a live circuit? |
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15 Sep 2004, 13:27 (Ref:1097274) | #97 | |
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I for one am not in favour of pushing the car back out in any case, once it's beached it's beached. That's why i believe TGF should not have been pushed back into the race, and hence Alsonso as well. It's quite ridiculous that you can receive outside help to get your car back onto the track, this isnt motoGP or WRC, in both cases the driver(navigator for WRC) or rider can do it and therefore is counted, but in single-seaters like F1 it's just not right - it's not by your own effort you can get back onto the track and rejoin.
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16 Sep 2004, 06:46 (Ref:1097883) | #98 | ||
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Where I come from we call TGF, GCB
DKGandBH |
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16 Sep 2004, 08:04 (Ref:1097925) | #99 | ||
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I think that it was wrong not to push him back on the track. They won't touch the car to get him out of a bad position when all that is needed is a nudge, but they will move the tractor and a lot of crew to get him out. They were probably in more danger doing that!
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16 Sep 2004, 08:19 (Ref:1097938) | #100 | ||
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