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30 Jun 2019, 19:43 (Ref:3915178) | #76 | |
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At least the stewards are consistently inconsistent.
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30 Jun 2019, 20:08 (Ref:3915193) | #77 | ||
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I was just hypothesizing why people don’t take you seriously. Just saying that perhaps some of this is not down to the opinion about this race incident.
Don’t worry cupcake it’s not really a problem. It’s just a bit of fun. |
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30 Jun 2019, 20:10 (Ref:3915194) | #78 | ||
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30 Jun 2019, 20:14 (Ref:3915195) | #79 | ||
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30 Jun 2019, 20:20 (Ref:3915197) | #80 | |
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I don't know what reveals the bias for Max more - this decision or racing F1 cars at bloody Zanndvoort!!
I understand he his the heir apparent. I understand that the Dutch are... naively obsessive... but come on. You gotta give room. You can't just run drivers off the track because yours engine hasn't got the beans |
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30 Jun 2019, 20:39 (Ref:3915206) | #81 | ||
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Better to be sensational, jingoistic and exaggerative where you can give a solid judgement even if you only saw the incident on the radio! |
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30 Jun 2019, 20:44 (Ref:3915207) | #82 | |
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30 Jun 2019, 20:53 (Ref:3915213) | #83 | |||
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Charles could only go wider by driving off the track (he did anyway). Perhaps if he had run even further off track he could have avoided the contact, maintained momentum and stayed ahead. but then there would have been a large faction saying that he gained an advantage (ie didn't lose a place) by going outside of track limits. It seems to be an impossible conundrum. At the root of the problem is the issue of track limits. Drivers have been going further and further beyond them for years. And as drivers have gone off track more and more, the circuits have been modified to make that easier, safer and less damaging. So the drivers do it even more. The only solution I can see is a rigorous 100% enforcement of track limits rules. You can't be a little bit pregnant and you can't be a little bit off-track. |
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30 Jun 2019, 20:57 (Ref:3915218) | #84 | ||
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Well I have raced, and you appear to be wilfully missing the point. You must always allow your opponent room to stay on the track. MV's line of entry into the corner was dangerously wide in the circumstances. He's lucky to have got away with it.
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30 Jun 2019, 21:07 (Ref:3915222) | #85 | ||
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If it had ended in a pile of carbon fibre then he couldn’t have complained. But it didn’t and he won.
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30 Jun 2019, 21:54 (Ref:3915231) | #86 | |
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Pass wasn't ideal, but I agree this was hard racing.
My wife was asking a good question that I didn't have a ready answer for. Why did giants fall today? Mercedes didn't perform well, and while drivers were on different tire strategies, Verstappen was able to chase down and pass both Mercedes and Ferrari. He, Red Bull and Honda seemed pretty racy today. Richard |
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30 Jun 2019, 22:02 (Ref:3915233) | #87 | ||
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I watched it at the time and I've seen it again on the C4 highlights and though Leclerc might have been a little hard done by, I thought it was a racing incident and didn't warrant a penalty. I think a bit of inexperience came into play on Leclerc's part.
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30 Jun 2019, 23:19 (Ref:3915242) | #88 | ||
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Trapeze, unfortunately, having the perception that the race results are decided from "oh high", as opposed to on the track, due to all those penalties, is an untenable scenario.
Short of at least ripping out a strip of the paving right next to the track and putting grass or something back in there to create a default time penalty, well, they've painted themselves into this box, and I really don't feel sorry for them having created their own officiating headache/nightmare at this point. Richard, as for giants falling, over in sportscars, Mazda finally slew the standing giants of Cadillac and Acura, so I'm feeling pretty good about today's racing results. |
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30 Jun 2019, 23:34 (Ref:3915244) | #89 | ||
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Here in Australia we don't get the races live anymore except on Fox (which I don't have) so I won't see any of it until the "highlights" show airs tonight - so nothing from me on the Lecl/Vers meeting.
Once the grid was set after qualifying, I had a sneaking suspicion that the 2 of them on the front row could lead to drama on the first lap - the Vers problem at the start merely delayed the meeting until later in the race and it sounds like it really wasn't that big a deal when it arrived in any case. |
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30 Jun 2019, 23:49 (Ref:3915246) | #90 | ||
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Clearly, the rules don't count if you drive a Red Bull car at the Red Bull ring.
Rather fascinating grand prix. Wrong winner. Bad stewarding if same offenses are not punished consistently. Someone who pushes another car wide and off track should be punished all the time or not at all, regardless if it is a front running car, a fight for 1st or a battle all the way at the back. Last edited by gert; 1 Jul 2019 at 00:04. |
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1 Jul 2019, 00:09 (Ref:3915249) | #91 | ||
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When I saw them bang wheels, it reminded me of Arnoux and Villeneuve at Dijon. If one of them had gone off, it would have been regarded as a racing incident due to hard racing. Fortunately, they didn't have all these penalties back then that plague F1.
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1 Jul 2019, 00:15 (Ref:3915250) | #92 | |||
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But the worst thing is the inconsistency in all those penalties. If you throw a penalty if situation x occurs, then do it every time or never. |
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1 Jul 2019, 00:27 (Ref:3915252) | #93 | |||
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How does FI appoint the race stewards? Are they chosen from a pool, or is it more random than that? |
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"If you're not winning you're not trying." Colin Chapman. |
1 Jul 2019, 09:17 (Ref:3915291) | #94 | |
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Good race, nice to see it not decided by stewards, although they are probably in a tricky situation after Canada. Damned if they do, damned if they don't. Just nice to see they can let minor things go though
The Max/Charles battle was hard, but fair. Max certainly needed to muscle past Charles having failed to get past him first time. It's good to see RBR winning again and giving Honda their first victory since 2006. Reward for all their hard work. Charles will surely win one day. Just shows Merc can be beaten too Great drive by Norris. He's proving what a star he is already. Also good to see Giovinazzi score his first points in F1, great race by both Alfas. Gasly looked average today, he took way too long to get past Kimi, then finished a lap down on his team mate. Kyvat for all his faults did manage to beat the Honey Badger at times when they were team mates at RBR and when you consider that Ricciardo and Verstappen were very closely matched that says something. Gasly has so not looked like doing that to Max |
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1 Jul 2019, 09:18 (Ref:3915293) | #95 | |
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It looks like they dig a deep hole in the infield, string some hazard tape around it, and come back in the morning and see who fell in during the night, these poor sighted and lost individuals are made stewards for the event.
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1 Jul 2019, 10:08 (Ref:3915299) | #96 | ||
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"If you're not winning you're not trying." Colin Chapman. |
1 Jul 2019, 11:21 (Ref:3915307) | #97 | |||
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I love wnut's version much more than what I believe to be the real deal. I think that the local ASN at each race select their own group of individuals to the stewards' position, and in addition, the FIA appoint an ex-driver from their own worldwide pool (e.g.Mansell) to sit with the other stewards. |
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1 Jul 2019, 13:33 (Ref:3915331) | #98 | ||||
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Quote:
Quote:
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1 Jul 2019, 14:16 (Ref:3915339) | #99 | ||
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Canada 2019:
Strict interpretation of the rules on a borderline case of unsafe re-joining. Forum commentary decries rigid application of rules and calls for some discretion and common sense to be allowed in the interests of racing. Stewards are insulted for being heavy-handed. Austria 2019: Stewards use discretion to allow a borderline pass to stand. Forum commentary decries inconsistent application of rules and calls for clarity and certainty. Stewards are insulted for doing exactly what it was argued they should have done in Canada. |
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1 Jul 2019, 14:23 (Ref:3915341) | #100 | ||
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Obviously, I don't believe that that's the case, but it's a good demonstration of why we shouldn't assume they're improving. Especially since it took 3 hours to decide who won a race based on an on-track incident. |
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